News: Higby's Beta Update (Nov 7)

[ThGlump]

Im little concerned about tug of war captures. It seems they replacing skill with numbers in smaller fights. On bases with multiple points, when you have less (say 5-8) ppl, but are defending 2 points very well so 12 cant get to it, but they can just go to third point and since they have greater numbers theyll will. Not fan of that.

But i like that they reintroducing resecures. That was my favorite part in PS1. Coming in in last minute, fight through defenders and resecure it. I just wish they picked another method for do that in PS2.

[Beerbeer]

I don't like the health regen at all. If they're worried about people dying too much, they should raise the TTK across the board instead, and give people more ammo. This will allow people the "feel" that they are able o do more than an artificial heal.

[Crator]

Originally Posted by ThGlump

Im little concerned about tug of war captures. It seems they replacing skill with numbers in smaller fights. On bases with multiple points, when you have less (say 5-8) ppl, but are defending 2 points very well so 12 cant get to it, but they can just go to third point and since they have greater numbers theyll will. Not fan of that.

Did I miss something in the patch notes? I just read them again am I'm not seeing where they say if you're required to capture all nodes. I just assumed that was the case.

[sylphaen]

Originally Posted by ThGlump

Im little concerned about tug of war captures. It seems they replacing skill with numbers in smaller fights. On bases with multiple points, when you have less (say 5-8) ppl, but are defending 2 points very well so 12 cant get to it, but they can just go to third point and since they have greater numbers theyll will. Not fan of that.

But i like that they reintroducing resecures. That was my favorite part in PS1. Coming in in last minute, fight through defenders and resecure it. I just wish they picked another method for do that in PS2.

One thing not to forget is that they may eventually introduce more diversity in capture points. Maybe we will see the return of hacking and command consoles.

Edit: More thinking about regen

While I do not support the change, I have to admit that it was a pain to heal yourself solo without wasting consumables for those 3 reasons:
- changing classes does not refill health
- as a medic, you cannot heal yourself with the medic gun
- as a medic, the charge for the area-heal ability starts at zero

So unless I missed an undocumented mechanism to heal yourself solo, you either must use a consumable (if it is unlocked) or change to medic, wait for the ability to charge up and use it.

I agree that it is kind of frustrating to have to wait like that next to a terminal in order to heal yourself. However, on the field, I still think it is more interesting to force a player to take risks and go get some healing; what was wrong is how difficult it was to solo heal yourself when reaching a terminal; there was nothing wrong about having to reach it first.

I feel more intensity by running around at low health, trying to survive when my medic has been shot than seeing heals happen magically (no attrition, no supply chain, no forced repositioning, no choice involved). Of course, the cooldown is very long and regen is slow but I still do not understand the decision. I also think the change will affect those occasional survival low-health situations involving snipers and low-pop combat. If a guy got isolated into a base, why should he be able to hide and wait for regen instead of having to take more risks ? IMO, It's unfair for those who lowered his health down. I could find some situations where such a mechanic would have given me the upper hand. On the other hand, it can't be unfair since everyone has it by default.

Of course, I do not understand what they are trying to do so we'll have to see how it plays out, but I wish a more elegant solution could have been found.

[ThGlump]

Originally Posted by Crator

Did I miss something in the patch notes? I just read them again am I'm not seeing where they say if you're required to capture all nodes. I just assumed that was the case.

As i understand it there wont be any capturing points. You will be directly capturing the base just by standing near a point. If VS have 3 people near A, and 5 people near B, while NC have 12 people near C, the base will start turning to NC. You wont capture points.

[EVILPIG]

Originally Posted by sylphaen

One thing not to forget is that they may eventually introduce more diversity in capture points. Maybe we will see the return of hacking and command consoles.

Edit: More thinking about regen

While I do not support the change, I have to admit that it was a pain to heal yourself solo without wasting consumables for those 3 reasons:
- changing classes does not refill health
- as a medic, you cannot heal yourself with the medic gun
- as a medic, the charge for the area-heal ability starts at zero

So unless I missed an undocumented mechanism to heal yourself solo, you either must use a consumable (if it is unlocked) or change to medic, wait for the ability to charge up and use it.

I agree that it is kind of frustrating to have to wait like that next to a terminal in order to heal yourself. However, on the field, I still think it is more interesting to force a player to take risks and go get some healing; what was wrong is how difficult it was to solo heal yourself when reaching a terminal; there was nothing wrong about having to reach it first.

I feel more intensity by running around at low health, trying to survive when my medic has been shot than seeing heals happen magically (no attrition, no supply chain, no forced repositioning, no choice involved). Of course, the cooldown is very long and regen is slow but I still do not understand the decision. I also think the change will affect those occasional survival low-health situations involving snipers and low-pop combat. If a guy got isolated into a base, why should he be able to hide and wait for regen instead of having to take more risks ? IMO, It's unfair for those who lowered his health down. I could find some situations where such a mechanic would have given me the upper hand. On the other hand, it can't be unfair since everyone has it by default.

Of course, I do not understand what they are trying to do so we'll have to see how it plays out, but I wish a more interesting solution could have been found.

Last I heard regarding this, was that they plan to implement multiple capture methods. Perhaps, by base type.

[sylphaen]

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

Last I heard regarding this, was that they plan to implement multiple capture methods. Perhaps, by base type.

Thanks for the info, that's great news. With new continents, there will also be more room for diversity.

[Crator]

Still confused by that. So you are saying you think you have to stand by something that allows you to capture a base, but that thing is not a capture point? Even though the patch notes talk about some bases having multiple capture points while others only have one. I don't see anywhere in the patch notes that tells us how exactly that works tbh. So we are just jumping to conclusions without any reference to back it up.

[ThGlump]

Yea no capture points that you can capture and move on. When they talk about capture points in new system that mean point, where if you are near, you contributing to capture base. But that capture point will never turn to be yours. If you stay alone at point C and there is no enemy at A,B or even C point range is big, you start capturing base. As one enemy step into any of those points, capturing will stop as you even each other. If you leave to kill that guy, you leave capture point and enemy start winning base back.

Thats what i understood from patch notes, and patch stream. But i could be wrong.

[Crator]

Ok, I just read the patch notes again, to make sure something wasn't being missed. I think you are incorrect about no capture point. The starting sentence in the tug-of-war description says this:

Currently bases are captured by a ticket race that is initiated when a base control node gets flipped and starts generating tickets, those tickets are then multiplied based on influence your empire has on the base. In this system two factors, control node ownership and adjacent territory control dictate the victor of the base capture.

This tells me that the current system requires control node ownership.

With the new system, there will be three factors that determine the capture of the base, control node ownership, adjacent territory control and player leverage.

This tells me the new system also requires control node ownership. So same as what it was before the patch with added requirement of player leverage.

Player leverage will be the number of people you have simultaneously influencing a control node. More players near the control node = more leverage = you capture the base faster.

This tells me they are talking about a single node. The rest of the paragraph points to him talking about a single node as well to capture. The range at which you have to be from the single node has been increased so you don't have to be right on it is all. Also I think when he put the "= you capture the base faster" while using a singular reference to a control node it didn't include a base that has multiple nodes in the statement. I think that's where you are getting confused.

For multi-control node facilities such as Biolabs, or outposts like The Crown, having people locking down the nodes becomes more important than just rushing to the next node to flip it, not only because the people posted up on that node are keeping it from being captured by an enemy, but also because they're helping to move the capture needle faster for your empire.

In the above, he does talk about multi-nodes which is towards the end of the patch notes. Which he states you must have people lock down nodes, meaning more then one.

[Hamma]

By the way - earlier today on Health Regen:

[Kail]

Originally Posted by Crator

Ok, I just read the patch notes again, to make sure something wasn't being missed. I think you are incorrect about no capture point. The starting sentence in the tug-of-war description says this:



This tells me that the current system requires control node ownership.



This tells me the new system also requires control node ownership. So same as what it was before the patch with added requirement of player leverage.



This tells me they are talking about a single node. The rest of the paragraph points to him talking about a single node as well to capture. The range at which you have to be from the single node has been increased so you don't have to be right on it is all. Also I think when he put the "= you capture the base faster" while using a singular reference to a control node it didn't include a base that has multiple nodes in the statement. I think that's where you are getting confused.



In the above, he does talk about multi-nodes which is towards the end of the patch notes. Which he states you must have people lock down nodes, meaning more then one.

Yeah - the way I understood it is that it's basically exactly what we have now with three changes:

1. The range to be included in a control point is much larger, so you don't literally have to stand around it
2. The more people you have standing around it, up to a point, also increases how fast your respective color bar fills up
3. Instead of just beating the other colors, you'll be subtracting them as you fill

I think of it like attacking currently - you need to have a person sticking around a point because it'll start auto-flipping back to the defender's side. With these changes you're not just baby sitting, you're contributing.

[NewSith]

Originally Posted by Hamma

By the way - earlier today on Health Regen:

https://twitter.com/j_smedley/status/266638003626192897

https://twitter.com/j_smedley/status/266638092390240257

I'd underline the second statement...

It's not the amount of medics people are worried about, it's about long range combat turning into a slow crap of duck'n'cover 'till you're bored...

[Crator]

Originally Posted by NewSith

I'd underline the second statement...

It's not the amount of medics people are worried about, it's about long range combat turning into a slow crap of duck'n'cover 'till you're bored...

Wouldn't that be a valid tactic for teamwork to take care of? Hold the guy by throwing a sniper at em and then flank him with your other teammates.

[Helwyr]

Originally Posted by NewSith

I'd underline the second statement...

It's not the amount of medics people are worried about, it's about long range combat turning into a slow crap of duck'n'cover 'till you're bored...

Where does this sort of combat occur for you where players are killed in a single fire fight with their health bar slowly knocked down by attrition of long range shots?

I don't think that's ever occurred to me, it's just not the way fights are won or lost. TTK is too fast, and if it isn't fast at the range your engaging at you've probably made a tactical error by engaging the enemy under those circumstances with that weapon.

The time's I do have partial health is after a fight, from falling damage, or FF/bad driving.