Another 'Battlefield 3' - Page 4

JHendy · 2012-04-05, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by Skitrel

Dumbed down. Specify. The only real "dumbing down" that can be brought up with BF3 is the addition of 3D spotting, which really doesn't change gameplay that much at all.

And the complete removal of any meaningful teamwork features.

Quite a big one, there.

Top Sgt · 2012-04-05, 05:59 PM

the thing is this:

BF on PC should be so much further along than it is.. Which is what we mean by dummed down, half hearted effort.

yes the new Frostbite 2.0 engine looks pretty.. but getting over that pretty skin and destruction.. you find out that the game is really lacking gameplay wise and light years behind where it should be.

1-64 players.. OMG dice was like we got 64 players in BF3.. well thanks.. but you also had 64 players way back in 2004 already... What's the reason the PC version is not running 80 or 128 or 264 by now being it's almost a decade later? Console focus that's why.. BC1 BC2 BF 1943 BF3 all made with console sales in mind.

2-No commander anymore, Squad leaders are nothing now.. no real meaning... you can spawn on anyone in ur squad.. who cares if he is a SL or not.

3- 4 man squad's? total console dumb down.. BF2 had much bigger squads.. Squads should have grown on PC not shrinked.. Again console focus port to PC

4- Small so called... "Conquest Large" Maps.. yes you heard me right.. The flag areas are so crammed together it's not even funny.. Again appealing to the console ADD kiddies.. who want quick action action action and don't want to have to work to get to a flag and cap it.

5-64 man MP game but no built in Voip for PC.... lol it's 2011-2012 what a joke...... you can only in game voip with someone in your squad if they are on your friends list and IF they joined a game with you in a party.. total console thing.

6- PC dedicated server game with Client Side Hit detection.. what a joke. System was made and set up for consoles who use client side as normal and PC version was ported from that.. end of story

7- Doritos anyone? total noobed up thing to help players see others... not something anybody needed but again it's ea/dice dumming down the game so casuals would play and buy it and that equals more money.. Started with BC series.

I could go on with more.. but you get the point.

I have owned and played every BF game and mod ever made from day 1 up until the current so I know my stuff. BF3 is an ok game.. it could have been a monster PC game but it is really a mediocre after thought effort by dice/ea for the PC side.

There focus is consoles period.. cod crowd and the money that can bring.

All new BF games will be the same console developed and focused and PC stuff just pieced and thrown together and pushed out the door like they made an awesome PC minded game.

NCLynx · 2012-04-05, 05:59 PM

I can't believe SoE just copied BF3 100%. I mean BF3 has guns/air vehicles/land vehicles, PS2 has ALL THE SAME THINGS! What a ripoff of BF3.

Holy shit. I know there's similarities, but this isn't another Battlefield 3.

Also, for the record Planetside was special mainly because of its scale and the size of the battles you could participate in. A lot of people seem to forget that.

Also, no I didn't read all of the pages in this thread my apologies if this isn't 100% on topic. I simply read the title, first post and a few after.

Stardouser · 2012-04-05, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by Skitrel

I'll call you anyone I like an idiot if they make bland generalised statements with zero specifics. You want to do this, let's do it.

Dumbed down. Specify. The only real "dumbing down" that can be brought up with BF3 is the addition of 3D spotting, which really doesn't change gameplay that much at all.

3D spotting definitely changes gameplay a lot. Even if we put aside fairness and anything related to fairness, it still has people shooting at spots halfway across the map that they would normally not even see, let alone pay attention to, and also people chase after spots that are too far away to kill that run behind cover, instead of capping flags. I know this is happening, I see it and do it myself and I'm a nearly pure-objective player from BF2. Granted, people may only be doing it inside a bubble, that bubble being the servers I play on in BF3 and the ones I played on in BC2. And there's something that has to considered: Even Demize of DICE admitted that in BC2, people fired at 3D spots behind cover before they would fire at soldiers in plain sight. The exact quote is:

We noticed that players would focus on 3D spots over everything else, meaning they would ignore people in line of sight.

And the entire post by Demize can be viewed at:
http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/b...l#post19710950

It stands to reason that if it is confirmed that people would fire at 3D spots before they would at soldiers in plain sight, it's not a stretch to believe they might fire at 3D spots before they would attack objectives. And if that's not enough proof for you, just play Hardcore and after a few minutes you realize you can walk around the edges of the map to sneak to wherever you are going and you take fire from the other side of the map a lot less.

And yes, I posted right after Demize supporting his decision to remove the wallhack but leave 3D spotting in. However, after playing BF3 with non-wallhack 3D spotting, I realized people were still focusing on 3D spots over objectives and that making the spot disappear wasn't enough, it needed removed, not fixed. OR made squad only.

And then killcam is also there. But it reduces the game to chasing enemies for revenge, and it's also, just like 3D spotting, and even moreso actually, the game's way of giving you unearned info. You died, and you are given info that will help find your killer.

Lack of teamwork tools is a given, so no need to go into detail.

Then there's maps. Tunnels are everywhere, maps are flat ground mostly, and even where there are buildings, rooftop access is somewhat rare, keeping you on the ground and meatgrinding.

Then there's disabling, a major irritating factor that empowers infantry against vehicles far more than they should be. Which actually has the opposite effect, tanks run around with multiple engineers, which makes them still hard to kill, and so, more people run around playing engineer in an effort to hit them with more RPGs than they can repair, and so you have engineer proliferation. If we didn't have disabling, tanks would run away when shot, and you can't be repaired while fleeing at full speed. Of course, naturally, vehicle regen has to go too if there's no disabling.

I don't even know anymore if "dumbing down" applies to all these issues and really, that doesn't matter. When looked at individually, without painting them all with the "dumbing down" brush, they are all still negative changes to the Battlefield series. And of course, there are a lot of people who don't agree with that viewpoint, but there are a lot who do. Enough to justify a game for us, I think.

Owalpo · 2012-04-05, 06:11 PM

BF3 went in a good direction(Maps were you actually see people was my favorite). And it pissed off some hardcore BF2 players. People still play the game so they did something right.

BF2 lovers should just go back to BF2.

If you don't like the way video games are going, well stop video gaming then. If you want PS2 to have a large population you are going to have to give up some of the things you love. Sorry but the majority over the few.

Stardouser · 2012-04-05, 06:16 PM

Originally Posted by Owalpo

BF3 went in a good direction(Maps were you actually see people was my favorite). And it pissed off some hardcore BF2 players. People still play the game so they did something right.

BF2 lovers should just go back to BF2.

If you don't like the way video games are going, well stop video gaming then. If you want PS2 to have a large population you are going to have to give up some of the things you love. Sorry but the majority over the few.

Post your proof that you are the majority or don't claim it. Note that sales figures don't count. People want to play something, it doesn't mean that they agree with every design decision. I bought the game to give it a fair shake, but if you think my sale is a vote of confidence, you're not counting right. I am not alone. And most people that don't like it don't come to forums to complain, they just go play other games.

As for your comment about staying in BF2, if BF4 changes vastly from BF3, and you happen not to like what it becomes, are you going to want to continue playing BF3 forever? If not, why would it be acceptable to tell BF2 players to stick to BF2 forever?

BuzzCutPsycho · 2012-04-05, 06:21 PM

Am I the only one getting sick of people calling themselves "Veterans" in relation to video games? It seems that the shittiest players are the most prone to adopting and bragging about such a superfluous title.

Felkine · 2012-04-05, 06:24 PM

How can you say "another battlefield clone" when you stated that you didn't played PS1, and this game isn't even in a god damn beta.What do you know about PS2 huh?
I am sick of this standards that gamers put upon new games.Wow a new mmorpg must me a WoW clone, wow a new fps must be a CoD/BF clone. Fuck off with your prejudice, and if this is BF clone for you than don't even come to play it we don't need you, play the orignal not the clone.
"BF3 technical marvel" my ass, fucking graphicwhores. And if this game turns out to be BF3 clone, trust me many people will leave instantly including me.

Saintlycow · 2012-04-05, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by dm Akolyte

3d spotting -- INCREASES tactical options available to the player
Triangle field 3
audiospotting -- wut
killcam -- what the FUCK does this have to do with dumbing down? Oh right, you're just butthurt that CoD is popular and mindless project your hate of that game everywhere else.
Have fun being stealthy
no in-game VOIP -- I'll give you this one.
non-functional commo rose -- This wasn't even useful in the other BF games. Especially if you actually were being tactical, because you'd use other methods of communication. Pressing a button and moving your mouse is a good way to ask for a medic. better than typing
maps -- Oh right, the maps with actual CHOKEPOINTS and varied and planned firing angles? You know, features that INCREASE the tactical response necessary for playing them. It doesn't fit YOUR PERSONAL PREFERENCE. it fits the cod players preference ( generalization )
Watered down vehicle play -- hahaha, you mean "less arcadey" vehicle play? Re-gen definitively makes it more arcadey

BF3 was trying to be COD. COD is already COD. I don't want Planetside 2 to be like Battlefield. Battefield is already Battlefield

CrystalViolet · 2012-04-05, 06:28 PM

I was a big BF1942 fan back in the day. When BF2 rolled out, I was a bit turned off by the game. I felt at the time that the Desert Combat mod for the original game had much better maps and vehicle mechanics. BF2 just didn't seem as fun despite it's flashy graphics, and I ended up shelving it after Oblivion came out; never looked back. Just my short Battlefield story.

NCLynx · 2012-04-05, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Saintlycow

I don't want Planetside 2 to be like Battlefield.

Guess it's a good thing it's not then, ain't it?

As for your other complaints I'm pretty sure T-Ray said something along the lines of "If people really don't like it that much, it can definitely change in beta."

Edit for clarification: I know not literally everything could change, but most of the things people have been complaining about CAN be changed.

Owalpo · 2012-04-05, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Post your proof that you are the majority or don't claim it. Note that sales figures don't count. People want to play something, it doesn't mean that they agree with every design decision. I bought the game to give it a fair shake, but if you think my sale is a vote of confidence, you're not counting right. I am not alone. And most people that don't like it don't come to forums to complain, they just go play other games.

As for your comment about staying in BF2, if BF4 changes vastly from BF3, and you happen not to like what it becomes, are you going to want to continue playing BF3 forever? If not, why would it be acceptable to tell BF2 players to stick to BF2 forever?

For your first paragraph:

Call of Duty. Everyone calls it casual and bad yet it has the biggest active community(As in posting videos, being on forums, taking about it, etc etc). If Call of Duty was 'bad' as BF3 haters say because it has features that BF3 has that BF2 did not(Thus their reasoning behind BF3 being bad), then why has it sold millions?

For your 2nd paragraph:

I do not expect and never will from my experience expect a game to be exactly like the last one. If I do not like a game because of this I will simply not play it. I will stick with BF3 as my go to BF game if I don't like BF4. The minority(remember a minority is 50% - 1 to 0%, I don't mean a few hundred people) of BF gamers who hate BF3 are complaining because it has features that appeal to many gamers and because it is not more like BF2.

Those are two stupid reasons to call a game bad(You disliking it does not make it bad). It is really pathetic when they call a series dead because of one game that didn't come out of the BF2 copy machine.

I rest my case.

Stardouser · 2012-04-05, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by Owalpo

For your first paragraph:

Call of Duty. Everyone calls it casual and bad yet it has the biggest active community(As in posting videos, being on forums, taking about it, etc etc). It is a game that has many features that people who BF3 has. If Call of Duty was 'bad' as BF3 haters say because it has features that BF3 has that BF2 id not, then why has it sold millions?

For your 2nd paragraph:

I do not expect and never will from my experience expect a game to be exactly like the last one. If I do not like a game because of this I will simply not play it. I will stick with BF3 as my go to BF game if I don't like BF4. The minority(remember a minority is 50% - 1 to 0%, I don't mean a few hundred people) of BF gamers who hate BF3 are complaining because it has features that appeal to many gamers and because it is not more like BF2.

Those are two stupid reasons to call a game bad(You disliking it does not make it bad). It is really pathetic when they call a series dead because of one game that didn't come out of the BF2 copy machine.

I rest my case.

We're talking about Battlefield now, not CoD. Everyone knows CoD is like Reaver territory(Firefly).

And just because there are only a few hundred people on the forums that you have seen complaining doesn't mean that everyone who plays wouldn't make massive changes to the game. If you believe that everyone who isn't complaining is 100% happy with the game and wouldn't make substantial changes to it, that's pretty wishful thinking. Sometimes I randomly make comments while in-game against things, and get supportive responses. The sentiment against BF3's design decisions is out there, and it's not just a few hundred people.

I would say that between Planetside's vets, oh wait, can't call them "vets" without people thinking it's bragging, so, between players of the previous Planetside, and the players of the previous Battlefields, together that's a pretty decent sized community.

Raymac · 2012-04-05, 06:45 PM

So this is what Mordor is like, eh? I've never been because we all know, one does not simply walk into Mordor. Oh yeah, this thread is dumb. The reports of Planetside 2's death have been highly exaggerated.

Owalpo · 2012-04-05, 06:50 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

We're talking about Battlefield now, not CoD. Everyone knows CoD is like Reaver territory(Firefly).

And just because there are only a few hundred people on the forums that you have seen complaining doesn't mean that everyone who plays wouldn't make massive changes to the game. If you believe that everyone who isn't complaining is 100% happy with the game and wouldn't make substantial changes to it, that's pretty wishful thinking. Sometimes I randomly make comments while in-game against things, and get supportive responses. The sentiment against BF3's design decisions is out there, and it's not just a few hundred people.

Every game has its flaws. That is a given. All because a sequel isn't exactly like the one before does not make it bad. Every BF2 fan who is now a BF3 hater was expecting the same game, but bigger and better graphics. It didn't happen in all departments and somethings to open BF3 to a wider audience were included.

BF3 is being played by people and people like it. You can say the same thing by the way for people who like it. They could just be playing the game not praising it.

To sum up my point. Games from BF3 to Planetside 2 to games in the future are going to have new features to appeal to a wider audience. These features aren't just added for shits and giggles. Wake and up smell the roses and PSU stop complaining about these features before you even see them in the damn game.