No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.

[Hipshot]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

To add to all this.. what about the TR advantage of having more bullets in their mag than most guns. There are exceptions, but honestly I love playing my TR sometimes because I don't have to worry about bullet management as much and they have great rate of fire. Hell the MCG is amazing... 200 round mag if you have extended mags and 200 in reserve and fires at 800rpm like a heavy SMG.... Where is the VS equvialent of that? The lasher? HAHAHA... Where is the NC equivalent of that? Jackhammer??? The gun that replaces virtually all their shotguns except the pumps? Don't get me wrong. I like the Jackhammer in CQC, but it's not nearly as versatile as the MCG. Then there is the Lasher which is severely situational and gets tons of ally grief.

Flip that around. What about ESRLs? Pheonix and Lancer can dumbfire and be accurate... of course depending on enemy movement and distance. They hit hard. What do the TR get? a rocket launcher that replaces the other 2 lock-ons... and can't dumbfire. Can't be used to hit turrets or maxes unlike the other 2 ESRLs. If the thing worked as intended it wouldn't be nearly as bad as it is now. It will be fixed so it stops going through terrian and probably will stop locking the first rocket to a flare.. once it's fixed it won't be special.

People complain too much. The grass is always greener on the otherside until you get there. Take that from someone that plays on all sides. If your big hang up is that VS have the Orion with .75 ADS movement and 750rpm... get over it. Each faction has something that the other factions would kill for. Designed this way on purpose.

The ability to avoid getting hit while returning fire is pretty important in a 1v1 situation. So at medium distance SVA88 is the clear winner. I play all 3 factions aswell and i can tell you that TR is the most pigeonholed empire they get stuck with closerange spray and pray weapons while NC and VS get oneshot snipe weapons like enforcer and saron for example. Im not saying TR dont have some good stuff to but overall they are lacking. I think the faction traits have gotten out of hand. But thats another topic.

[Hipshot]

Originally Posted by PredatorFour

Aiming down sights is for wimps.

Agreed

[Dragonskin]

Originally Posted by Hipshot

The ability to avoid getting hit while returning fire is pretty important in a 1v1 situation. So at medium distance SVA88 is the clear winner. I play all 3 factions aswell and i can tell you that TR is the most pigeonholed empire they get stuck with closerange spray and pray weapons while NC and VS get oneshot snipe weapons like enforcer and saron for example. Im not saying TR dont have some good stuff to but overall they are lacking. I think the faction traits have gotten out of hand. But thats another topic.

I don't think strafing is that huge of an advantage in most situations. In really tight places yea.. but then you have other options for weapons that give the same movement perk and can 1 shot kill and every faction has access to them. Unless the person is ADADing then strafe speed isn't that big of a deal. Just means you have to track your target better. A lot of people don't ADAD and the ones that do are usually using every "cheap trick" they can for an advantage. Buzzcutpyscho is a prime example, but at leat he feely admits it and points it out even when he is doing it... dislike like him or not.. he does make some good points about balance.

Anyway... I could go through the list of faction perks/weaknesses and I generally feel that everyone is about equal overall. People just like to focus on 1 thing and blow it out of proportion. I'm even guilty of doing that from time to time.

[KodanBlack]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

To add to all this.. what about the TR advantage of having more bullets in their mag than most guns. There are exceptions, but honestly I love playing my TR sometimes because I don't have to worry about bullet management as much and they have great rate of fire. Hell the MCG is amazing... 200 round mag if you have extended mags and 200 in reserve and fires at 800rpm like a heavy SMG.... Where is the VS equvialent of that? The lasher? HAHAHA... Where is the NC equivalent of that? Jackhammer??? The gun that replaces virtually all their shotguns except the pumps? Don't get me wrong. I like the Jackhammer in CQC, but it's not nearly as versatile as the MCG. Then there is the Lasher which is severely situational and gets tons of ally grief.

Flip that around. What about ESRLs? Pheonix and Lancer can dumbfire and be accurate... of course depending on enemy movement and distance. They hit hard. What do the TR get? a rocket launcher that replaces the other 2 lock-ons... and can't dumbfire. Can't be used to hit turrets or maxes unlike the other 2 ESRLs. If the thing worked as intended it wouldn't be nearly as bad as it is now. It will be fixed so it stops going through terrian and probably will stop locking the first rocket to a flare.. once it's fixed it won't be special.

People complain too much. The grass is always greener on the otherside until you get there. Take that from someone that plays on all sides. If your big hang up is that VS have the Orion with .75 ADS movement and 750rpm... get over it. Each faction has something that the other factions would kill for. Designed this way on purpose.

Thank you for every point that you made! Enough of these damn "nerf this" threads.

[Assist]

Originally Posted by Hipshot

You strafe 33% faster while aiming down sight with SVA88, Orion and NS-15M

I have 2 pennies and my poor dog only has 1. I'm 100% richer! OH NOES!

[Dreamcast]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

So you even acknowledge that every empire has access to weapons for their HA with .75 ADS... one of them being the NS-15m LMG.... the SMGs and the shotguns... yet because you hate the Orion so much you turn it into a nerf Orion thread... got it. Are you in the same camp that hate ZOE because you have to aim at your target too?

I said any LMG HA....That includes the NS-15...sorry if I wasnt clear.


I mentioned the SMG/Shotgun because I know they have .75 ADS speed...but if you think about ADS dont matter much for the SMG because it kind of sucks mid range, close range hipfire>ADS...Shotgun is also a hipfire weapon mostly,ADS strafing isn't a huge deal.....SO thats why I said keep ADS speed buff for them.

Now Compared this to LMG.....LMG's are good close distance/Meduim Distance....Now I mentioned the Orion because it's the best example on how it rules both close range and mid range......High RoF,High bullet Velocity(yes it matters mid range), and .75 speed buff.....

So these people with LMG can out strafe people at medium range, and have 2 shields.....Sorry but it isn't right.

I used the NS 15 and ORION so I know that .75 speed a huge deal.

I have 2 pennies and my poor dog only has 1. I'm 100% richer! OH NOES!

Is a big difference dude....I can feel it when Im using my NS-15 and any other LMG.....I can see it when I face a VS with an ORION, he just out stafes me.

It's a damn nice edge that I think think HA who have 2 shields dont deserve...Is kind of overkill IMO.

[Dreamcast]

Originally Posted by PredatorFour

So .25 is such a big advantage?? TR have some awesome weapons to use, should be thankful with that.

Never said they didn't.

The point is HA who has 2 shields don't deserve a strafing speed buff when ADS.

Is really unfair to everybody going up against them.

That includes people with NS-15

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

To add to all this.. what about the TR advantage of having more bullets in their mag than most guns. There are exceptions, but honestly I love playing my TR sometimes because I don't have to worry about bullet management as much and they have great rate of fire. Hell the MCG is amazing... 200 round mag if you have extended mags and 200 in reserve and fires at 800rpm like a heavy SMG.... Where is the VS equvialent of that? The lasher? HAHAHA... Where is the NC equivalent of that? Jackhammer??? The gun that replaces virtually all their shotguns except the pumps? Don't get me wrong. I like the Jackhammer in CQC, but it's not nearly as versatile as the MCG. Then there is the Lasher which is severely situational and gets tons of ally grief.

Flip that around. What about ESRLs? Pheonix and Lancer can dumbfire and be accurate... of course depending on enemy movement and distance. They hit hard. What do the TR get? a rocket launcher that replaces the other 2 lock-ons... and can't dumbfire. Can't be used to hit turrets or maxes unlike the other 2 ESRLs. If the thing worked as intended it wouldn't be nearly as bad as it is now. It will be fixed so it stops going through terrian and probably will stop locking the first rocket to a flare.. once it's fixed it won't be special.

People complain too much. The grass is always greener on the otherside until you get there. Take that from someone that plays on all sides. If your big hang up is that VS have the Orion with .75 ADS movement and 750rpm... get over it. Each faction has something that the other factions would kill for. Designed this way on purpose.

First of all this thread wasn't about "OMG TR WEAPONS SUCK, VS WEAPONS ARE THE BEST".

All though I do think the Orion is the best LMG.....That wasn't the point, I even mentioned the Ns-15 which I think doesn't deserve 75 ads speed.


The point is that HA which already have 2 shields, don't deserve a speed buff.

BTW IMO the MCG sucks, that wind up for the weapon, will get you killed if u go up against somebody with an SMG or an LMG like Carv/Orion/Saw IMO.


I understand factions have advantages over others but like I been saying.

IS FREAKING HA with 2 SHIELDS, yet it gets a .75 ADS speed buff....Their is something wrong with that.

[Dreamcast]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

I don't think strafing is that huge of an advantage in most situations. In really tight places yea.. but then you have other options for weapons that give the same movement perk and can 1 shot kill and every faction has access to them. Unless the person is ADADing then strafe speed isn't that big of a deal. Just means you have to track your target better. A lot of people don't ADAD and the ones that do are usually using every "cheap trick" they can for an advantage. Buzzcutpyscho is a prime example, but at leat he feely admits it and points it out even when he is doing it... dislike like him or not.. he does make some good points about balance.

Anyway... I could go through the list of faction perks/weaknesses and I generally feel that everyone is about equal overall. People just like to focus on 1 thing and blow it out of proportion. I'm even guilty of doing that from time to time.

Strafing is a huge advantage.

Specially when you have 2 shields like HA.

I know some Carbine weapons give .75 speed buff as well but it isn't a huge deal because they don't have 2 shields.

HA on the other hand, is just overkill to have 2 shields and a .75 speed buff.


I always ADAD Strafe...The best Players I play against ADAD Strafe...Most Vanu HA...They know that .75 speed buff is so legit.

[maradine]

A stand-up fight against an HA should go poorly. They are meant to win a slugging match. There is no such thing as class "fairness".

Please stop triple posting. You have an edit function and a quote button.

[Dreamcast]

Originally Posted by maradine

A stand-up fight against an HA should go poorly. They are meant to win a slugging match. There is no such thing as class "fairness".

Please stop triple posting. You have an edit function and a quote button.

My bad.

Going up against a HA with .50 speed....You atleast do damage and if you have a certain carbine that gives you .75 speed, you can actually kill him perhaps if you are good.


Go up against a HA with .75 speed.....while you have .50 speed carbine or AR, you are done and are lucky to even do actual damage.
If you have .75 speed carbine, well you lost your advantage since the HA has .75 as well plus has shields.

Not to mention the fact that .75 speed HA vs .50 speed HA....with similar skills, always means the .75 speed HA wins.

.75 speed on HA is overkill.

[Dragonskin]

Originally Posted by Dreamcast

Go up against a HA with .75 speed.....while you have .50 speed carbine or AR, you are done and are lucky to even do actual damage.
If you have .75 speed carbine, well you lost your advantage since the HA has .75 as well plus has shields.

Not to mention the fact that .75 speed HA vs .50 speed HA....with similar skills, always means the .75 speed HA wins.

.75 speed on HA is overkill.

No, you can't say a .75 speed HA vs .50 HA that the .75 will always win. Not everyone is terrible at tracking targets. I don't care if you move .25 faster while ADS it doesn't make you invincible and you still get lit up by any competent FPSer. Show me the stats that show that people with .75 LMGs automatically win vs .50 LMGs.

Like you said in a CQC engagement you ruled out the .75 SMGs and shotgun due to hipfire. In CQC with a Orion in the same distance you are going to tell me that you will ADS? When you know the Orion is made for CQC and can equip a laser sight? no. Just like I said I prefer other weapons on my HA in CQC because they can out perform the Orion in a straight up battle. Shotguns offer 1 shot kill potential and SMGs do almost equal DPS (a difference of only 27 dps between the Orion and Sirius), but have way better hipfire potential due to advanced laser sights and soft point ammunition.

You do make an interesting statement though... where is your campaign against .75 ARs?

[Ghoest9]

If someone strafes - I wont be able to kill them first most of the time - Im essentially hopeless if they can strafe fast.
I doubt Im the only person like this.

Strafing is a big deal. It greatly helps you against many players.

[Dragonskin]

Originally Posted by Ghoest9

If someone strafes - I wont be able to kill them first most of the time - Im essentially hopeless if they can strafe fast.
I doubt Im the only person like this.

Strafing is a big deal. It greatly helps you against many players.

So the only time you can kill a player is if they stand still? That is interesting. How is this a .75 ADS problem and not a player skill problem?

[Dreamcast]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

No, you can't say a .75 speed HA vs .50 HA that the .75 will always win. Not everyone is terrible at tracking targets. I don't care if you move .25 faster while ADS it doesn't make you invincible and you still get lit up by any competent FPSer. Show me the stats that show that people with .75 LMGs automatically win vs .50 LMGs.

Like you said in a CQC engagement you ruled out the .75 SMGs and shotgun due to hipfire. In CQC with a Orion in the same distance you are going to tell me that you will ADS? When you know the Orion is made for CQC and can equip a laser sight? no. Just like I said I prefer other weapons on my HA in CQC because they can out perform the Orion in a straight up battle. Shotguns offer 1 shot kill potential and SMGs do almost equal DPS (a difference of only 27 dps between the Orion and Sirius), but have way better hipfire potential due to advanced laser sights.

You do make an interesting statement though... where is your campaign against .75 ARs?

Stats?...Dude brb gonna find out the stats.

Look, Im just telling you how it feels in game and what my results are.

I play HA all the time and I can tell .75 does a difference when I used an NS-15 or on my alt with the Orion.....I know it does when ADAD strafing.


Has nothing to do with how good you are at tracking a target...If a person is ADAD faster than you, you will need to move your mouse way more, it will be much easier for him to get the hits on you....Sorry but is a nice advantage...So stop blaming it on player skill.

As for the Orion in close distance, is very good...Sure a shotgun will pretty much own everybody in close distance but an Orion can take on an SMG.....and still be able to outstrafe anybody at meduim Range....Thats a big deal.

I dont care about .75's AR's or Carbines because they don't have two shields.

HA has two shields....add a .75 speed buff....yeah is overkill no matter how u look at it.

[Ghoest9]

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

So the only time you can kill a player is if they stand still? That is interesting. How is this a .75 ADS problem and not a player skill problem?

Everything in the game is a matter of player skill - that in no way means that everything in the game can not be balanced.

You are practicing an intellectually dishonest mode of argument here.

You dismiss the advantage as being non-existent or of marginal significance and when when people point out that the advantage does exist you switch to attack them for being bad players.


But it doesnt really matter if I am a worse player than you. What does matter is that many players are like me so having a .75 speed weapon as an option does give you a significant advantage against these limited players that other HA with out .75 speed dont have it as an option.

Im not complaining about losing fights to strafers here - Im just pointing out having that gun is a noticeable advantage over people who dont have it.





If you want to make a case that for some reason VS deserves this particular advantage - fine make the case.
But drop the literally nonsense argument you have been attempting.