A question of slugs

[almalino]

I play NC all the time. Out of curiocity I tried VS MAX Blueshifts on both hands.
O man. It is automatic sniper rifle on the 50 meters range.

After that I tried NC MAX with slugs and cannot kill a shit at 50 meters. And we need to pres buttons every time to fir that disturbs aiming. Terrible

[War Barney]

Originally Posted by almalino

I play NC all the time. Out of curiocity I tried VS MAX Blueshifts on both hands.
O man. It is automatic sniper rifle on the 50 meters range.

After that I tried NC MAX with slugs and cannot kill a shit at 50 meters. And we need to pres buttons every time to fir that disturbs aiming. Terrible

And don't forget the larger clips and ability to turn corners while shooting which comes with it. but I'm sure some VS will come to tell us how its far better to have a MAX which is pretty good at the 0-5m range than one which is awesome up to 50m

[almalino]

Originally Posted by War Barney

And don't forget the larger clips and ability to turn corners while shooting which comes with it. but I'm sure some VS will come to tell us how its far better to have a MAX which is pretty good at the 0-5m range than one which is awesome up to 50m

Barney, I tested and at 10 meters NC MAX is 100% accurate with slugs if you aim at the body So, it is 10 meters radius, not 5.

[almalino]

TR vs NC Maxes. NC wins at 5 meters ONLY Sooo cool. Sure, NC max is owerpowered. Sure , it strong face to face at 5 meters but then it use is very limited

[War Barney]

Now now thats only a video thats no proof! theres tons of videos showing how the NC MAX will lose at any range beyond 5m against another MAX but that obviously isn't the proof thats needed, no the REAL proof comes from random VS and TR players who have no evidence SAYING our MAX is OP, its on those strong grounds our MAX is constantly nerfed into the ground

[Snoopy]

Yep, that's the proof right there guys. /thread


smh

[almalino]

Just happen to have a duel wityh TR MAX. I had shotguns with slugs on both hands. Not sure what TR MAX had. ~15 meters between us. I think I started to shoot first. Didn't help. I died in a terrible death and TR max was 75% full health on death screen. Pathetic under powered NC MAX.

TR MAX was not even afraid of me. I guess hew knows that NC MAX is useless on 10+ meters distance. There is no reason for him to hide.

[Chewy]

Originally Posted by almalino

(Vid snip)

TR vs NC Maxes. NC wins at 5 meters ONLY Sooo cool. Sure, NC max is owerpowered. Sure , it strong face to face at 5 meters but then it use is very limited

You forgot to say that this video and the other one for NCvVS is VERY old now. Back near launch with stats before any of the shotgun nerfs that I can remember.

Notice the ammo counts. That video has more ammo in each mag and in the pool. Also if that video bothered to show the damage values. All shotguns did more damage back then but I think had different drop values. Can't remember the right stats and don't have any pics of them back then.

Since those videos, there has been at least 2-3 blanket shotgun nerfs and a few buffs to the MAXes small arms resistances with a number of balance changes to most or all TR and VS MAX AI weapons.

[War Barney]

The saddest thing is I try to point out that theres video evidence that our MAX is worse than any other MAX and get greeted by people saying *Ignore videos*... seriously some people are so stupid they say to ignore testing in control conditions as they think random fights where you could be fighting people with 1/4 hp left tells you more about balance...

Sometimes I wonder if thats how soe does their balance, instead of test conditions they just play for 20 mins and see what happens to kill them a lot and which guns they don't like at the time then buff/nerf based on that.

[Chewy]

Originally Posted by War Barney

The saddest thing is I try to point out that theres video evidence that our MAX is worse than any other MAX and get greeted by people saying *Ignore videos*... seriously some people are so stupid they say to ignore testing in control conditions as they think random fights where you could be fighting people with 1/4 hp left tells you more about balance...

Sometimes I wonder if thats how soe does their balance, instead of test conditions they just play for 20 mins and see what happens to kill them a lot and which guns they don't like at the time then buff/nerf based on that.

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/...ing-ai.139234/

That was me. I also posted those tests here, somewhere. I know the pain of doing work and having it ignored or countered with 2 word posts by people that never bother to look at what they see.

Though they do have a point on controlled tests being inaccurate compared to the gameplay from the impossible to count number of details that could, might, will, and never happen. Stats can read one way but act how not how you think. That's why I did a video for every weapon tests and broke down everything I could to basics. Raw mind numbingly weapon use without any added effects to see where foundations lay.

Does it tell the whole story? No, never will.
Does it show the starting point that everything is based off of? Yes.


But, on the other hand. I can see the flaws in my tests. And that a chunk of those tests are now outdated (again) from simple reload time changes. I already reworked the only damage change for MAX AI weapons (Mattock) in the last page but haven't bothered redoing all of the math to reflect the changes in reload times. Even if it's as small as the Scattercannon change, .0XXX, it still effects the TTKs where a reload is needed.

Maybe I should redo the math again in the hopes that something will come out of it in the April balance update. Higby asked about if it would be better changing weapons to fit lacking roles or just have new weapons and has already said that the ESAs for MAXes is getting a pass. Maybe we could see a weapon change or new weapons for MAXes. Maybe.

[Baneblade]

Not to say that controlled environment testing isn't appropriate, but ultimately balance has to be on the battlefield. So I'll take 'perceived' balance in a fight over technical balance in VR.