The Road map and why it doesnt work!

Pella · 2013-02-04, 04:09 AM

Now don't get me wrong the overall idea of up & down voting is a great idea to get the community involved with the developers.

But a huge problem that the Devs face are the people that have next to no play time, Or experience in Planetside/Planetside 2 who have an overall effect on how this game is going to turn out.

PSU stats is slow at the moment. And i dont want to call people out. But the majority of rubbish posted and voted up are by players who have next to no play time at all.

I don't use the official forums for this reason. As you get into a arguments to easily with people who try and counter your suggestion, when they have no idea how this game works.

Personally i would like to see a CSM somewhat like EvE online. But without the politics involved. Member's of the biggest outfits in PS2 have such a massive effect on this game. Like it or not. But these guys should have a say on what should be done in PS2. And PS1 vets even more so.

I could go deep here. But i hope you catch my drift. As this cannot continue.

typhaon · 2013-02-04, 05:04 AM

I think you're over thinking this.

The Road Map is a tool. It organizes conversation about upcoming changes. The votes give SOE a measure of what people think about things... along with the comments... and SOE takes it from there.

Ultimately, it's SOE's vision of the game that will be produced.

Stellarthief · 2013-02-04, 05:21 AM

SoE is in the driver's seat, player base is in the backseat.

We may give our opinion, play I spy with my little eye and cause a fuss or repeat endlessly "are we there yet?". But ultimately SoE is driving and where they take the game is their decision in the end.

Bunk · 2013-02-04, 05:35 AM

+1 OP

Majority of people that want to shape things don't know what they're talking about.

Stanis · 2013-02-04, 05:58 AM

I believe that with a few notable exceptions the roadmap for development has to be fairly planned for the upcoming months.

They're been working on January patch and preparing assets for February.

They might rethink or revise their plans but I think the roadmap is fairly solid.

However, you are right.
In a vote where the most population option has 25% support, 75% didn't support it.

This makes the whole concept flawed - in general more people are just going to see that the influence they have is fairly minimal and SOE can always find someone that thinks the craziest thing is a good idea ..

SwiftRanger · 2013-02-04, 06:25 AM

SOE aren't mainly looking at the voting (as that gives a wrong image for all kinds of reasons) but at why people like or dislike something. They want feedback and some of the stuff players have posted in those threads are actually really good. Lots of silliness as well of course but the developers at least initiated the right discussions imo and they have proven they're willing to implement good player suggestions. If you would actually check the Road Map you'd also see it's pretty much what PS1 vets want that is on top.

I am in an Outfit myself but to claim that only outfit members should have a right to say what's important to the game or how the game should shape itself isn't right. It's even a form of elitism that might be the downfall of PlanetSide 2 on one day.

There are loads of folks playing on their own as they don't want to be bound to anyone or anything (definitely not only BR1's btw). Even though the game "should" be played in another way, you need to respect their playing style. Also don't overestimate Outfit populations, their willingness to provide a friendly player environment, let alone their ability of coming up with decent suggestions for the future of PS2. As for politics; you will always have those in a PvP-centric game.

And as others have said: SOE is in charge. Players don't know the development side of the game. PS2 isn't EVE, not even close. SOE is off to a much better start than CCP ever had all those years ago. The Road Map is great, there aren't many companies willing to reveal so much so early and let the community vent their opinion on it. It'll get fleshed out, I am sure.

raw · 2013-02-04, 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by Pella

Now don't get me wrong the overall idea of up & down voting is a great idea to get the community involved with the developers.

But a huge problem that the Devs face are the people that have next to no play time, Or experience in Planetside/Planetside 2 who have an overall effect on how this game is going to turn out.

Welcome to democracy.

Rolfski · 2013-02-04, 06:26 AM

Let' s make this game an elitest game where the hardest of hardcore players decide the gameplay, killing off any newbie friendly feature just to make sure this game will die like PS1 did. Sounds like a plan!

raw · 2013-02-04, 06:29 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

Let' s make this game an elitest game where the hardest of hardcore players decide the gameplay, killing off any newbie friendly feature just to make sure this game will die like PS1 did. Sounds like a plan!

"Hardcore and elitist" players should be listened to when it comes to mechanical details. But betting the overall direction of the game I would not.

Stellarthief · 2013-02-04, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by raw

"Hardcore and elitist" players should be listened to when it comes to mechanical details. But betting the overall direction of the game I would not.

Disagree. Gameplay style or amount of time invested doesn't make their opinion on mechanics anymore valid than the next guy. Time played, obsessiveness or attitude does not equal knowledge.

Also, Hardcore and elitist gamers are often bound in their ways and views (I know from firsthand experience) and any noob offering another point of view on mechanics should be hanged.

Lastly, who says a noob can't have a good idea how to adjust mechanics or balance or what not? Good ideas often come from places you don't expect.

Pella · 2013-02-04, 07:18 AM

Im not saying just outfit members should be able to vote.

I am simply talking about larger outfits, That play this game day in day out since beta. People Like BRTD,AT,666 Devil dogs. These leaders should have more influence apon the game. As untimely these outfits keep players ingame and understand what PS2 should be.

Is that a bad thing? Prehaps it is, But i'm sure they will push the game in the right direction where we all want it.

Stellarthief · 2013-02-04, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by Pella

Im not saying just outfit members should be able to vote.

I am simply talking about larger outfits, That play this game day in day out since beta. People Like BRTD,AT,666 Devil dogs. These leaders should have more influence apon the game. As untimely these outfits keep players ingame and understand what PS2 should be.

Is that a bad thing? Prehaps it is, But i'm sure they will push the game in the right direction where we all want it.

This is a very common thing in MMOs actually. The bigger guilds/outfits/organisations get to work closely with devs, share their ideas, etc. and can more or less push the game and even game mechanics (or advocate for certain change at least) in a direction they think it should go. Sometimes they just try to push their own agenda...

This doesnt alway lead to good for all, and sometimes the average gamer doesn't even feel the effects. Could be a bit different in PS2 as the "meta game" is kinda there for everyone, only barrier is numbers here.

But also to be honest it can't be avoided as these organisations are usually the best source of info from gamer perspective. The masses are largely useless other than to hear how unhappy or happy they are with the game at large. Not to contradict myself - they still can be helpful, but have to dig to find it.

Another thing is, as I kinda mentioned above. Usually these bigger organisations aren't a majority of players. They represent a minority who often play the game a certain way.

You should also reread your post. "As untimely these outfits keep players ingame and understand what PS2 should be. ". What PS2 should be is what devs have planned, mapped out, etc + feedback from the players. The larger outfits really couldn't say and have no qualification to say what the game "should be" unless you want to talk actual real world money investment.

It's also rather short sighted if you think these big outfits keep people in game. Except on these forums I have never heard of any of the outfits you mentioned and I couldn't care less about them really. PS2 has some nice designs so that such organisations don't dictate the motion of the world like in so many other MMOs.

A few points scattered here and there. But since 1999 I have seen and heard all the arguments for, against, etc. about how a game should develop. Been in games that have blossomed and games that have sunk.. In the end each decision can bring something good or bad.

ringring · 2013-02-04, 06:38 AM

The trouble with the roadmap is that if it's follow at the pace as detailed this game will continue to be pretty boring for another year.

raw · 2013-02-04, 06:39 AM

Originally Posted by ringring

The trouble with the roadmap is that if it's follow at the pace as detailed this game will continue to be pretty boring for another year.

"We have a roadmap for the coming 3 years laid out" translates to "We released the game 3 years early because we need the money" in real world speak.

SwiftRanger · 2013-02-04, 06:52 AM

Originally Posted by ringring

The trouble with the roadmap is that if it's follow at the pace as detailed this game will continue to be pretty boring for another year.

I gotta admit there wasn't anything worldshaking in the Road Map idd. But we all know the state of the game now, it still does need a lot of work in areas where PS1 has already gotten the better of it. Let's see SOE can get that right first, in a way it doesn't alienate new players.

Hopefully we don't have to wait till July before we know what's gonna happen in the last six months of 2013. Adding a new month with other features after a month has passed would be good imo.