Good news for the outraged, dissapointed PS1 vets

[Rolfski]

Cheer up, you will (mostly) get what you want
If you watch a few dev commentaries like this one, things should start to make a lot more sense. Especially if you read between the lines:
Their whole idea has always been to release a BF3 on crack and then turn it into a PS1 on steroids over time.

Right now they focus on making it attractive enough for the (casual) masses to keep the offices running but they will gradually add a lot of your PS1 stuff:

• Can't live without your 2-manned tank? Be prepared to Cert for it.
• Dying for that ant run? They will add secondary objectives.
• Shallow like Paris Hilton? The meta game will make it more Meryl Streep.
• No feeling of accomplishment? Continent locking will be there.
• Want to keep the Zergs out for hours with 2 man only? Ford Knoxes and other choke points will be there.
• Train that noob in a safe environment? VR is already on the drawing board.
• BFR's that ruin the game? Won't happen.
• Want to get lost inside a bunker? Indoor bases will appear.
• Hate the hex system? They will flesh it out so that you don't want to go back anymore.
• Etc, etc.

Of course you must have a bit of patience and not everything will come in the same format as PS1. I'm pretty sure though that if this game will become a success, it will end up a lot more hardcore then you have ever wished for.

Hopefully this idea will cheer up the infuriated and depressed PS1 vets a bit. Because I really would love to see more positive posts from PS1 vets in this forum.

[Crator]

A lot of people seem to think that the game will fail if released in current state, with a lot of the stuff missing that you listed among other things. However, if SOE does keep up with these kinds of fixes then the game will defiantly be great in time. And I don't think a bad first impression is all that bad. This is a free-to-play game after all.

Also, first impressions are not all that bad, when you first start. Other then the new player experience issues. The game looks great! And is fun to an extent. It's the depth that missing. So next iteration of a FPS that comes out a lot of players will probably migrate there for some time. But when SOE updates PS2 with meta-game stuff and bug fixes and such, they will come back again. For the same reason they tried the game in the first place, it's free to play. Some people are just drama queens is all.

You must know though, some PS1 vets have been scarred for life by SOE. It's only natural they get upset like this cause they went through a whirlwind of crap with PS1.

[Aaron]

Good to hear. We really can't be too rash with PS2. It needs a lot of time.

[Marinealver]

Is this all comming before or after launch.

SOE has craped all over us before and I won't put it beyond them to say this and do that instead.

[Figment]

They really need to communicate what they're working on, short, long term priorities so we can keep giving feedback and they manage expectations a bit better.



That said, I really hope they look beyond a "cert" for driver/gunner, because it's just coming across as a half arsed token "solution" that's not actually fixing the problems and reasons why we want it. :/

[Rolfski]

Originally Posted by Figment

They really need to communicate what they're working on, short, long term priorities so we can keep giving feedback and they manage expectations a bit better.

I think they are doing that as best as possible, imo at least better than most developers. The problem is they can't promise too much in a planning phase of a feature or people will immediately set it in stone and hold them to it. They need to keep some flexibility in their design processes.

That's why you need to read between the lines a bit and check up on these devs in more informal situations like spontaneous stream Q&A's.

Bottom line is; they have not forgotten about mechanics that apparently made PS1 such a classic. If they think it works for PS2 as well you will find it in there in some form sooner or later. If it doesn't work, they will look for other ways to add extra layers to the game that make the experience richer and deeper.


Why am I so 100% sure about all this?
Besides what the devs are telling us: If you look at it from a pure business point of view, this all makes perfectly sense.
You develop & release a very basic game (You should compare the upcoming release with Minecraft alfa), that is attractive enough to a wide amount of players to keep the office running. From there on you create and improve features/content that keep your players interested and make them even more addicted to the game. Best way to do it? Let them decide. If you do this well enough? Voila, you've just created an endless running, money making, machine.

Why do you think SOE is paying so much attention to Eve Online? It's because that universe has become the endless money making machine SOE is aiming for with PS2.

You guys call yourself true fans? I'm 100% sure you are but believe me, compared to hardcore Eve fans you would probably qualify as casual player. We're talking tattoos here, Eve's player base has become insanely attached to the game over the years and their numbers keep growing. That's all because the game improves considerably every year and they decide the game play. Their addiction keeps the offices staffed year over year.

SOE wants exactly this with PS2 so I wouldn't be too worried about this game not becoming hardcore enough, lol

[Rolfski]

Originally Posted by IDukeNukeml

There is however, one immense problem here; it doesn't offer the required depth from an MMO stand-point or even that of 'generic once a year' shooter.

Coming from a BF3/COD background, I personally think PS2 has already more depth than these games, but you're still making a very good point here. As much as they want it (Smedley checked PVE interest for a reason), they are very limited in what they can do in adding MMO features (at least on the short term) to keep us hooked: no quests, no campaigns, no story telling, no coop, no crafting, no economy, etc.

Well, good for us because it means that adding strategy to the game has become even more important to keep us interested. And unlike the 'generic once a year' shooters, keeping us interested over a longer period is extremely important to them or otherwise they won't earn their money back.

[Ravenclaw]

Originally Posted by Figment

They really need to communicate what they're working on, short, long term priorities so we can keep giving feedback and they manage expectations a bit better.



That said, I really hope they look beyond a "cert" for driver/gunner, because it's just coming across as a half arsed token "solution" that's not actually fixing the problems and reasons why we want it. :/

I guess you have not been keeping up with the tonnes of videos and interviews with Matt Higby, believe me they IS a lot of communication going on, and lot more than we seen in any game in the past... tho they really should have a forum area dedicated to all those videos

[Figment]

Originally Posted by Ravenclaw

I guess you have not been keeping up with the tonnes of videos and interviews with Matt Higby, believe me they IS a lot of communication going on, and lot more than we seen in any game in the past... tho they really should have a forum area dedicated to all those videos

Twitter, reddit, YouTube, forums, etc. Every tidbit of info is spread all over the web. What I'm talking about is a wish and priority list with more of an order of patches than set dates.

For all Wargaming did wrong, they said in advance what their patch plans were. Of course they got regularly postponed, but you knew they would first do French tanks, then this line of units, then this feature, etc.

[Snipefrag]

If people honestly believed all this would be in for release then you need to get with reality. Like all software development making games is an iterative process. I see so many people whining about things that we KNOW the devs plan to address. Have a little patience, the games not perfect but given time we will see the majority of these things we are after.. I get the feeling that people who are complaining and comparing it to PS1 weren't around for PS1 release.. What a mess that was ! They probably came along a couple of years in and are now sitting on their high horses making comparisons.

If you don't like this FREE game in its current state then screw off, stop complaining and come back in a few years when its matured into the game you want. If it doesn't then you can come back here and laugh at all us who had faith in the dev teams direction. Either way, quit throwing the toys out the pram and grow a pair. Make your decision, stick around and be patient or get lost.

[Rolfski]

Originally Posted by Ravenclaw

I guess you have not been keeping up with the tonnes of videos and interviews with Matt Higby, believe me they IS a lot of communication going on, and lot more than we seen in any game in the past... tho they really should have a forum area dedicated to all those videos

Yup this is one the biggest reasons some PS1 vets are so disappointed:

• People are uniformed because all the tidbits of info, scattered in multiple interviews and Q&A's.
  We should really have a "what we know so far of the future of PS2" thread that is pinned to the top and collects all the info over time.
  A topic like this would clean up a lot of the negativity we're seeing atm. Maybe some people have the time to help Hamma setting it up.
• Many people fail to see the big picture. They think that what we are playing at launch is going to be the final game. Fortunately, it's not even close. We're playing a bare bones version atm that in three years will be seen as alfa.
• SOE has so far not properly presented us a clear vision of how they think this game will look like in 3 years. That doesn't mean they don't have the ideas and ambitions for this. People that were lucky to visit their HQ like Hamma can probably confirm they're sitting on tons of wild stuff. Problem is that we decide the future so they don't want to set too much in stone yet.

[Hamma]

Originally Posted by Rolfski

We should really have a "what we know so far of the future of PS2" thread that is pinned to the top and collects all the info over time.
A topic like this would clean up a lot of the negativity we're seeing atm. Maybe some people have the time to help Hamma setting it up.

Looks like we have a volunteer!!! :P

[Rolfski]

Originally Posted by Hamma

Looks like we have a volunteer!!! :P

I saw that coming, that's why I said "Maybe some people have the time to help"..

Seriously though, when the initial topic is set up, I'm happy to contribute my share and dissect a video interview.

[Helwyr]

Originally Posted by Rolfski

Yup this is one the biggest reasons some PS1 vets are so disappointed:

• People are uniformed because all the tidbits of info, scattered in multiple interviews and Q&A's.
  We should really have a "what we know so far of the future of PS2" thread that is pinned to the top and collects all the info over time.
  A topic like this would clean up a lot of the negativity we're seeing atm. Maybe some people have the time to help Hamma setting it up.
• Many people fail to see the big picture. They think that what we are playing at launch is going to be the final game. Fortunately, it's not even close. We're playing a bare bones version atm that in three years will be seen as alfa.
• SOE has so far not properly presented us a clear vision of how they think this game will look like in 3 years. That doesn't mean they don't have the ideas and ambitions for this. People that were lucky to visit their HQ like Hamma can probably confirm they're sitting on tons of wild stuff. Problem is that we decide the future so they don't want to set too much in stone yet.

The Developers do communicate a lot with the community, and I agree that it's often done in a way that is so casual and haphazard that each piece of information only ever reaches a small amount of the community. I'm still waiting to hear what was said at the SOE Live Planetside panels, there was one video by PS2TV and that's it so far. That's an official event, never mind all the discussions on twitch streams, Twitter, and forums I never go to like Reddit.

However, I think you're putting too much value on some of this information. Higby saying we're doing X and you'll see it in the next major patch or the one after can be taken as solid info on what we will see in game. But if he says we're thinking about doing X, or we'll introduce Y some time after launch, that's not solid info on what will definitely be in PS2. It's just what's on the Developers mind at that particular time and could easily change long before steps are made to implement it on the live servers. Don't get me wrong, I like to hear what's on the minds of the developers in regard to PS2. I just don't think some of that stuff can be taken as gospel or solid promises of future content like some seem to be interpreting.

[Rolfski]

Originally Posted by Helwyr

Don't get me wrong, I like to hear what's on the minds of the developers in regard to PS2. I just don't think some of that stuff can be taken as gospel or solid promises of future content like some seem to be interpreting.

I agree, there's no guarantee whatsoever about particular features being implemented. However, with all this blind, outrageous negativity you see with some of these PS1 vets, it will help to calm people down a bit and show them that the devs:
- Have played PS1 and thought of every mechanic and what it possibly can do for PS2
- Do listen to these forums and think a lot of heavily discussed issues like tank mechanics.
- When they decide to go for different mechanics like class system, there's a reasoning behind it.