Is Planetside heading for worse or for better?

[Lartnev]

I tend to use 3rd person when I'm bored and just stare at the cool reload/anchor animations

I'd be happy as long as they kept it for vehicles.

Actually, thinking about it, I use it for hacking. Almost saved me from getting boomered once or twice, but I've always paniced and pressed all kinds of keys to stop the REK hacking and run

[Madcow]

I use third person when repairing vehicles. You're pretty well screwed in first person with nothing but the side of the vehicle in front of you, while you would normally be able to look around and make sure no enemies were approaching realistically. Well, I also use it to dodge lasher orbs as I run like a little baby in my infil armor but that's just cheap tactic.

[SilverLord]

I use third person when I put out from atop a mountain and switch to 3rd person and wait for some guy to come kill me, wait till he gets right there and boom, switch to first and waste him.

[infinite loop]

I find it disturbing that most of you seem to be so happy about the surge nerf. If you all are behind anything that is "better" for the game, you'd realize this quite possibly could be what kills it. Moreso, how does it not bother you that instead of fixing the warping, they're taking the lazy, easy way out? They are appeasing some players while totally alienating others, when fixing the problem would appease both. Seems kinda fucked up doesn't it?

I personally am for fixing warping, which is one of the most annoying things in the game. But removing a playstyle that a very large percentage of the playerbase has been used to for months is like shooting yourself in the foot. Whether you like surgiles or not, it's a piece of the game that offers the variety to appeal to all types of gamers. I see several new goodbye threads in the OF everyday because of the direction this game is taking.

Keep your blinders on guys, but this game is going downhill fast. I'm sticking around till the end, but haven't enjoyed the game anywhere near as much as I used to.

Oh and btw Hamma - kidRiot is probably the most talented player I've ever seen and played with in PS, so I wouldn't take his opinion lightly. It is one that many of the better players hold.

[oddfish]

i think the ability to lean and perhaps a key that lets you turn your head only would be a good alternative to 3rd person in infantry role. Leaning and looking are crucial to battle in my opinion, i was surprised they never incorporated it in the first place..

now, you may commence flaming..

[Breed]

Infinite Loop, the devs have looked into the speed-step issue for a long time and if the people who designed the game cant fix it after so many months then the best thing they can do is aliviate the problem in any way they can until they find another solution.
The only people i see complaining are the surgile bunner hoppers, who are losing their unfair advantage.

Perhaps when the issue is resolved surge can re-introduced to its orginal state, until then i am happy to see the devs responding to such an important issue wit hthe best fix available to them at the time.

Anyone whos sees the Devs as lazy is in my eyes ignorant and perhaps foolish, their workload is immense and anyone who thinks they can do better...then you should go make your own game and see how well it turns out, or even better, shut up and let them get on with their hard work and solve problems more quickly without having to be subjected to pre-pubesent whining.

For the record, i am not whining, this is merely a structured statement :P "STFU n00b" and/or "omfg" were not used

[oddfish]

Breed.. Fuckin' A, brother.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Breed

Infinite Loop, the devs have looked into the speed-step issue for a long time and if the people who designed the game cant fix it after so many months then the best thing they can do is aliviate the problem in any way they can until they find another solution.

First of all, no, that's a horrible solution. Alienating players and causing some to cancel their subscriptions cannot be seen as the "best thing they can do." Honestly, how often do you see warping? What percentage of your deaths can be attributed to it? If it's anything substantial, then you're lying to further your point. Warping sucks, but it isn't this big game-killer that some people make it out to be imo. Regardless of your view on warping, I cannot fathom the potential loss of subscriptions to be worth the short-term appeasement of others.

Originally Posted by Breed

The only people i see complaining are the surgile bunner hoppers, who are losing their unfair advantage.

Lovely stereotype there bud. So is bunny-hopping a pre-requisite to surgile? Funny.

Originally Posted by Breed

Perhaps when the issue is resolved surge can re-introduced to its orginal state, until then i am happy to see the devs responding to such an important issue wit hthe best fix available to them at the time.

Again, how can you say that the loss of subscriptions now will be worth it long-term?

Originally Posted by Breed

Anyone whos sees the Devs as lazy is in my eyes ignorant and perhaps foolish, their workload is immense and anyone who thinks they can do better...then you should go make your own game and see how well it turns out, or even better, shut up and let them get on with their hard work and solve problems more quickly without having to be subjected to pre-pubesent whining.

Call me what you want, but ignorant I am not. I myself am a software developer, and have a good idea of how the life-cycle works. If this were my software, I would be spending 100% of my effort on fixing the warping issue, and 0% on new content. I'm not specifically calling the developers out, more laying the blame on the project manager and other management that makes the decisions. Oh and the non-existent QA department that allows things like this to even make it to production. Pretty piss-poor honestly. Anyway, if they didn't spend so much time listening to "pre-pubescent whining" then they wouldn't be nerfing surge in the first place. Squeaky wheel gets the grease right?

[oddfish]

I don't care if you're jesus christ himself, Loop, you don't know what's going on 24/7 with the devs so you have no idea how much thought was put into this change. I myself was only affected by surgile warping on a few occasions and i'm going to say, it was extremely frustrating.

here: say you've got a ring on your middle finger.. the middle finger is not completely essential but you do like your middle finger. well, the problem is this ring on your middle finger chafes and rubs off skin and makes it hard to do some tasks with your hand. (i'll leave that up to your imagination) You're not going to chop off the finger, and you're not going to reconfigure you're hand to accomodate the ring, you're going to remove the ring. It's nice, people like the ring, but it's not NECESSARY and it's causing a problem. Gunning while in surge mode was causing people to use surge for something it's not really meant for and it caused warping in the process. You're not going to reconfigure the entire system to accomodate this perk, you're going to remove the perk, it's not really needed. Some people will be sad, others may leave, but the majority won't mind and will get used to it.

I can't understand why everyone seems to think the devs are such retards over this decision. i dunno. i just can't wait to get flamed.. i'm so excited!

[Breed]

Infinite Loop, i disagree.
The devs cannot find a way to fix speed-step warping, if they could, they would fix it simple as that.
So why should they put 100% of their resources into something that theyve alreadt spent months trying to figure out?

As for how many times ive been surge killed, id say that less than 2% of my deaths are caused by warping. Thats still 2% too much.

I dont understand your satire towards my Bunny hoping surgile expression, since jumping during the surge is what causes the problem in the first place.

You mention several times the "loss of subscriptions".
Lets face it, if your quitting because of an implant change, no-one will miss you.
You cannot argue that NC are receiving a nerf because of this either, as you can still surge to the enemy position then get your weapon out.

Perhaps you just like the speed and the how easy it is for the enemy to miss you when moving so...but i'll say this, we're not playing Quake 3 or Unreal Tournament, if you want fast paces annihilistic gameplay, play those games instead, Planetside a large scale tactical war game, which should not have players zipping around on their feet 'dominating' everyone around them at supersonice speeds whilst remaining un-hittable.

Oh btw, if this or any other of my posts seem aimed at you i apologise, that is not their intention, i just dont understand why you are trying to defend surge-warpers so diligently.

The community wants them out, the devs have a solution, its not perfect, but its something and the community will sacrifice the handful of players who cant handle change nor adapt to new scenarios, so we can enjoy this game we all love and want to suceed.

[Happy lil Elf]

I find it disturbing that most of you seem to be so happy about the surge nerf. If you all are behind anything that is "better" for the game, you'd realize this quite possibly could be what kills it. Moreso, how does it not bother you that instead of fixing the warping, they're taking the lazy, easy way out? They are appeasing some players while totally alienating others, when fixing the problem would appease both. Seems kinda fucked up doesn't it?

Has it occured to you that with the engine they use they may not be able to fix it short of re-writing the engine or that it may not even be possible with current technology to do what PS does and eliminate warping? It bugs me that there are people seem to think it's a simple matter of changing a couple lines of code and warping would just vanish.

I'll freely admit that I don't know if this is the case, because I don't. It would be nice if people didn't act like they know Surge is being changed only because the Devs are "taking the lazy, easy way out" though because it's not known. Honestly I wish they'd just tell us flat out if it's an issue with the engine that they can't fix, to put some of the bitching to rest if nothing else. Although now that I think about it, them saying that wouldn't matter. There are still people who would believe they're just "taking the easy way out".

Oh and btw Hamma - kidRiot is probably the most talented player I've ever seen and played with in PS, so I wouldn't take his opinion lightly. It is one that many of the better players hold.

A large, even an obscenely large kill count as in the case of Kid, does not validate his opinion more than anyone else. Talent at playing the game does not equate to knowing what is the best for the game.

Now aside from that, this:

When a Dev team begins to nerf innovation on the part of the playerbase it's time to move onto a different game.

is a very vauge statment. I'm curious exactly what he is trying to imply here, I mean I could probably guess, but more often than not that leads to misunderstandings and/or backpedaling. I'd love to hear the reasoning behind this statment as, at least to me, it makes very little sense.

As far as his opinion being one that "many of the better players have", you can say the exact same thing about Hamma's opinion, my opinion or anyone elses. There's really no way to prove which one of us is full of crap though. If you want to judge by this poll though, I'd say the majority seems to be happy with how Planetside is going /shrug

[GreyFox]

Originally Posted by oddfish

zerging is not a realistic tactic by ANY stretch of the imagination. 'bout time that shit got thrown out.

Not? Zerging = overwhelming the enemy with more troops then they got. Which is the ultimate strategy in war. Ask the Russians.

Ask Sun Tzu.

Not that I like Zerging in the game.

[oddfish]

i know overwhelming the enemy is a good tactic, but zerging refers more to parking the ams right by a door and having guys respawn and re-enter the fight just to make like army ants or "zerglings" and zerg the shit out of the entrance again. Overwhelming force is important.. i believe it was Sun Tzu who said that you should have twice your enemy's force if you are attacking him. Yes, true, but in real life you can't respawn, so zerging is not an entirely realistic tactic since it depends heavily on respawn.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Breed

Infinite Loop, i disagree.
The devs cannot find a way to fix speed-step warping, if they could, they would fix it simple as that.
So why should they put 100% of their resources into something that theyve alreadt spent months trying to figure out?

I'm a bit confused why you are mixing the speedstepping issue with warping. They are mutually exclusive. If they are saying that the cause of warping is due to some fundamentally flawed code in the engine/framework, and it isn't cost-effective to fix it, then fine, I wish they'd just admit that. Instead, they're saying some nonsense about offensive combat with surge not being an intended form of gameplay that they designed. They don't even mention warping, and they're just trying to cover it up. If it's fixable, then fix it! Why is that so difficult to understand?

Originally Posted by Breed

I dont understand your satire towards my Bunny hoping surgile expression, since jumping during the surge is what causes the problem in the first place.

My satire was used because you're suggesting that all surgilers bunny hop to induce warping. That's just plain ignorant, as a huge percentage of people I play with as NC use surgile, but I rarely see anyone warp. Again, using surgile does not necessitate bunny hopping.

Originally Posted by Breed

You mention several times the "loss of subscriptions".
Lets face it, if your quitting because of an implant change, no-one will miss you.
You cannot argue that NC are receiving a nerf because of this either, as you can still surge to the enemy position then get your weapon out.

It's this negative attitude towards players leaving that gets me. Don't you think having more subscriptions is a good thing? Or only subscriptions of people who use a playstyle that you approve of? Oh and the NC are most definitely receiving a nerf, big time. The range issue and imbalance of the JH will come to light after this next patch. And your surging argument is complete and utter nonsense. While I'm surging up to the enemy position, I'm more than likely to be taking damage while not dishing any out myself. That would equal me losing that battle.

Originally Posted by Breed

Perhaps you just like the speed and the how easy it is for the enemy to miss you when moving so...but i'll say this, we're not playing Quake 3 or Unreal Tournament, if you want fast paces annihilistic gameplay, play those games instead, Planetside a large scale tactical war game, which should not have players zipping around on their feet 'dominating' everyone around them at supersonice speeds whilst remaining un-hittable.

What I have liked about PS the most is that it offered a variety of playstyles to attract different kinds of gamers. This quote is from the official site's overview of the game:

It doesn't matter if you're an avid RPG gamer or a fanatical FPS player, you'll find something in PlanetSide that's just right for you.

Whether or not they wanted the twitch gamers to play or not, they got them, and now they're basically trying to get rid of them. Sometimes I like the fast surgile play, other times I prefer to tank around in my rexo. It's the variety that keeps it fresh and on your toes.

Originally Posted by Breed

i just dont understand why you are trying to defend surge-warpers so diligently.

I'm not defending warping. I am defending a playstyle.

Originally Posted by Breed

The community wants them out, the devs have a solution, its not perfect, but its something and the community will sacrifice the handful of players who cant handle change nor adapt to new scenarios, so we can enjoy this game we all love and want to suceed.

Exactly what statistics are available to back up this statement? How do you know that a majority of the playerbase is behind this change? How do you know that only a handful of players are going to be affected? I think you're going to be surprised, and not in a good way, how detrimental this change is going to be to the long-term health of PS.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Happy lil' Elf

Has it occured to you that with the engine they use they may not be able to fix it short of re-writing the engine or that it may not even be possible with current technology to do what PS does and eliminate warping? It bugs me that there are people seem to think it's a simple matter of changing a couple lines of code and warping would just vanish.

I'll freely admit that I don't know if this is the case, because I don't. It would be nice if people didn't act like they know Surge is being changed only because the Devs are "taking the lazy, easy way out" though because it's not known. Honestly I wish they'd just tell us flat out if it's an issue with the engine that they can't fix, to put some of the bitching to rest if nothing else. Although now that I think about it, them saying that wouldn't matter. There are still people who would believe they're just "taking the easy way out".

You're right honestly. I probably am a bit too quick to accuse them of taking the easy way out. But like you said, we don't know, because they won't tell us! If it's a technical limitation, I will fully accept that and deal with it. But why must they dance around the issue?

Originally Posted by Happy lil' Elf

A large, even an obscenely large kill count as in the case of Kid, does not validate his opinion more than anyone else. Talent at playing the game does not equate to knowing what is the best for the game.

I didn't say it did, I was just commenting on Hamma's equating his statement to just being an NC.

Originally Posted by Happy lil' Elf

As far as his opinion being one that "many of the better players have", you can say the exact same thing about Hamma's opinion, my opinion or anyone elses. There's really no way to prove which one of us is full of crap though. If you want to judge by this poll though, I'd say the majority seems to be happy with how Planetside is going /shrug

There really is no way to prove it until the dust settles after the patch goes through. Let's see how many people quit, and if the game is still fun. But a poll on a forum honestly only represents an extremely small sample size of the overall playerbase, and therefore should not be taken as being accurate.