So i'm going back to church!

[firecrackerNC]

even if there was a heaven and a hell,all we hear is 1 side of the story(aka god or jesus,whoever the fuck he is) as far as we know Devils just some party animal that loves beer and sex so god banned him and made stuff up about him,so mabey Heavens the old boring place and hells where the parties at,and anyway i like hot weather,heaven seems too cold for me

[Mtx]

Originally posted by Terran Sniper
Mtx, i have to take offense to that

YES!!!

I knew I could get a better fish.

Originally posted by Terran Sniper
You cant just go around spittin on my religion

So you openly admit that Cathlicisum is a religion? About time one of you maniacs admited the truth. Christianity is the belief in God (trinity for Lex). It is not a religion therefore you have just admited that being a Cathlic and being a Christian are two entirely different things. Thank you for your honesty.

Originally posted by Terran Sniper
[B]So, in my book, Ill be lookin down on you from heaven while you sit in the Playboy mansion's photo studio with your hands tied behind your back (my idea of hell).
so, i curse your name and will personally piss on your grave when you die

When you're burning in Hell and you can't figureout why I'll hold up the ten commandments. Read the commandment about "false Gods" and think about that as you pray to your statue of Mary. Then consider the fact that your "religion" creates saints and makes up the rules as it goes around and then.. just maybe.. you'll realize how stupid you really are.

*edit*

Don't worry about me going to Hell. All I have to do is pay the Cathlic church a large sum of money and all is forgiven. Sucker!

[Doobz]

Please, i BEG somebody to move this thread to political debate...

[Yuyi]

This thread sux Nuff said

[Lexington_Steele]

Originally posted by Mtx
Christianity is the belief in God (trinity for Lex).

Mtx, what would we do without you.

[Vick]

Originally posted by Pattywick
I think church has some good stuff in it like when they discuss about hmm important stuff about life. But when they go on about sheep and god and how we should do everything he demands thats the bad stuff about it

Good!

Originally posted by Terran Sniper
Mtx, i have to take offense to that . You cant just go around spittin on my religion just cause some horndog pastors got too aroused to pay attention to their eternal chastity.
So, in my book, Ill be lookin down on you from heaven while you sit in the Playboy mansion's photo studio with your hands tied behind your back (my idea of hell).
so, i curse your name and will personally piss on your grave when you die

Bad!

Now, who wants to guess who is older?

Edit:

Originally posted by 1024
I'm agnostic.

Me too. What a great word, I love it.

[AztecWarrior]

This thread sucks.

You have trolls who flame and vultures who come down on them.

Like Hamma said, politics and religion suck for debating because you can't win.

[Lonehunter]

Originally posted by AztecWarrior
Another thread turned into a battlefield:

You know, it's funny. Squeeky doesn't like me posting pics of some guy with his finger up his nose but he doesn't say anything about dead bodies.

[AztecWarrior]

Originally posted by Lonehunter187
You know, it's funny. Squeeky doesn't like me posting pics of some guy with his finger up his nose but he doesn't say anything about dead bodies.

It's because the finger in the nose is gross.

[Happy lil Elf]

However, I would like to get past all of that and ask Hamma a question:

what do you live for? and knowing that that which you live for is irrelevant anyway, why do you continue to live?

it's the ultimate athiestic question, and I still have not found an answer for it.

seems to me that the second an athiest comes to truly understand his belief, he would simply commit suicide.

so can any athiests out there answer that for me? thanks

That's an easy question. I live for my friends. I live for my family. I live for the girl I love. I live for that feeling of euphoria I get when I haven't eaten all day and I scarf down the first handfull of McDonald's fries. I live for that great moment after really good sex where not only did you get off but you know you got your girl off, and more than once. I live for hanging out and being a total geek by playing DnD for eight hours straight. I live for arguing with people over important and unimportant things. I live for many things, the things I consider to be good in life. The happy memories, the good times and even for the bad ones that I can look back on with a meloncholy feeling every once in awhile. In short I live for the sake of life and everything it is shows me and allows me to experience on a daily basis and will never understand why anyone would need anything more to live for.

That said I think there is *something* that started this thing we call existance. That's about as far as my beliefs go. That it, whatever it is, cares or is even still in existance is where my beliefs start to differ rfom most of the major religions.

P.S. Horizontal scrolling is teh gay.

[Mr1337Duck]

You belive in the trinity, right mtx? You belive that if you repent and ask for forgiveness, you can be saved from your sin, right?

The Christian religion is divided into groups, the original and largest is the Catholic church, then Luther split off and a bunch of new denominations formed. The churches have just slightly different ways of doing things, but they are all united under Christ.


Yes, I actually do know what I'm talking about.

The reason they pray to Mary is because they belive that sinners are not worthy of praying to Jesus directly, so instead they pray to Mary, who passes the prayers on to Jesus. That's what that's all about, if there was a misunderstanding on your part.

[Mtx]

Originally posted by Lexington_Steele


Mtx, what would we do without you.

Does that mean I can come over tonight?

[Tex]

Originally posted by Mr1337Duck
Yes, I actually do know what I'm talking about.

The reason they pray to Mary is because they belive that sinners are not worthy of praying to Jesus directly, so instead they pray to Mary, who passes the prayers on to Jesus. That's what that's all about, if there was a misunderstanding on your part.

Actually, this is incorrect.

The idea of praying to God and Jesus is exactly what praying is all about. Catholics pray to God/Jesus just like all other Christians do, there is no difference.

The one thing that is different however, is that we also recognize the ability to ask saints, and Mary specfically, to pray to God on our behalf.

This does have a Biblical founding and I will look it up if you like...

Unfortunately, many Catholics (especially the Hispanic community) have taken Mary and elevated her to almost the same level as Jesus, and in many cases Mary is exalted more than Christ himself.

Now just because there are dissenters in a religion, (like there are in every one) doesn't mean that the root beliefs of the religion are wrong. It just means that the professed followers of said religion simply misunderstood or are taking it out of context.

Originally posted by Mtx
So you openly admit that Cathlicisum is a religion? About time one of you maniacs admited the truth. Christianity is the belief in God (trinity for Lex). It is not a religion therefore you have just admited that being a Cathlic and being a Christian are two entirely different things. Thank you for your honesty.

Catholicism is a religion. Ok, so how do you go from being a religion to NOT being a Christian? Catholicism is a religion centered around the belief that Christ is our Lord and Savior. Therefore, as a Catholic, you are by default, a Christian.

Originally posted by Mtx
Read the commandment about "false Gods" and think about that as you pray to your statue of Mary.

One thing we definately do NOT do is pray to statues. Idolatry is strictly forbidden as you well know. The statues that you see in church are merely there to provide a sense of humility. Much like seeing a photograph of a Jewish concentration camp makes you feel more emotional about the plight of the **** in WWII, so does viewing a statue of Jesus nailed to the Cross.

The Bible strictly forbids praying to falls Gods and worshipping statues. But it says nothing about simply making statues as decoration.

Originally posted by Mtx
All I have to do is pay the Cathlic church a large sum of money and all is forgiven.

Indulgences were a practice used by the Church in the middle ages as a form of penance. Back then, the church was, in many ways, the Government of the local township. It handled all legal matters, distributed news, helped the poor and the sick, and provided many other essential functions to the town.

When one confesses sins, they are given a penance to do to help them relieve themselves of that guilt. This penance comes in many forms, from meditation, to reading the Bible, praying, informal community service, and so on.

Back then, one of the ways penance was dealt with was through money. The idea being that, you work hard for your money by providing a service to the community. So your penance will be to work for the community on behalf of the Church.

As an idea unto itself, it made perfect sense.

However, money corrupts as we all know. Unfortunately, there were several people that were consumed by greed and this practice got out of hand. It was stopped soon after and forbidden to be practiced any more.

Originally posted by Happy lil' Elf
That's an easy question. I live for my friends. I live for my family. I live for the girl I love. I live for that feeling of euphoria I get when I haven't eaten all day and I scarf down the first handfull of McDonald's fries. I live for that great moment after really good sex where not only did you get off but you know you got your girl off, and more than once. I live for hanging out and being a total geek by playing DnD for eight hours straight. I live for arguing with people over important and unimportant things. I live for many things, the things I consider to be good in life. The happy memories, the good times and even for the bad ones that I can look back on with a meloncholy feeling every once in awhile. In short I live for the sake of life and everything it is shows me and allows me to experience on a daily basis and will never understand why anyone would need anything more to live for.

That said I think there is *something* that started this thing we call existance. That's about as far as my beliefs go. That it, whatever it is, cares or is even still in existance is where my beliefs start to differ rfom most of the major religions.

P.S. Horizontal scrolling is teh gay.

ok, that makes perfect sense. would you agree that you could sum up all of that by saying:

"I live for pleasure."

Pleasure, not as in a guilty pleasure, but the idea that you live because it feels good to exist.

Would you also agree that those pleasures are temporary? Meaning that, you have memories of all the past things you have done with your family, your girlfriend, your mcdonalds fries...but what happens when those memories are gone? You will die some day, and those memories will be erased. What good will they do you then?

I guess my question is: using your belief, who do you think is happier right now:

Hitler, or Mother Theresa?

The answer of course is neither! Because they're both dead!

Therefore, if you define your life by your pleasures, then sure enough, you will lose your life when you die because you will cease receiving pleasure and you won't remember the pleasures you've experienced.

Once you reach that conclusion, that everything you do is irrelevant, then the conclusion is obvious: might as well just get it over with! what are you waiting for? Are you looking forward to all the pain and hardship that you have ahead of you? Are you going to remember those things when you die?

Now believe me, I am not advocating suicide here...I'm just trying to draw out some discussion.

You mentioned that you do believe in a creator...but that's it. Well, why stop there? Have you ever thought more about that creator? Why He created us? What did He have in mind? Were we simply an experiment set forth upon this planet to live and die?

I am not trying to say that: "hey man, pick a religion."

but rather, just wondering why you have decided to stop questioning?

and yes, scrolling sucks

[Happy lil Elf]

Please god let us get off this page >_<

Just for pleasure? Not really. More like for a happy life. Similar but "just for pleasure" carries some negative overtones to it which I really don't think apply and also makes it an extremely easy phrase to twist.

As far as the creator goes, I don't really think there is some sentient being watching over everything or that, if it does exist, it has any particular interest in humanity. I also definately don't think, again if it did exist, that we could even have the faintest clue what he/she/it wants from us or for us to do. I know, the Bible. Thing is I think the Bible has some neat stories in it, kinda like Grim's Fairy Tales or The Wheel of Time, and that's it. Not the word of God, not the word of the son of God's disciples. Just a book. If you need moral instruction it's a good thing to read but otherwise /shrug.

Now then, the argument about the Bible I'm not getting into. I've been through it too many times and basically it always seems to end up with one person saying "No it's not!" and another saying "Yes it is!". That's boring and annoying as hell after the 10th time

I guess what it comes down to is people wanting to believe there's something more than just *this* world. Again what I don't get is why people need to believe there's something more. Just live your life, love your family, find some good friends and try to live a good life.

Oh and Lonehunter, edit that damn picture out. Thanks.

[Kaltagesta]

to quote terry pratchett:

"If he didn;t want them to eat the fruit, why did he make the tree?"

and i have asked my christian friend that, to which he replied 'so that god to test our free will. Right, so know WE get kicked out of the garden of eden because of what two people did x amount of time ago, while being led by the devil, a fallen angel [the angels of which have no free will... so.... he fell... somehow?]

which leads me onto my second point - why did he create us? Well, to see if we'd love him, given free will, correct? because he was basically bored with the angels he'd created which had no free will. but if he is omnipotent, how would he get boreD? and even if he did, wouldnt he already know if we were going?

and as for heaven and hell... why?

why did he create hell, why does he let us go there when we die, why dont we all just go to heaven? When i asked my friend this, he said god doesnt need reasons, hes omnipotent etc to which i said 'thats not logical' and of course he came back wiuth the ultimate retort - 'we cannot understand the ways of god' ... which basically means 'i dont know'.

So, in closure, theres no way you can ever win a debate about religion. you learn nothing, only that your belief that the other person is wrong is strengthened. There was this guy who thought that the way and taxctics that religious people use when arguing over their religions were stupid and so he created a religion about a saucer that flew around pluto with a small cat inside it or something, and basically nobody could prove any loop-holes in his argument, becaus he argues in the same way the other religions did.