News: GU06 Notes

[Rahabib]

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

Hmmm. It seems we have two different definitions of "tactics" here.

1. Battle Tactics. Ever played a WoW Battleground? However, when you just have 2 (3 with HA) guns to choose from to kill someone, that's not a lot of tactics that need to be employed. --Most people who want higher TTK want this.

2. Engagement tactics. Essentially what ALL of CoD is. You make sure that when you engage, you engage on your own terms. As opposed to running at each other with guns blazing. Which some people still do. A low TTK encourages this. Think Dark Souls. Rewarding skillful play is always a good move when making design decisions. Except camping properly is... also an example of skillful play. In which case we have ways to flush out campers, right?

Its important to have a good balance however. To low of a TTK can end up when you get the jump on the guy, burst, then the guy you are shooting at, turns around and fires a better gun and kills you first. With such a large variety of weapons you have to be careful that the guy with the better gun doesn't usually win.

Personally, I feel the TTK is a bit low, but not so much that I feel that its a big issue. But I do feel OHKs lower the skill ceiling, and with shotties should not exist.

[wasdie]

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

Hmmm. It seems we have two different definitions of "tactics" here.

1. Battle Tactics. Ever played a WoW Battleground? However, when you just have 2 (3 with HA) guns to choose from to kill someone, that's not a lot of tactics that need to be employed. --Most people who want higher TTK want this.

2. Engagement tactics. Essentially what ALL of CoD is. You make sure that when you engage, you engage on your own terms. As opposed to running at each other with guns blazing. Which some people still do. A low TTK encourages this. Think Dark Souls. Rewarding skillful play is always a good move when making design decisions. Except camping properly is... also an example of skillful play. In which case we have ways to flush out campers, right?

I feel there is currently a good mix of both here. The weapon you pulled defines your place on the battlefield. It's not about being able to switch it up on a moments notice, it's about sticking with that role for the duration of your life or in between trips to an infantry terminal. I think that's fair.

A higher TTK wouldn't make much sense without more AoE based weapon. Pumping somebody full of lead for over half a magazine would just ruin the infantry engagements. Higher TTK is best for arena shooters with a larger variety of unique weapons that you can switch up at a moments notice. Planetside 1 got around this by letting you pull any 2 weapons and carry a variety of AoE and direct fire weaponry at any time depending on your loadout. Since this isn't Planetside 1 and they've gone the hardcoded class route, that option isn't really viable anymore.

I also hated the TTK in Planetside 1. I suffered it because the rest of the game was so appealing to me.

[EvilNinjadude]

Originally Posted by Rahabib

Too low of a TTK can end up when you get the jump on the guy, burst, then the guy you are shooting at, turns around and fires a better gun and kills you first. With such a large variety of weapons you have to be careful that the guy with the better gun doesn't usually win.

-You imply that TTK does not factor in Shotguns
-You imply that there are definitely better guns (independent of tactical circumstance)

Basically, you say you can't kill them and they fight back and kill you. Were you using the wrong gun for the situation? Wrong class?

Because otherwise you mean the opposite of what you are saying. Very low TTK generally means that the one who gets the jump wins. The end. In all other cases, you would be doing it wrong.

[Snydenthur]

Originally Posted by Rahabib

With such a large variety of weapons you have to be careful that the guy with the better gun doesn't usually win.

Why? If you have a gun more suited to cqc and your enemy has a gun suited for longer range, why should he have a chance to beat you when you are in cqc situation? And in this situation you have the same actual skill. It's the enemys fault in this situation to die, since you're not supposed to do well at close range with a long range weapon. You can get a long range weapon and keep the distance, you can get a close range weapon and try to close the distance or you get one of the jack-of-all-trades weapon and have a chance at any distance.

Personal skill will balance this out a bit though, but even the best sniper in the world can't really do much at close range if he/she uses a sniper rifle. From my viewpoint, there hasn't been any overpowered weapon in the game during the time I've played, so it all boils down to this range thing.

[Babyfark McGeez]

New GU is resetting my graphics settings (UserOptions.Ini) each time i start up the game, annoying as heck. :[

[Rahabib]

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

-You imply that TTK does not factor in Shotguns

I edited my comment just before you posted. I do not like the OHK factors.

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

-You imply that there are definitely better guns (independent of tactical circumstance)

I feel that there are. I feel that items like the pump shotties are better in almost all situations that the autos. I feel that the bolt snipers are better in almost all situations than the non-bolts. I feel that a lot (not all) paid weapons are better in most situations than non paid ones.

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

...
Because otherwise you mean the opposite of what you are saying. Very low TTK generally means that the one who gets the jump wins. The end. In all other cases, you would be doing it wrong.

If you get the jump you should have an advantage.

Originally Posted by Snydenthur

Why? If you have a gun more suited to cqc and your enemy has a gun suited for longer range, why should he have a chance to beat you when you are in cqc situation? And in this situation you have the same actual skill. It's the enemys fault in this situation to die, since you're not supposed to do well at close range with a long range weapon. You can get a long range weapon and keep the distance, you can get a close range weapon and try to close the distance or you get one of the jack-of-all-trades weapon and have a chance at any distance.

Well you took my comment a bit too far. Situations factor in of course. But in this game you have multiple guns that are used in the same situation, same class etc. and one just has a higher damage or higher ROF, that guy would win with a higher OVERALL TTK..

Originally Posted by Snydenthur

Personal skill will balance this out a bit though, but even the best sniper in the world can't really do much at close range if he/she uses a sniper rifle. From my viewpoint, there hasn't been any overpowered weapon in the game during the time I've played, so it all boils down to this range thing.

so you felt that all weapons were perfect at launch? They balance for a reason.

Again, I havent had much of a problem with the shotties personally. But philosophically, OHKs are annoying when there is no time to react. However, if you go too far and make it take too long, getting the jump on someone will mean less than who does the most damage.

[ChipMHazard]

Originally Posted by Babyfark McGeez

New GU is resetting my graphics settings (UserOptions.Ini) each time i start up the game, annoying as heck. :[

Consider yourself lucky, I'm currently having a debate with SOE about the existence of my account.
If it's not technical issues it's something else with these GUs.

[Assist]

Originally Posted by Rahabib

Its important to have a good balance however. To low of a TTK can end up when you get the jump on the guy, burst, then the guy you are shooting at, turns around and fires a better gun and kills you first. With such a large variety of weapons you have to be careful that the guy with the better gun doesn't usually win.

Personally, I feel the TTK is a bit low, but not so much that I feel that its a big issue. But I do feel OHKs lower the skill ceiling, and with shotties should not exist.

I wrote a big response but decided it's not an argument I'm going to win. Some people feel that the TTK is perfectly fine and that's fine with me. Just don't go out of your way to make my argument out to be that I want people hopping around after you unload an entire mag in them. That's not at all what I want, or anyone else who is arguing for an increase in TTK wants. I wrongly assumed that the people at PSU would be bright enough to realize no one wants that.
The bottom line for me is that what we have now is not tactical combat at all. When I can run into a group of 6 and one-shot 3 of them before their reaction time kicks in, there's an issue with how quickly one can kill. I can play like a complete suicidal moron all day and rush in to the enemy and gain twice as many kills as the defensive player attempting to use tactics in PS2. For those who say kills don't matter, please face the basic facts that more often than not the team with more deaths is the team that loses. If you feel that's an ok style of gameplay that is encouraged by the game mechanics, more power to you, but for me it's very shallow and needs to be looked at for this game to be considered anything more than an arena shooter.

[Binkley]

Vehicles should no longer start rocking after firing a few times

OMG THANK YOU! Most annoying bug in the game.

[Rahabib]

Originally Posted by Assist

I wrote a big response but decided it's not an argument I'm going to win. Some people feel that the TTK is perfectly fine and that's fine with me. Just don't go out of your way to make my argument out to be that I want people hopping around after you unload an entire mag in them. That's not at all what I want, or anyone else who is arguing for an increase in TTK wants. I wrongly assumed that the people at PSU would be bright enough to realize no one wants that.
The bottom line for me is that what we have now is not tactical combat at all. When I can run into a group of 6 and one-shot 3 of them before their reaction time kicks in, there's an issue with how quickly one can kill. I can play like a complete suicidal moron all day and rush in to the enemy and gain twice as many kills as the defensive player attempting to use tactics in PS2. For those who say kills don't matter, please face the basic facts that more often than not the team with more deaths is the team that loses. If you feel that's an ok style of gameplay that is encouraged by the game mechanics, more power to you, but for me it's very shallow and needs to be looked at for this game to be considered anything more than an arena shooter.

It sounds like we want the same thing. I feel its a bit low once you factor in shotties and such, but to me, currently, its not terrible enough thats its a major complaint for me. I dont think I have ever seen anyone run into 6 people and take out 3 before someone could react. I have seen the videos however

[Babyfark McGeez]

Originally Posted by ChipMHazard

Consider yourself lucky, I'm currently having a debate with SOE about the existence of my account.
If it's not technical issues it's something else with these GUs.

Dang that sounds indeed way more crappy, thankfully i have not had to deal with customer support in this game so far.

[Snydenthur]

Originally Posted by Rahabib

so you felt that all weapons were perfect at launch? They balance for a reason.

Again, I havent had much of a problem with the shotties personally. But philosophically, OHKs are annoying when there is no time to react. However, if you go too far and make it take too long, getting the jump on someone will mean less than who does the most damage.

No, I don't know about launch. I started playing quite late, 14.2 if I remember correctly. I don't think they always nerf for a reason. Look at the shotguns. They nerfed them just because people whined about them. Luckily they didn't make them useless, but there was no need for the nerf either. And the whine wasn't very good. It was almost all "you just run and press button and everything always dies with one hit". When in truth, it was more like 2-3 shots per kill on average. Those that aren't that good at aiming, it took probably 3-4 shots.

Well, now I had my first impressions from the gu06. I'm quite sure now that soe doesn't do much testing. There were some lights appearing accompanied by the facility capture sound. Very irritating.

When I joined, there was already alert going on. Capture indar. :O
I hope they do a patch to remove the alert-thing from the hud. It was irritating too. Participation xp bonus didn't work. I was at 70% at the time the alert ended and it dropped me to 65%. So either it gave me 15% of the promised 20% or it just happened to drop at the same time and there was no participation bonus.

Edit. Oh yeah, someone said that rashnu can't be captured at all.

[EvilNinjadude]

Originally Posted by Rahabib

It sounds like we want the same thing. I feel its a bit low once you factor in shotties and such, but to me, currently, its not terrible enough thats its a major complaint for me. I dont think I have ever seen anyone run into 6 people and take out 3 before someone could react. I have seen the videos however

That's because my crappy PC cannot stream. I do however love my HA runs. Take a Tower point A. Tons of enemies standing on it. I run down, direct hit rocket launcher a guy standing in the corner, toss a Grenade towards the control point through ONE entrance, the take out my SMG (I love it) and go through the OTHER entrance guns blazing.

Nets be about 4 kills each time.


EDIT: I was ABOUT to get first impressions from the update. My first and only impression is that there is now a new, unnecessary "gameplay tip" on the first loading screen, before character selection... The screen I've been staring at for the past 15 minutes because it refuses to go away.

No comments on gameplay from me, I can't even get in

[Snydenthur]

Originally Posted by EvilNinjadude

EDIT: I was ABOUT to get first impressions from the update. My first and only impression is that there is now a new, unnecessary "gameplay tip" on the first loading screen, before character selection... The screen I've been staring at for the past 15 minutes because it refuses to go away.

No comments on gameplay from me, I can't even get in

Are you on EU server? They are locked down now.

[EvilNinjadude]

Originally Posted by Snydenthur

Are you on EU server? They are locked down now.

Dude. I can't even get to the character selection screen. I said that. And that's never happened before either.