Any Economics Geniuses?

[Mag-Mower]

Not sure if Im gonna get a ton of information posting this on a planetside site forum, but I thought I'd give it a shot...

With all the fuss going on about Greece about how their next to defaulting on their debt, and the fact that every time the Eurzone comes up with a bailout plan, the Greek people and government always reject it, even though their refusal to accept it means that they will go bankrupt and would end up causing a Europe wide recession, I was wondering what would happen if the EZ refused to bailout Greece, and instead used that bailout money to subsidize the losses that the lending countries would face.

Im not too sure if that would work or not, but its kind of ridiculous that the EZ is trying to help Greece out, but they constantly refuse anything that comes their way.

Any thoughts?

[Traak]

Greece has gotten into debt by handing out too much money from the government without enough coming in.

What the EZ is wanting is more authority to direct Greece's affairs in return for its money, because to just hand someone more money after they squandered theirs and went into debt isn't going to give you any power to solve anything. You will just enforce their lifestyle at your expense.

I don't think the Greeks want to give away so much autonomy to get the money. What a mess. Meanwhile, I saw on BBC (here, I don't know what spin you get where you are) that Germany has started printing its own money again. Yes, on the BBC via satellite, not some rumor-mill on the internet.

The Greeks are in a tough spot. Like many countries.

[BUGGER]

Germany is Europe's most financially secure country. From what I understand they are the one's trying to pull Greece out of it's own ass. Italy is too running itself into the ground right?

I was reading in Time magazine that something like Europe want's Germany to lead in the financial rescue of these countries, but Germany is reluctant only because last time they tried to save Europe....

[Goku]

The consensus from my Economics professors is that Greece got into this issue from way over bloating their public sector employment on top of glorious pay+benefits. The country only managed to pay for this by borrowing vast sums of money. Now the country is in the shitter and will likely not get out of its situation. The government cannot come to a consensus as to how to solve the issue and the public is going nuts. A lot of the more fiscal responsible countries citizens like Germany do not even want to bail that country out either.

You will likely see Italy, Spain, and Portugal going down this road next. A lot of the debt was borrowed from banks with in those countries. If Greece goes belly up those banks are going to be hurting and cause the whole Euro zone to possibly go under.

[Traak]

I can't see why Germany would want to stay in the union. Now, if everyone were to become a vassal state of Germany, that might make it attractive enough. But, then retiring at 23 with a full pension would be out the window.

Since when did work become the enemy, one we try to "retire from" as soon as possible? Why is work bad?

[L4G]

Originally Posted by BUGGER

Germany is reluctant only because last time they tried to save Europe....

[Mag-Mower]

I know they dont want to let Greece default because if that happens, then its portugal, spain, and italy, and when they fall its only a matter of time before they drag Germany and France down as well.

I think the most frustrating thing is that the Eurozone is willing to bail out Greece, and accepting a 50% loss on the loans they they already gave, but Greece refuses anything that comes their way. You cant go spend everyones money, go bankrupt, then expect the people that are bailing you out to let you carry on the same way.

I get the whole idea of the eurozone and the european community, but this is a good example of how some cultures cant share the same systems. I think if Germany, France, England, The Scandinavian countries, and possibly Benelux got together and had their own currency they would be able to work it out because of cultural and economic similarities. The Culturual and economic beleifes of Germany/France contrast far too much with those of Greece and Spain, which ends up causing these kinds of issues.

[Peacemaker]

Originally Posted by BUGGER

I was reading in Time magazine that something like Europe want's Germany to lead in the financial rescue of these countries, but Germany is reluctant only because last time they tried to save Europe....

[Firefly]

The problem is that Greece is also infamous for mass tax evasion. That means severely limited revenue (funny how that works... no taxes, no revenue... pay attention, anti-tax people). So when their money ran out Greece's government turned to European banks for loans. Soon their government was borrowing billions and those debts, like subprime mortgages in the United States, were often repackaged and sold off around the European continent. So now all of those banks that were grabbing huge shares of Greece's debt... aren't gonna get repaid. Almost all of those banks will probably need massive bail-outs. That's not even counting all the other countries in a similar leaky boat - if Greece goes, it's expected that other countries will follow.

The whole reason the EU was a decent idea was because the EU could have theoretically propped up an in-debt nation until it got on its feet. It's believed that the EU can't really sustain multiple nations. So all those bail-outs across multiple countries will be a problem.

[Hezzy]

I am so glad that Britain didn't partake in this €uro nonsense. Our Great British Pound will still be strong when Greece jumps off the cliff and brings the Euro down with it.

[Geist]

Originally Posted by -Hezzy-

I am so glad that Britain didn't partake in this €uro nonsense. Our Great British Pound will still be strong when Greece jumps off the cliff and brings the Euro down with it.

Good Job Britain. Hopefully the EU will learn it's lesson after they hit rock bottom due to this.