Should being revived count as a death?

[Stardouser]

Originally Posted by Anderz

So give the killer their kill, the reviver their revive, and the revivee an uncounted death. Who cares how realistic this may or may not be; if you want better team work in the game, this is the only answer.

Realistic? Thanks for bringing realism up, because it allows the introduction of a sensational argument: So in real life, everyone who has to be resuscitated should be granted a death certificate and treated as a new person? Or does being revived mean you didn't die?

An extreme and sensational argument but that's where the realism argument goes.

[Anderz]

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Realistic? Thanks for bringing realism up, because it allows the introduction of a sensational argument: So in real life, everyone who has to be resuscitated should be granted a death certificate and treated as a new person? Or does being revived mean you didn't die?

An extreme and sensational argument but that's where the realism argument goes.

The realism debate never ends well because it takes the focus away for what's important: gameplay, and what will better serve it.

[Xyntech]

Originally Posted by Anderz

The realism debate never ends well because it takes the focus away for what's important: gameplay, and what will better serve it.

Also, real or not, it doesn't matter what is "obvious" or "straightforward" either.

K/D whores are bad for the game, but they will also be present in the game. You could try to actively get rid of those players, but you would probably lose a lot of other players in the process. PS2 needs large numbers of players to function properly, so let's just assume that we will be playing alongside a few of these types of players.

To that end, I'd rather support a system that improves those players tendency to contribute to the fight, no matter how convoluted or realistic or weird it may be.

It's not like this is that important of a topic, but I just have to side with the one option being slightly better for gameplay than the other, and gameplay should always be the most important concern.

[Stardouser]

Originally Posted by Anderz

The realism debate never ends well because it takes the focus away for what's important: gameplay, and what will better serve it.

That's why I don't like to use realism as a marker for what game mechanics should or shouldn't be, but you mentioned it, so I took the opportunity

[Dairian]

Originally Posted by Goku

I always wished during the merit kill streaks you could be revived to avoid having to redo. If you are revived you it shouldn't count as one imo.

When you die you die. And if you are revived you were still dead or you couldn't have be revived. And I believe it should count in your stats. If not people being followed by a medic could have crazy K/D.

So what your saying is if I kill an enemy and they are revived I shouldn't get the kill if they are revived by a medic?

Or are you just saying this for achievements?

[Xyntech]

Originally Posted by Dairian

If not people being followed by a medic could have crazy K/D.

Problem?

K/D ratio is generally an irrelevant stat.

[Dairian]

Originally Posted by Xyntech

Problem?

K/D ratio is generally an irrelevant stat.

That it is but it will be in the game because they are releasing all information. And if it is irrelevant why does it matter if it counts or not?

[Toppopia]

Would it be possible to show Kills/Deaths. Deaths/Revives. And show kill/deaths not counting revives, and kill/death that does count revives, then have total amount of times revived? Is that possible to account for all situations? So someone who cares about K/D can only look at the kill/death that does count reviving as not dying, and such?

[Xyntech]

Originally Posted by Dairian

That it is but it will be in the game because they are releasing all information. And if it is irrelevant why does it matter if it counts or not?

Because there are people who care about it. These people are idiots, but it's hard to change their minds. So it would be better to let them pad their stats through a mechanism that's better for team work than to just leave them alone to camp in a useless spot for hours.

Glorifying K/D front and center in kill screens and stat screens would be bad, because it would encourage obsessing over K/D ratio and make more players think it was an important stat. Encouraging players who already play this way to do things that are better for their empire won't encourage this style of gameplay though, it will only help team work.

It probably won't help it much though. Those players can be pretty stupid.

[DarkApothecary]

No that it just stupid, if people die even from getting revived I'm not goning to run over there and save them, it's stupid.

[Dairian]

Originally Posted by Xyntech

Because there are people who care about it. These people are idiots, but it's hard to change their minds. So it would be better to let them pad their stats through a mechanism that's better for team work than to just leave them alone to camp in a useless spot for hours.

Glorifying K/D front and center in kill screens and stat screens would be bad, because it would encourage obsessing over K/D ratio and make more players think it was an important stat. Encouraging players who already play this way to do things that are better for their empire won't encourage this style of gameplay though, it will only help team work.

It probably won't help it much though. Those players can be pretty stupid.

Then lets not give them a mechanic that can let them pad there stats. Letting the stat not count when they get revived will just boost there ego.

[Crator]

Simple fix, glorify the team based stats and keep the non-team based stats in the background. But still, let those that wish to argue over K/D stats if they want to. They're going to anyways. And if you come across someone trying to argue with you about K/D just show them your team based stats. If their team based stats suck in comparison then just push that into their face and tell them they suck at the game b/c of it.... Problem solved... Think of it as a training tool for non-team based players....

[TeaLeaf]

No.

Mainly because it stops stupid players that care too much about KDR from refusing to revive near the action. It's more to stop hard working medics being let down by idiots than anything else.

[SKYeXile]

no point in even having a K/D ratio if the amount of kills dont equal the amount of (deaths-suicides) at that point you may aswell award everybody in your squad a kill when somebody in your squad gets a kill, you're making stats that meaningless.

[Stardouser]

Originally Posted by SKYeXile

no point in even having a K/D ratio if the amount of kills dont equal the amount of (deaths-suicides) at that point you may aswell award everybody in your squad a kill when somebody in your squad gets a kill, you're making stats that meaningless.

No, that's not true. Deaths that are revived aren't deaths, the real issue is whether or not kills should be split into kills and takedowns.