Differentiating rifle type weapons

Galapogos · 2012-07-01, 12:04 PM

After watching all the E3 footage we saw a lot of people playing the light and heavy assault classes, and a little of the medic and engy of I remember corretcly. This means we at least saw a lot of carbines and LMGs. The thing is I did not see a huge difference between the two in how they handled. I would like to see the rifle type weapons (SMGs, Carbines, full sized ARs, and LMGs) have significant differences in how they handle and also what situations each is the most effective in, or at least how they can be used to approach the same situation from a different angle. I didn't mention sniper rifles since they obviously already have a very defined role.

A very simple solution to me would be to restrict ARs to single/3 round burst and the rest to full auto/3 round burst, but I don't think that would differentiate them enough, even though I am sure there will be differences in rof, dps, etc. as well obviously.

How do you guys think these weapons should be varied so they have clear differences in performance and function?

TerranRoughneck · 2012-07-01, 12:19 PM

It's my experience that the weapons are broken down like this:

SMGs: High rate of fire, lower accuracy, quick reload, short to medium range
ARs: Medium rate of fire, higher accuracy, medium reload, medium to long range
LMGs: Low-high rate of fire(varies depending), lower accuracy, long reload, medium to long range.

It just depends on your play style. If you like being up close and personal, SMGs are great. If you like taking being relatively versatile and accurate regardless of the range then go with ARs. LMGs are typically just good for support, laying down covering fire or when defending.

Of course, you'll be able to change anything and everything about your gun via the cert system. So it really just depends on what weapons system and style you prefer; then you can mold it to your play style.

Galapogos · 2012-07-01, 12:27 PM

I understand the basic differences between these weapons, I just feel like in a lot of games they blur into each to much so that SMgs and ARs/carbines do not feel all that different, and in any game I have played with LMGs, LMGs just become over powered ARs.

AxeGaijin · 2012-07-01, 12:26 PM

What we've seen on E3, I'm sure, is in no way representative of what will happen in Beta or the full game, I think it's a case of wait and see before making a case one way or another right now.

TerranRoughneck · 2012-07-01, 12:41 PM

Fair enough, and you're definitely right about them blending together. I think that's because the main differences are too easily altered to be like one or the other. Even in real weapons systems you see a CQC, LMG and AR versions of the same rifle(like the G36, among many others).

If the cert system is as robust as it seems, then there really won't be much of a difference because it'll be up to us to "spec" our guns to work the way we want them to.

Littleman · 2012-07-01, 02:11 PM

I'm sure to some degree SMG's will be strictly SMG's, and no carbine, rifle, or LMG can match them, but for the most part it's a power balancing act. Light assault simply can't have TOO accurate weaponry with too much power or rate of fire behind each shot. Hit-n-run is encouraged, not camping and ghetto sniping. They're hard targets to chase, but they shouldn't be firing from ideal vantage points with impunity. Maximum damage output might encourage getting in close, using the pack to out maneuver an enemy more so than get a vantage point over them.

The HA puts a LOT of ammo down range. I expect that if one bursts, the LMG can easily match any rifle, but going full auto would serve more of a suppressing function where as rifles and carbines are likely more manageable with sustained fire (but still largely wasteful.)

Between the classes themselves and even small, seemingly inconsequential differences between the weaponry, I think we'll find they will all act very differently from one another.

CutterJohn · 2012-07-01, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by Littleman

I expect that if one bursts, the LMG can easily match any rifle, but going full auto would serve more of a suppressing function where as rifles and carbines are likely more manageable with sustained fire (but still largely wasteful.)

Thats backwards. LMGs are the ones built for sustained fire. Rifles and carbines are lighter, and hence have higher recoil and are more difficult to control.

Littleman · 2012-07-01, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

Thats backwards. LMGs are the ones built for sustained fire. Rifles and carbines are lighter, and hence have higher recoil and are more difficult to control.

Didn't realize Planetside 2 was being developed with ultra-realism in mind.

It's not backwards in terms of Planetside 2. It's called balance. I don't recall reading that the LMG's were accurate under sustained fire.

gufftroad · 2012-07-01, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by Littleman

Didn't realize Planetside 2 was being developed with ultra-realism in mind.

Ergo, probably not backwards in terms of Planetside 2. It's called balance.

LMGs have always been for sustained suppressing fire even in BF3 that's what they are meant for

you don't go full retard unless you are laying down suppressing fire with an assault rifle you use burst or semi for clearing and close range to make your shots count

Seagoon · 2012-07-01, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by Littleman

Didn't realize Planetside 2 was being developed with ultra-realism in mind.

It's not backwards in terms of Planetside 2. It's called balance. I don't recall reading that the LMG's were accurate under sustained fire.

Dev A: "Ok we are going to have two sorts of cutlery, a knife and a fork."
Dev B: "But they are both spoons..."
Dev A: "Planetside 2 is not being developed with ultra-realism in mind."
Dev B: "Oh, I guess that makes sense then."

gufftroad · 2012-07-01, 04:18 PM

full auto is what you are supposed to do with an LMG its meant to keep people suppressed so your squad can advance without having to worry about return fire its not a precision instrument and of course the LMG would have more recoil its shooting full auto

Littleman · 2012-07-01, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by gufftroad

full auto is what you are supposed to do with an LMG its meant to keep people suppressed so your squad can advance without having to worry about return fire its not a precision instrument and of course the LMG would have more recoil its shooting full auto

I don't care WHAT the hell it's called in PS2. We A: Don't know how they'll really work yet and B: Do you REALLY think laying down suppressive fire is what most HA will do if they can pull off accurate shots using burst fire? Finally, C: How popular do you really think the Heavy Assault class will be if it has no med-long range killing capabilities like we'd expect from the Medic and Engineer? Only team players are interested in using a weapon for suppression, and even most of THEM prefer to kill people outright.

I know SOE is taking inspiration from Battlefield, but they sure as hell ain't making a carbon copy of it. Since last I heard HA will get the LMG and then either a choice of AV or HA as we may have recognized them in PS1, I'm pretty damned sure the LMG is mostly a really big rifle in PS2, just less accurate but not so much so one may as well use a mini-gun at all of the same ranges.

Goku · 2012-07-01, 05:06 PM

Lets calm down a bit everyone.

TeaLeaf · 2012-07-01, 07:54 PM

LMGs should probably be superior to ARs in everything except mobility and mobile accuracy. Making them hard to assault with.

SMGs should have equivalent damage to ARs but their accuracy should barely be affected by movement, the trade off being severe range falloff.

Carbines should be somewhere between SMGs and ARs.

Just my opinions of course, I do see a lot of games make the AR just the superior weapon and I hope they manage to dodge that in PS2.

gufftroad · 2012-07-01, 11:29 PM

the way i see it SMGs should be the lowest on the damage spectrum with the highest rate of fire since they are shooting pistol ammo

carbines should have a little more damage and accuracy then the SMG but a lower rate of fire and a mag capacity of 30-40 in line with the AR

ARs should have a slower rate of fire then carbines with much higher accuracy but around the same damage (they do use the same ammo in most cases) with mags around 30-40

BRs if they have them should do a lot of damage with a slow rate of fire and low capacity mags(thinking 15-20)

LMGs should have a higher rate of fire then the AR but MUCH MUCH lower accuracy and damage at about the same amount with high capacity mags or if they are belt fed boxes like around 100 or so rounds