Balance passes and our cert points

[LONGFELLA KOJ]

I just wanted to see what people thought about this.

If you decide to dump a ton of cert points, like 1000+, into something and then they nerf it to hell, is it fair that you just have to smile and take it? I haven't had a chance to read the fine print that SOE has put out with the guns/gear, but I'm sure they have covered themselves.

Cert points = hours/minutes/seconds of your life playing for a goal.
Station cash = Your hard earned money.

Just wanted to get a feel for the playerbase's opinion.

While I wait, I'll go ahead an get these pants down so they aren't in the way when SOE starts working.

[Rockit]

Yeah I thought about this too. Trouble is how would you quantify the nerf objectively for a refund. Say if they nerfed a weapon 20%, give you 20% of your purchase back but who is going to come to that number everyone can agree on. Also what of the case when they buff something? Pay them back? LOL. I get where you are coming from but the complexities involved will likely deter any action.

[Assist]

If there was a determined amount of certs you could get sure, but afaik you continue to gain certs even after getting 100?

It's the nature of games updating, just how it goes. I just dropped 3500 certs into my Galaxy because I figured one day it'll be useful :P I've got most everything I want by now and I still have 17 ranks to go. Which is sometimes like another 32,000 certs coming! or something like that, i think my math is wrong :<

[LONGFELLA KOJ]

Originally Posted by Rockit

Yeah I thought about this too. Trouble is how would you quantify the nerf objectively for a refund. Say if they nerfed a weapon 20%, give you 20% of your purchase back but who is going to come to that number everyone can agree on. Also what of the case when they buff something? Pay them back? LOL. I get where you are coming from but the complexities involved will likely deter any action.

That's a good point about the buff scenerio. But, if this happens, people who do not have the new buffed item have the choice to invest in it. You on the other hand do not have a choice if the situation goes the opposite way. You are stuck with it.

[MrBloodworth]

This falls under "Caveat emptor". You choose to buy it, its your. The end. This is how it works in reality.

[Sledgecrushr]

When I bought my skyguard I ended up only using it for one evening, it sucked. Thing about dumping huge amounts of cert points into the liberator and then they nerf it, well, you were probably getting inflated amounts of certs with the liberator anyways. In the end it will still be servicable just not an op flying tank death machine.

[Tox]

I don't see why there is any need to get refunded in any way. Maybe it would be appropriate to reset some certs and gain back some of the cert points. However, at the end of the day if you bought that cert because of some precocieved value and then the value is changed by a balancing pass you still have the cert and full use of it so whats the problem?

Flavor of the month/week/patch certs are just that, and offering a refund just reinforces that tactically migratory playstyle. Which, complicates overall game balance.

[MrBloodworth]

This falls under "Caveat emptor". You choose to buy it, its your. The end. This is how it works in reality.

[MrBloodworth]

Err, site hiccup!

[Bocheezu]

I don't understand the people that buy stuff like zephers, HE turrets, and grenade launchers knowing full well that the thing is overpowered (that's why they bought it) and then demand a refund when it gets nerfed. No one said the thing would be overpowered forever. You buy it to use it for the period that it's overpowered, nothing more. As the game progresses, there will be new weapons that will make old weapons obsolete; that is to be expected, otherwise nobody would buy any of the new items. Every weapon purchase is temporary power.

As far as cert purchases are concerned, I'm sure they'll eventually come up with a way to pay SC to recert, they would be dumb to miss out on that money-making opportunity.

[ringring]

Originally Posted by Rockit

Yeah I thought about this too. Trouble is how would you quantify the nerf objectively for a refund. Say if they nerfed a weapon 20%, give you 20% of your purchase back but who is going to come to that number everyone can agree on. Also what of the case when they buff something? Pay them back? LOL. I get where you are coming from but the complexities involved will likely deter any action.

The simplest case is the 2nd arm for the burster. I bought it and since then it's been through several iterations of nerfs and buffs.

And quite right too.

Are we really saying that either SOE can't do that or maybe that they should be refunding people on every nerf? It can't work like that.

[james]

Not going to happen, F2P games nerf all the time and you get nothing back. I am worried this game is going to go on this nerf cycle for weapons. If you look at the 3 new NC weapons they all where the best debatable in the class.

[LONGFELLA KOJ]

Well, I hate for this to become an "I'm looking for a refund" thread. Because I'm not. I too believe in the buyer beware motto. So, much like all of you, I do my research on a product before I buy it. And, by purchasing it I understand that it will remain in a state of flux as far as balance.

It's the group of people who cannot play as much as they would like. So they choose to invest the time they play (cert points) into 1 particular play style. Then along comes a patch and poof! your last 2 weeks of playtime has been pissed into irrelevance. Your 1000+ cert points you just invested into your sunderer just got bitchslapped by the C4 buff and now you have a timer every 20 minutes. This is a hypothetical example of course.

How about a token like the server swap idea from Higby. You buy it with Station Cash and it allows you to reclaim a portion of your cert points back. Like a recert in old PS1.

Just tossing it out there.

And none of this is coming from the fact I'm on the fence about that 1000+ nanoweave investment

[Rockit]

They should just give everyone a free re-spec every so often. Would that suffice?

[Wahooo]

There is a really weird middle ground here but I would say there is also a difference between buying something with one intent and finding out it was not what you expected... ie skyguard. I bought it thinking it was a weapon intended to kill aircraft not just announce your presence and die to them. I demanded a refund and got it.

I purchased many other items, the grenade launcher BECAUSE it is OP. As was said I can't really expect a refund for a nerf.
Then I used SC to kit out the lib, the buff/nerf cycle on it has yet to be done, but the long and short of it as long as the weapons I bought stay useful even if they are nerfed I can't complain.

The issue is did you spend money on something they nerfed to uselessness? I don't see that having happened with any weapon yet. There are some that may have been a waste of money up front like the Jackhammer and Skyguard, and there have been nerfs that relative to their initial worth are significant, but I still don't think anything has been OVER nerfed (since release) to the point it is not living up to the intended original function.