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View Poll Results: Do you want disabling?
No 73 64.04%
Yes, exactly per BF3 3 2.63%
Yes, but no burning 3 2.63%
Yes, but it shouldn't happen until 20-25%, not 50% 24 21.05%
Other yes 9 7.89%
Other (completely different idea) 2 1.75%
Voters: 114. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2012-04-18, 09:31 AM   [Ignore Me] #1
Stardouser
Colonel
 
Vehicle disabling


A lot of stuff from BF3 has been discussed but I haven't seen this being talked about. Battlefield 3 has a "feature" wherein a vehicle, let's use a tank as an example, when it hits 50% health, it is "disabled". This means that its speed is crippled and it then begins to slowly burn (lose a few health percentage points per second).

This applies to jeeps as well, and aircraft too.

I do not believe this is something that PS2 should have, and I haven't seen it discussed yet.

What say you?

Edit: NB: I am against disabling. This is not an idea suggestion, but a prevention thread.

Last edited by Stardouser; 2012-04-18 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 2012-04-18, 09:35 AM   [Ignore Me] #2
PredatorFour
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Re: Vehicle disabling


As a dedicated mag driver i resoundingly said no. If you played PS in tanks you would know what i mean when i say some of the best times were `getting away` when you had pretty much no health at all. Managing to escape/blow up the prey stalking you then find a nice place to repair was awesome and a big factor of why driving tanks was so fun.

You also knew when you had half health to gtfo outta hostile situations knowing you could at least take some damage on your way to repair.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:04 AM   [Ignore Me] #3
Gandhi
First Lieutenant
 
Re: Vehicle disabling


I don't think it has a place in this game. It makes sense in BF3, where you have a limited number of people and tanks on the map, and might want to make an effort to save a disabled one. But in Planetside's scale if a tank is going to be disabled at 50%, you might as well just have it explode at 50%. Getting out to repair it would be a non-option in any kind of busy fight and nobody from your team is going to run into the melee to do it for the same reason. With the sheer number of people playing I don't think limping to safety at a crippling pace is going to be all that practical in most cases.

But I have nothing against, say, losing your main cannon either as a dice roll as a result of severe damage or by targeted attacks. Or even crippling your speed in the same fashion, as long as it's not too easy to do.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:09 AM   [Ignore Me] #4
FastAndFree
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Most definitely no, except for aircraft at the very bottom few percents of their armor bar (replacing blowing up with crashing and then blowing up)
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:06 AM   [Ignore Me] #5
Xyntech
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Re: Vehicle disabling


I think that as long as a vehicle has health, it should keep going. Yet at the same time, I like some of the ideas behind disabling.

I would propose this:

All vehicles are fully functional until they reach 0% health. Once they reach zero health, they become either disabled or destroyed.

If a vehicle has 1% health and is hit by a tank round, it is ALWAYS instantly destroyed. If a vehicle loses the last of it's health to small arms fire, it will ALWAYS be merely disabled. How powerful the final blow was, how low the vehicles health when that final blow was delivered, and the base quantity of armor that the vehicle has would all determine how likely it was to just be disabled or instantly destroyed.

Disabled vehicles would then be given a secondary health bar, with burning damage slowly eating away at it until the vehicle finally blew up. Additional enemy shots could hasten it's final destruction.

The crew inside would have to get out to avoid taking burn damage, but assuming they were able to survive outside the vehicle, they could then attempt to repair the disabled vehicle.

I just don't think it's right for a vehicle to claim to have health and yet not be able to function, or for every vehicle to be disabled before being destroyed. I don't see any problem with having a system in place that allows for the potential to 'revive' a dead vehicle, provided it was merely disabled and not destroyed.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:17 AM   [Ignore Me] #6
Stardouser
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Originally Posted by Xyntech View Post
I think that as long as a vehicle has health, it should keep going. Yet at the same time, I like some of the ideas behind disabling.

I would propose this:

All vehicles are fully functional until they reach 0% health. Once they reach zero health, they become either disabled or destroyed.

If a vehicle has 1% health and is hit by a tank round, it is ALWAYS instantly destroyed. If a vehicle loses the last of it's health to small arms fire, it will ALWAYS be merely disabled. How powerful the final blow was, how low the vehicles health when that final blow was delivered, and the base quantity of armor that the vehicle has would all determine how likely it was to just be disabled or instantly destroyed.

Disabled vehicles would then be given a secondary health bar, with burning damage slowly eating away at it until the vehicle finally blew up. Additional enemy shots could hasten it's final destruction.

The crew inside would have to get out to avoid taking burn damage, but assuming they were able to survive outside the vehicle, they could then attempt to repair the disabled vehicle.

I just don't think it's right for a vehicle to claim to have health and yet not be able to function, or for every vehicle to be disabled before being destroyed. I don't see any problem with having a system in place that allows for the potential to 'revive' a dead vehicle, provided it was merely disabled and not destroyed.
Actually, that's not a bad idea, because the disabling occurs AFTER it would have been dead in any other shooter game.

And for the immersion lovers, here's a thought. It seems like the tanks have a top mounted machine gun on them...what if a destroyed tank persisted for a few minutes where all the systems are broken and destroyed but people can jump into the top spot of the turret and use the machine gun? Those machine guns might be remote controlled, I couldn't tell.

Originally Posted by Coreldan View Post
Lol. What did BF3s vehicle disabling even do? It never stopped moving, it never stopped shooting. But hey, free points for "disabling" vehicle despite it being fully functional.
They still move, but at about 1/5 speed.
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This is the last VIP post in this thread.   Old 2012-04-18, 10:27 AM   [Ignore Me] #7
Malorn
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PlanetSide 2
Game Designer
 
Re: Vehicle disabling


Originally Posted by Xyntech View Post
I would propose this:

All vehicles are fully functional until they reach 0% health. Once they reach zero health, they become either disabled or destroyed.

Disabled vehicles would then be given a secondary health bar, with burning damage slowly eating away at it until the vehicle finally blew up. Additional enemy shots could hasten it's final destruction.

The crew inside would have to get out to avoid taking burn damage, but assuming they were able to survive outside the vehicle, they could then attempt to repair the disabled vehicle.
What you describe could be achieved with a single health bar. Its just bigger and at a certain point the vehicle becomes disabled and starts on fire. When that happens depends on how big the 'disabled' health bar is vs the normal health bar. Just stitch them together.

You seem to dislike having a false sense of health where you see a health bar and it's not really the health you have because some of it will mean you are disabled.

That seems reasonable to me to show players exactly how much health before their vehicle will be useless rather than hiding it inside a health bar.

But on the other side of things, its also important to show hostile players exactly how much health is required to blow something up. I assume there will be an advanced targeting implant or something similar that shows health of targets. The opposite is true for blowing something up as being in i - you don't care about disable, you just want to know how close something is to being dead and having two health bars is deciving as to what it might really take to destroy the tank.
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Old 2012-04-18, 11:09 AM   [Ignore Me] #8
Xyntech
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Originally Posted by Malorn View Post
What you describe could be achieved with a single health bar. Its just bigger and at a certain point the vehicle becomes disabled and starts on fire. When that happens depends on how big the 'disabled' health bar is vs the normal health bar. Just stitch them together.

You seem to dislike having a false sense of health where you see a health bar and it's not really the health you have because some of it will mean you are disabled.

That seems reasonable to me to show players exactly how much health before their vehicle will be useless rather than hiding it inside a health bar.

But on the other side of things, its also important to show hostile players exactly how much health is required to blow something up. I assume there will be an advanced targeting implant or something similar that shows health of targets. The opposite is true for blowing something up as being in i - you don't care about disable, you just want to know how close something is to being dead and having two health bars is deciving as to what it might really take to destroy the tank.
The point of having the disable being AFTER the health is entirely gone is to have disabling be complete, not just a few systems performing below optimally. For all intents and purposes, the disabled vehicle would be just as immediately unthreatening as a destroyed vehicle, as far as not being able to move or shoot, etc.

A disabled vehicle should be obviously burning and disabled, while a destroyed vehicle should be burnt out with pieces missing and blown off of it. With no advanced targeting type of thing, it should be pretty obvious visually whether you have just destroyed a vehicle, or merely disabled it.

With something like advanced targeting, you would simply see the new disabled status health bar appear once the enemy vehicle became disabled. You would also be able to use advanced targeting to guess how likely your target was going to be destroyed or disabled by your next shot.

The whole idea is that your regular health bar show you how long you have to live, just like your health bar does as a foot soldier. The only reason I even bring up a health bar for after it is disabled is because I think it would be good if you could still attempt to repair a disabled vehicle and, thus, the enemy should also have a chance to finish it off for good.

Obviously you could also do this with a singular health bar. Perhaps if there was a part of the health bar that was marked in a different color, like yellow instead of green, at which point you would know the vehicle would become completely non operational but not instantly blow up yet. I would only support this if it were 5% to 15% of the total health of the vehicle.

---

Another option would be to have two health bars that are always active, sort of like the armor/health of PS1 or the shield/health of PS2.

The first bar would be armor (which would not regenerate), the second bar would be for the internal systems.

The armor would absorb all damage until it got to say 25%. At 25% or below, the armor would start allowing some damage to seep through and damage the internal systems. The more damage those internal systems took, the less effective the tank would function (firing slower, driving slower, etc), until the tank finally become unable to move or shoot at all once the internal systems reached 50%.

Now the internal systems would START taking damage at 25% armor, but I figure that the armor would only let a tiny fraction of the damage through until it started getting a lot lower, like 10%, so even though you would only have to get the internal systems down to 50% to fully disable the tank, it probably wouldn't happen until the armor was significantly compromised.

The vehicle would be fully destroyed and explode when either the armor OR the internal systems reached zero, whichever came first. In this situation, a vehicle with 50% internal systems or lower would take burn damage, but the damage would only eat away at the internal systems health, doing no additional damage to the armor.

Just some thoughts on how to include an interesting system while improving it to not suck quite so bad.
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Old 2012-04-18, 05:44 PM   [Ignore Me] #9
TerminatorUK
Master Sergeant
 
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Originally Posted by Xyntech View Post
I think that as long as a vehicle has health, it should keep going. Yet at the same time, I like some of the ideas behind disabling.

I would propose this:

All vehicles are fully functional until they reach 0% health. Once they reach zero health, they become either disabled or destroyed.

If a vehicle has 1% health and is hit by a tank round, it is ALWAYS instantly destroyed. If a vehicle loses the last of it's health to small arms fire, it will ALWAYS be merely disabled. How powerful the final blow was, how low the vehicles health when that final blow was delivered, and the base quantity of armor that the vehicle has would all determine how likely it was to just be disabled or instantly destroyed.

Disabled vehicles would then be given a secondary health bar, with burning damage slowly eating away at it until the vehicle finally blew up. Additional enemy shots could hasten it's final destruction.

The crew inside would have to get out to avoid taking burn damage, but assuming they were able to survive outside the vehicle, they could then attempt to repair the disabled vehicle.

I just don't think it's right for a vehicle to claim to have health and yet not be able to function, or for every vehicle to be disabled before being destroyed. I don't see any problem with having a system in place that allows for the potential to 'revive' a dead vehicle, provided it was merely disabled and not destroyed.
This idea is brilliant!

Got my vote
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:10 AM   [Ignore Me] #10
Coreldan
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Lol. What did BF3s vehicle disabling even do? It never stopped moving, it never stopped shooting. But hey, free points for "disabling" vehicle despite it being fully functional.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:14 AM   [Ignore Me] #11
Fenrod
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Re: Vehicle disabling


At less than 10%, aircrafts should be slowed down.
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Click here to go to the next VIP post in this thread.   Old 2012-04-18, 10:22 AM   [Ignore Me] #12
Malorn
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Re: Vehicle disabling


In the GDC video I'm quite sure I saw a Prowler go disabled just before it was destroyed.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:23 AM   [Ignore Me] #13
Stardouser
Colonel
 
Re: Vehicle disabling


Originally Posted by Malorn View Post
In the GDC video I'm quite sure I saw a Prowler go disabled just before it was destroyed.
If disabling occurs just before destruction it's not a huge deal. HOWEVER, I should mention that with BF3's system, you have to repair all the way to 100% before the disabling stops. If disabling occurred at 10%, it should stop when repaired past 20%.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:36 AM   [Ignore Me] #14
lolroflroflcake
Staff Sergeant
 
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Re: Vehicle disabling


I've always found vehicle disabling to be sort of a pointless form of trolling on behalf of the people who make the game, sort of a last, "ha ha you sucked at driving/piloting and now your gonna die for it."

I mean just randomly exploding once you reach a certain damage level is also silly, but I really don't need the game to help me along in dying.

And plus if your a good driver and are constantly escape the fire of the entire enemy empire by the skin of your teeth I feel you should deserve to escape, not end up crippled and barely moving while some jerk picks you off at his leisure. It's a feature to make the game revolve around infantry by making vehicles even more vulnerable, so I don't like it.
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Old 2012-04-18, 10:31 AM   [Ignore Me] #15
IronMole
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Re: Vehicle disabling


Planetside used to have vehicle disabling on aircraft (lost control at certain damage) until they changed it to the bailing mechanism.
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