Theory: Bullet drop

[NapalmEnima]

IIRC, the devs have mentioned that bullets will drop a la the PS1 wall turrets. This dash of added realism is great.

(No kids. Real Life Bullets do not travel in a straight line. If it has mass, it it affected by gravity. Period. Fucking. Dot.)

However, I suspect the Vanu-specific weapons will be free of such petty constraints. Gravity? Bah... a minor inconvenience.

The tank weapons already demonstrated this in PS1. The VS came out on the bottom of the DPS list on that one, but VS tanks' main gun makes for decent AA, so I'm certainly not complaining.

Pretty much the opposite of the man-portable AV weapons. I suspect this was not a coincidence. The lancer's DPS is king, but it's pretty much awful at AA. It's amazing what that little charge time at the beginning does to your aim.

[Ridill]

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

IIRC, the devs have mentioned that bullets will drop a la the PS1 wall turrets. This dash of added realism is great.

(No kids. Real Life Bullets do not travel in a straight line. If it has mass, it it affected by gravity. Period. Fucking. Dot.)

However, I suspect the Vanu-specific weapons will be free of such petty constraints. Gravity? Bah... a minor inconvenience.

No kids. Light does not travel in a straight line. It is affected by the curvature of space and time. Ever heard of Einstein??? Period. Fucking. Dot.

[NapalmEnima]

Originally Posted by Ridill

No kids. Light does not travel in a straight line. It is affected by the curvature of space and time. Ever heard of Einstein??? Period. Fucking. Dot.

Who said anything about light, Luddite? The weaponry of the Vanu are far beyond your ken.

PS: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to measure the deflection caused by gravity across the effective range using a micrometer.

Oh hell, lets do some math.
1) The speed of light is 3,000,000 miles per second (give or take). Three Million miles per second.

2) The effective range of weaponry in PS2 is likely to be similar to PS1. Lets assume 200 yards.

So it takes light... 3.8 x 10-8 seconds to travel that far.

At 32ft/sec/sec (also ass-u-me-ing that gravity on Auraxis is similar to Earth's):
Light will drop...
1.22 x 10-6 feet
or
0.014... THOUSANDTHS of an inch. (and that number's way too big, it assumes a constant velocity of 32 feet per second, which would clearly not be the case. It takes a full second to reach 32 ft/sec. Light will have only had 3.8 x 10-8 (0.000000038 seconds) to fall. Sadly, I don't recall that particular equation from physics class All Those Years Ago.)

Nope, can't measure that with a micrometer. Micrometers are capable of measuring 1/1000 of an inch. You'd need a device that was over 60 times more accurate to measure 1/60,000 of an inch.

PPS: I'm pretty sure you were kidding. Sadly your post lacked humor and needed to be curb-stomped.


PPPS: Unless PS2's engagement range is Vastly Expanded, Real World bullet drop won't matter all that much either.

A modern assault rifle could reasonably expect a muzzle velocity in excess of 2000ft/sec. Given that same 200 yard range, it'll take a bullet... 3/10 of a second to cross that distance. Given our 32ft/sec/sec, the bullet will have accelerated to around 10 feet/sec in that time. Cheating the math again, that put the total distance traveled at... 3 feet. Yep, you'd notice that, big time. "Big head" shot turns into "little head" shot. OUCH.

[Furret]

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

Who said anything about light, Luddite? The weaponry of the Vanu are far beyond your ken.

PS: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to measure the deflection caused by gravity across the effective range using a micrometer.

Oh hell, lets do some math.
1) The speed of light is 3,000,000 miles per second (give or take). Three Million miles per second.

2) The effective range of weaponry in PS2 is likely to be similar to PS1. Lets assume 200 yards.

So it takes light... 3.8 x 10-8 seconds to travel that far.

At 32ft/sec/sec (also ass-u-me-ing that gravity on Auraxis is similar to Earth's):
Light will drop...
1.22 x 10-6 feet
or
0.014... THOUSANDTHS of an inch. (and that number's way too big, it assumes a constant velocity of 32 feet per second, which would clearly not be the case. It takes a full second to reach 32 ft/sec. Light will have only had 3.8 x 10-8 (0.000000038 seconds) to fall. Sadly, I don't recall that particular equation from physics class All Those Years Ago.)

Nope, can't measure that with a micrometer. Micrometers are capable of measuring 1/1000 of an inch. You'd need a device that was over 60 times more accurate to measure 1/60,000 of an inch.

PPS: I'm pretty sure you were kidding. Sadly your post lacked humor and needed to be curb-stomped.


PPPS: Unless PS2's engagement range is Vastly Expanded, Real World bullet drop won't matter all that much either.

A modern assault rifle could reasonably expect a muzzle velocity in excess of 2000ft/sec. Given that same 200 yard range, it'll take a bullet... 3/10 of a second to cross that distance. Given our 32ft/sec/sec, the bullet will have accelerated to around 10 feet/sec in that time. Cheating the math again, that put the total distance traveled at... 3 feet. Yep, you'd notice that, big time. "Big head" shot turns into "little head" shot. OUCH.

Why the hell would you use the American system to calculate all that shit.

Metric would've been a hell of a lot easier.

c = 3x10^8 m/s
g = 9.8 m/s^2
x = 200 m

t = x/c
t = 6.67 x 10^-7 seconds

s = v0t + .5at^2 where s is bullet drop, v0 is initial velocity in the Y axis (0), t is the time allotted, and a is the acceleration. Units are in brackets.

s = 0{m/s}(6.67 x 10^-7){s} + 4.9{m/s^2}(4.44 x 10^-13){s^2}

s = 2.18 x 10^-12 m, or 2.18 picometers

I think it's safe to assume 2.18 picometers will not make the difference between your shot hitting or missing your target.

[NewSith]

Originally Posted by IDukeNukeml

Also, in terms of realism... Bullets do not go "((" Boom -------_______"))"

They go "((" Boom _____-----______
____3600 Meters MAXIMUM"))" m16a2

More like ((" Boom __-----___________

To all who doubt it: What we name a recoil is the exact effect of bullet acceleration.

[EASyEightyEight]

Big numbers @_@

We all know they're just going to keep it simple: either everything drops at X distance, or VS weaponry goes straight but phases out abruptly at X range.

As long as my bullets dealing full damage the whole way instead of 50% of their normal damage by 100m, we might actually see them used as a mainstay weapon outside of Oshur for a change. 'Cause right now, it's either the bolt driver or the HA, depending on if you're planning on hanging back or bolting from cover to cover to reach the base wall, which happens to be within spitting distance of the tree line.

[Storn]

Sniping takes very little skill in PS2. WWII online did it right with round drop. In order to compensate for round drop you had to set the scope to what range you ascertained the target to be at. After you got the scope ranged in you were golden. I think all the scopes should have this ability to adjust for long range shots.

[Peacemaker]

Originally Posted by IDukeNukeml

What weapon have you seen that produce a bullet's velocity at 2000 feet a fucking second? It takes 1.2 seconds to hit a 300 meter target with an m4.

Also, in terms of realism... Bullets do not go "((" Boom -------_______"))"

They go "((" Boom _____-----______
____3600 Meters MAXIMUM"))" m16a2

I love people who just make shit up. An M4 Assault Rifle uses the Nato 5.56mm x 54mm Full Metal Jacket 63 grain bullet. Average FPS from this round when it leaves the barrel of a carbine is around 3100 FPS. 300 yards = 900 feet give or take. 900 / 3100 = .29 seconds. For an m4 round to take 1.2 seconds to hit (assuming that the round maintains a constant velocity, which it does not it slows considerably after 500 yards) You would have to be shooting at a target in excess of 1250 yards. Well outside the range of the 5.56 round, which is reliable to at max 800 yards. In reality with the bullet slowing down you would probably have a 5.56 round take 1.2 seconds to hit a target at about 900ish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56%C3%9745mm_NATO <--- Proof

PLEASE don't try to BS your way through the internet.

Also, NO Bullets do NOT go up and then come back down. Gun sights are zeroed in at ranges other than 0 meters. They are sighted so that anything UNDER the range they are sighted for would result in the bullet striking above the desired inpact point. For example, if you took a scoped rifle sighted for 200 yards and shot at 50 yards aiming dead center, your impact point is going to be an inch or so high. Sights and scopes are pointed down towards the barrel, not parallel. In reality the impact point on a rifle sighted in at 200 yards would also intersect the path of the bullet somewhere else down the line as it starts to drop. For a bullet to go up and then come back down it would need to produce lift. They do not, they fall as soon as they leave the barrel.

Also I have no idea what 3600 meters max M16A2 means, but no M16 fires ANYWHERE near 3200 meters. Thats a 1.5 mile shot. Which is roughly the record for the longest kill ever which was made with a .338 Lapula Magnum round, NOT a 5.56mm Nato.

Redneck Gun Nut Owned.

[Goku]

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

PS: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to measure the deflection caused by gravity across the effective range using a micrometer.

Oh hell, lets do some math.
1) The speed of light is 3,000,000 miles per second (give or take). Three Million miles per second.

I am just going to assume this is sarcasm .

[Soothsayer]

You guys are out of control... Higby, we need info or this is gonna get ugly!

[CutterJohn]

Originally Posted by Ridill

No kids. Light does not travel in a straight line. It is affected by the curvature of space and time. Ever heard of Einstein??? Period. Fucking. Dot.

The state of your education is worrying. Thankfully others have pointed out your errors so I don't have to.


I'm all for bullet drop on all weapons it should not reasonably apply too, along with a more reasonable damage degradation with range. Make compensating for the drop what is necessary to be effective at those long ranges, not a magical lessening of energy.

As for vanu weapons: They should not have no bullet drop. They are still shooting matter, and that would still suffer from the effects of gravity. Shot speed is what you want to flatten out the arc. A lashers orbs would should have lobbed like softballs. A lancer and mag railgun should have had a noticeable arc, though being fast projectiles it would not have been much.

If its not a laser, or perhaps a railgun with hypersonic bullets, there must be arc.

Originally Posted by SKYeXile

WHY ARE YOU PEOPLE USING IMPERIAL FOR MEASURMENT!?!?!

People from other countries oft give those in the US shit for not knowing other languages. Learn to use more than one measuring system. The simple conversions are easy, and you can derive the rest.

[Baneblade]

Bullet drop is just the new cof.

[Sirisian]

Originally Posted by Sobekeus

Bullet drop is just the new cof.

I want both.

[SKYeXile]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

People from other countries oft give those in the US shit for not knowing other languages. Learn to use more than one measuring system. The simple conversions are easy, and you can derive the rest.

im not giving you shit because i cant convert imperial to metric...which it obvious i can..since I dont live in the US... I'm simply giving you shit for using an inferior system of measurment.

[Ridill]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

The state of your education is worrying. Thankfully others have pointed out your errors so I don't have to.


I'm all for bullet drop on all weapons it should not reasonably apply too, along with a more reasonable damage degradation with range. Make compensating for the drop what is necessary to be effective at those long ranges, not a magical lessening of energy.

As for vanu weapons: They should not have no bullet drop. They are still shooting matter, and that would still suffer from the effects of gravity. Shot speed is what you want to flatten out the arc. A lashers orbs would should have lobbed like softballs. A lancer and mag railgun should have had a noticeable arc, though being fast projectiles it would not have been much.

If its not a laser, or perhaps a railgun with hypersonic bullets, there must be arc.

People from other countries oft give those in the US shit for not knowing other languages. Learn to use more than one measuring system. The simple conversions are easy, and you can derive the rest.

Ok I'll bite. Tell me how my education is worrying as nothing I said was incorrect? Was I totally owned when that guy did those fancy calculations using the speed of light as a constant of 3,000,000 miles/sec? MY EDUCATION IS WORRYING?

I thought I was being clear in my intention, but it seems there was some ambiguity here as people seem to be under the impression i'm asking for light drop to be included in the game. I was merely making a play at realism in a game like planetside while taking a jab at the OP. Something just stood out as ridiculous for me with his in regards to "kids" and the way things should be. Where do you draw the line on importance in things like bullet drop. With weapons named "beamer" one can only assume it is lasers they are shooting even they though no resemblence of that in physics.

Edit: Oh and yes, using anything other than metric for unit based calculations and conversions is stupid. Yes I am American.