A terminal hacking idea

BadAsh · 2003-11-18, 05:45 PM

I think it would be cool that if you hack a terminal at an enemy base you should have access to their equipment. So if I�m a NC hacker and I hack an equipment terminal at a TR base, I should have access to TR equipment like the Cycler and MCG. If I hack their vehicle terminal I should have access to their vehicles like the Prowler or Marauder.

This would make getting enemy gear easier and add a little variety to your standard equipment selection. Also, it would add another incentive to attack an enemy base� equipment raids!

This really gives you nothing that an advanced hacker or simply looting can�t already provide. You can jack enemy vehicles and anyone can loot a fallen avatar. This would just make things more available and give a few more options in game play.

Also, it would help with real and perceived game balance. Everyone feels this or that weapon is better and the same is true with vehicles. With easier access to enemy gear this will be alleviated somewhat without breaking empire �style� integrity.

Finally, it just makes sense to me. I never understood how I could hack a VS equipment terminal and get my Cycler and MCG out of it� Is it not a VS terminal? How am I pulling TR gear out of it?

What do you think?

Veteran · 2003-11-18, 05:50 PM

It's an awesome idea with support from the majority of players, but the devs steadfastly refuse to adopt this clearly superior approach to equipment distribution.

Maybe in the future. I know a lot of players who would return if this became reality.

Good idea.

Jagd · 2003-11-18, 05:54 PM

infinite loop · 2003-11-18, 06:12 PM

I couldn't agree more, it would be really cool. It's been suggested multiple times, but haven't seen any dev response on it. But I wouldn't take it too far, like being able to get enemy maxes or vehicles. That would totally ruin balance, and too easy to exploit. But temporary access to enemy weapons would be fun.

Veteran · 2003-11-18, 06:17 PM

If you can explain just exactly how getting a Quasar MAX if you're TR is going to unbalance things, I'd like to hear it. If 'game balance' has to strangle obvious avenues for the advancement of the game, I say screw it and take the chance that people will really love the change.

infinite loop · 2003-11-18, 06:36 PM

Well I think you'd see people cert in things that they wouldn't normally, just so they can use the enemy's equivalent. It kinda takes away from the point of having separate empires. If you want everything available, why not just go one step further and make everything common pool?

Plus, I can see how exploiting of this with vehicles would be bad. Take for instance, a base behind your lines that is enemy controlled. Instead of hacking it, you just blow the tubes, and constantly hack the veh term for their vehicles. Not taking the base is counter-productive, and opens you up for unnecessary counter-assault there. Plus what happens when a friendly player comes in and hacks the base or blows the gen, and gets TK'ed endlessly? I don't want to add anything that entices stuff like that to happen.

BadAsh · 2003-11-18, 07:35 PM

Personally I don�t see a problem with people getting a certification in something they normally would not. The Flail already falls into this category. You can only get one if you have the proper module installed. Though if the decision were mine I�d probably rework some of the certifications. For example I�d keep the 3 MAX certs but probably change them to category based (AP, AA, and AV) rather than be MAX specific so someone with the Anti-Personnel MAX cert could use any AP MAX dependant upon availability.

Also, I don�t see this as a problem with game balance. If one empire has better equipment THAT is your balance problem. So no game balance problem should be introduced by simply making various equipment more readily attainable to others.

I do kind of see your point about bases not getting taken over and people just using a crippled (spawn tubes blown) base to stage an attack of hacked vehicles. But you can already do this with your own vehicles. You can Zerg a base, blow the tubes, and hack a horde of tanks, reavers, etc. without having to take the base. So I really don�t see this suggestion as introducing this as a problem.

I don�t see many problems with this, but I do see some really fun battle variations because of this. Imagine the surprise when a platoon of NC captured Blue skinned VS MAXs jump the walls of a TR base protected by a shield module�

The more opportunities for fun on a highly coordinated scale there are the more you will see it. And to me, that�s what Planet Side is all about! ***61514;

BadAsh

infinite loop · 2003-11-19, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by BadAsh

Personally I don�t see a problem with people getting a certification in something they normally would not. The Flail already falls into this category. You can only get one if you have the proper module installed.

That's not the same thing. The flail is common pool. I agree it is difficult to get at times, but anyone can if they want to.

Originally Posted by BadAsh

Though if the decision were mine I�d probably rework some of the certifications. For example I�d keep the 3 MAX certs but probably change them to category based (AP, AA, and AV) rather than be MAX specific so someone with the Anti-Personnel MAX cert could use any AP MAX dependant upon availability.

I don't know if I understand you here. Are you saying that all 9 MAX units should simply be common pool? If so, then again, what's the point of having 3 different empires? Maybe you're just saying again that you should be able to get enemy maxes at hacked terms? If so, you wouldn't have to rework any certs for that, besides possibly modify their descriptions.

Originally Posted by BadAsh

Also, I don�t see this as a problem with game balance. If one empire has better equipment THAT is your balance problem. So no game balance problem should be introduced by simply making various equipment more readily attainable to others.

Well that's a whole different can of worms right there. The prevailing argument, whether or not you agree, is that the game is balanced by overall empire, not by each cert. For example, say the MCG is better than the lasher. But perhaps the Quasar MAX is better than the Pounder MAX. It's not a one-to-one balance, it's overall empire balance. The ONLY way to offer true one-to-one balance is to have everything available in the game to be common pool. If that's what you want, I understand your argument. Otherwise, mixing it up so that it's all common pool some of the time is just a bastardization of balance and won't work. BTW, I'm against making everything all common pool, it defeats the fun of the empires.

Originally Posted by BadAsh

I do kind of see your point about bases not getting taken over and people just using a crippled (spawn tubes blown) base to stage an attack of hacked vehicles. But you can already do this with your own vehicles. You can Zerg a base, blow the tubes, and hack a horde of tanks, reavers, etc. without having to take the base. So I really don�t see this suggestion as introducing this as a problem.

You're missing my point here. There is obviously nothing wrong with hacking a veh term at a camped base and rolling out vehicles. I'm saying, if we could do this to get enemy vehicles, I can see this leading to bad behavior. I can see people camping an enemy base, with the intention of using it as a staging ground for getting enemy vehicles, and NEVER hacking the base. That's a problem. I've never once seen this behavior in game currently. Why would you camp a base and not hack it?

FireZ · 2003-11-19, 01:23 PM

This idea has been tossed around alot. We asked about this in beta....And maybe (seeing how they are fixing bugs from beta that are still out there) we will see some of these suggestions.

BadAsh · 2003-11-19, 09:24 PM

Jagd,

It is neither cheap or vanilla as it would provide many variations to tactics and game play...

In the tank example you used...

As the game currently stands if you want to play a heavy tank you have to play as NC. If you want to play a light tank you have to play VS. Tired of your light or heavy tank? Sure, just delete your character and start all over at BR1 and leave your outfit and friends behind OR join another world server with a higher ping, start a new character at BR1 and leave your outfit and friends behind (when you are playing there).

Or as per my preferance, if you want a light tank, meduim tank, or heavy tank, just get the appropriate certification and get one... gear/cert selection rather than empire selection is the theme of my preferance...

I just think it's a better way to achieve game balance. Of course a lot of people don't want game balance... they carefully selected their empire because of a particular advantage and they live by exploiting that... to them variety and a fair battleground are unthinkable...

So clearly I've given you the choice to either agree with me or be some type of cowardly design flaw exploiter...

Still going to offer a different opinion?

BadAsh

Hamma · 2003-11-19, 11:28 PM

Stop flaming people, thanks.

BadAsh · 2003-11-20, 02:05 AM

Lol

infinite loop · 2003-11-20, 11:27 AM

BadAsh - I completely agree with Jagd, besides the flame stuff

I understand your side of things, but you can't argue it wouldn't make the game more vanilla by making those changes. One of this game's strengths is the variety of gameplay, especially weapons, vehicles, and playstyle. If you'll notice, I have characters of all 3 empires, and my goal is to max out all 3 one day. Some days I get tired of using the same weapons, so I login to another server and have fun with something different. If the weapons were all the same, the alternative would be for me to either not play, or play another game. I don't like that alternative.

Besides my personal enjoyment of having different characters, I really love the tactics involved that you described. I like having to react differently to my opponent, depending on their empire and weapon. It makes it so much more interesting than if everyone had the same shit. Honestly, I can't think of many successful games that have come out in the last few years that had the exact same weapons and vehicles for all sides. All the WWII games are very similar to PS, and people love those games.

Maybe you're just a deathmatch kinda guy, and that's cool. Just don't ask for PS to fit that need for you. Go play UT or Quake instead! Oh and btw, love the Army of Darkness reference in your name!

Jagd · 2003-11-18, 07:42 PM

Yeah but it would seriously nerf the fun of trading weapons with enemies, and those awesome rolls you get on when you loot a jackhammer and get like 15 kills in a row. Making them easy to attain cheapens them, and goes against the entire reason for having factions in the first place.

BadAsh · 2003-11-18, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by Jagd

Yeah but it would seriously nerf the fun of trading weapons with enemies, and those awesome rolls you get on when you loot a jackhammer and get like 15 kills in a row. Making them easy to attain cheapens them, and goes against the entire reason for having factions in the first place.

Actually, my "rolls" I get on about are about 4 kills... but, if you've seen my amazing skillz in action, I could see how you'd think it was 15 or more...