NoobHammer

[InfiniteStorm]

I don't think you can say the thumper takes anymore skill to use than HA. I just started using the thumper and outdoors it is awesome. I don't use it much for indoor close quarter combat because I haven't gotten used to the grief and when to fire with it. I personally can't use the JH very well at all for some reason mainly because I am so used to the Lasher that I tend to lead too far when using it.

[BadAsh]

I think the term came from the frustration some players face in the game. Since SOE went for the artistic feel of 3 unique empires rather than pure game balance this sort of thing will always be an issue for debate. Each empire has it�s strengths and weaknesses and has unique equipment for that end.

The Jack Hammer is hated because it�s considered by many to be the most effective short range HA weapon in the game. Because it�s the most effective it�s perceived to be the deciding factor in many battles. This is bound to cause complaints, even if they are unwarranted. Some people just get owned and then rant about the edge their opponent may have had. The Jack Hammer is no highly unbalanced BFG of DooM fame, but it is a powerful weapon. In the hands of an expert it�s absolutely devastating.

My personal belief is that, skill being even, a Jack Hammer user will come out on top. My belief stems from the experience of getting taken down pretty consistently by a handful of elite Jack Hammer users. Each one of these players use a tactic that is my nemesis. There are a few close quarter fighting situations where the Jack Hammer is nearly unstoppable. And these guys take full advantage of this. To beat them I keep a locker full of looted Jack Hammers. With equipment even, my odds went from 90% of getting owned to about 40% against the same player.

This is just an inherent problem in a system where different teams have different capabilities. To gain the edge I can just figure out a tactic that you don�t have the capability to match. I then repeat this until you are frustrated enough to post about my �n00bhammer� or whatever�

BadAsh

[Rayder]

The other two empires have their strengths, but the VS got jipped on everything, having the weakest weapons and crappiest vehicles (oooh they can go over water). Eh, but I still play em cuz the other empires uniforms suck.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Rayder

The other two empires have their strengths, but the VS got jipped on everything, having the weakest weapons and crappiest vehicles (oooh they can go over water). Eh, but I still play em cuz the other empires uniforms suck.

Umm gotta disagree wholeheartedly with ya here. The Lasher is an awesome weapon in some situations. It has better overall versatility than the other HA weapons. Have you ever tried to use the JH for suppression?

Ok, how about the MAXes? The VS MAXes are by far the best in the game. There's no way you could argue that one logically.

Next VS strength - best tank in the game. Not only is it the most versatile tank but, oh wait, that's the only argument I need. It can cross terrain better than any other tank. It can hit any other vehicle more effectively than any other tank, including aircraft. Not to mention it's strafing helps out the mowing factor quite a bit. Very powerful vehicle.

Don't get me wrong, the VS has weaknesses, but so do any of the empires. I really don't understand why alot of people see the VS as underpowered, because post-balance patch, they're not.

[InfiniteStorm]

Actually, the best thing about a mag is it can hold its own in almost any battle. If your driver doesn't try to be a hero and take out vanguards with the front cannon and lets the gunner actually do his job it is devastating. The reason I say any battle is because of accuracy of the guns. The are not inherintly powerful by any means but can be deadly with the right gunner.

My outfit and I were invading Cyssor the other night and we had 3 mags on assualt of a TR base to get in behind the NC while the rest of the zerg held Faro from the NC. After it was all said and done, the thing we tallied the most kills from was in fact......Reavers. Each gunner shot down approximately 6 reavers each along with 1 or 2 mosquitos. As the driver, I also shot down 2 reavers and when being the cannon gunner I shot down 2 more in a short time.

I would not say the VS is gimped in any way. The moral of the story is each empire has its strengths and you just have to know how to utalize each strength.

Also, I have to agree with BadAsh's noobhammer theory. Everyone gets fruhstrated when killed by the same gun an excessive amount. Even I get fruhstrated when a surge+agile+JH user is teleporting around my screen and kills me with no trouble. I learn to deal with it and respawn and try again.

[Rayder]

You wanna know why the Jackhammer isn't a good suppression weapon? BECAUSE ITS NOT MENT TO BE ONE. How does Heavy Assault get translated into Suppression? It kicks ass because its ment to. The Lasher is still weak compared to the other HA weapons. It should have at least 30 rounds, maybe a faster rof or faster traveling shots.

The Mag is a good tank, only if you have a good driver AND a good gunner. This goes with the other tanks as well, but more so for the Mag because of its weak armor, and the straight shooting cannon. Yes, the cannon comes in handy when hitting aircraft and you can hit tanks better with it, but it has no arc, and its not the most accurate thing in long ranges, its also weak. You must also note (if you've ever gunned a Mag before you would know this) that it is extremely sensative to elevation unlike the other tanks. A tiny little bump in the ground will fuck up your shot.

The Thresher is a joke.

Pulsar and Beamer.... they can switch between AP and normal, the Pulsar is a little more accurate than the other rifles, and the Beamer is the best anti-armor pistol. Still, they're weaker than the others.

VS MAX's are good only in the right hands. They're weaker than the other MAX's, but they compensate for the increased maneuverability which really doesn't help much when you've got 10 guys shooting at you. The weapon systems are much better now than before, only AV MAX that can take out another MAX with a full clip (the DC can too, but it takes so long, and thats only if every shot hits).

[Nimbus]

Yeah, I really think the problem witht he noobhammer is just the frustration by the quick deaths with it. There have been pleanty of times where I've opened a door and had my guts blasted out before I could react. It's frustrating but oh well. I'm sure the people with noobhammers are bitching about snipers when I've got my bolt driver too.
Noobhammers, by the way, are the primary reason for my attack methods. Generally in game you'll always see me in a vehicle, in a MAX or hiding somewhere with my bolt driver.

[Biohazzard56]

Originally Posted by Diddy Mao

Probably these Two Disgruntled Tr :-D

[Hamma]

I don't like any HA, I think ti should all be nerfed. HA is overpowered in general, it sucks to die and not even have a chance to defend yourself.. one man should not be able to defend a tower.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Hamma

I don't like any HA, I think ti should all be nerfed. HA is overpowered in general, it sucks to die and not even have a chance to defend yourself.. one man should not be able to defend a tower.

Nerfing is the root of all evil. All it accomplishes is to piss off as many people as it makes happy. Nerf HA and you'll see a large percentage of people leave the game. If you don't have a chance to defend yourself, that probably means someone did something to get the jump on you, and they deserved it. You have just as much of a chance to do that to someone else. And you're right, one man shouldn't be able to defend a tower. The only reason one can is that the attackers are tactically inept. Spawning one at a time and running in the tower won't work against a good defender. You have to attack in numbers to take any structure in this game. HA is not the reason someone can hold a tower.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Rayder

You wanna know why the Jackhammer isn't a good suppression weapon? BECAUSE ITS NOT MENT TO BE ONE. How does Heavy Assault get translated into Suppression? It kicks ass because its ment to. The Lasher is still weak compared to the other HA weapons. It should have at least 30 rounds, maybe a faster rof or faster traveling shots.

I can agree with that, but my point is it does offer some useful versatility that the other HA weapons don't have. I still think the Lasher kicks ass.

Originally Posted by Rayder

The Mag is a good tank, only if you have a good driver AND a good gunner. This goes with the other tanks as well, but more so for the Mag because of its weak armor, and the straight shooting cannon. Yes, the cannon comes in handy when hitting aircraft and you can hit tanks better with it, but it has no arc, and its not the most accurate thing in long ranges, its also weak. You must also note (if you've ever gunned a Mag before you would know this) that it is extremely sensative to elevation unlike the other tanks. A tiny little bump in the ground will fuck up your shot.

I'm not being convinced here that any of this makes the Mag woefully underpowered. It is an awesome tank, period.

Originally Posted by Rayder

The Thresher is a joke.

yep.

Originally Posted by Rayder

Pulsar and Beamer.... they can switch between AP and normal, the Pulsar is a little more accurate than the other rifles, and the Beamer is the best anti-armor pistol. Still, they're weaker than the others.

yep yep.

Originally Posted by Rayder

VS MAX's are good only in the right hands. They're weaker than the other MAX's, but they compensate for the increased maneuverability which really doesn't help much when you've got 10 guys shooting at you. The weapon systems are much better now than before, only AV MAX that can take out another MAX with a full clip (the DC can too, but it takes so long, and thats only if every shot hits).

Are you using the same VS MAXes I am? Comparing just the AI MAXes, the Quasar outclasses the other two by far, primarily because it has range, which is a HUGE advantage. Add in the sweet jumpjet and that is the best MAX in the game, hands down. How can you say they are weaker than the others? I don't see it.

[Hamma]

Originally Posted by infinite loop

If you don't have a chance to defend yourself, that probably means someone did something to get the jump on you, and they deserved it.

You don't need a jump on anyone to own them with a lasher, mcg, or JH

4 shots with my Sweeper as to 1-2 shots with a lasher or JH. HA = overpowered and I wish it was never even in the game.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Hamma

You don't need a jump on anyone to own them with a lasher, mcg, or JH

4 shots with my Sweeper as to 1-2 shots with a lasher or JH. HA = overpowered and I wish it was never even in the game.

You're right, you don't necessarily have to have a jump on someone to win with HA. But, I think you have a legitimate chance to defend yourself against someone regardless of their weapon, if you see them coming. There are counters to every weapon, including HA. If you see someone with a JH coming at you from 30m away, put him down with your MA rifle, shouldn't be too hard. It's all about the balance. If HA ruled all at every range, then I'd agree with you. If you think it's overpowered, how come you don't just use it too? I don't understand I guess, no biggie.

[Rarzo]

Hamma, Im with you all the way! HA is a cheap CERT and I would not complain at all mind if they threw HA into a large meat grinder, shot it with a Vangaurd Shell (Which is also unfair, but thats a different story) and then tossed it off the edge of the Earth. Im with the VS most of the time, and I usually encouter the NC. That is how I formed my grudge against them, but never the less, HA all around is unfair to all who dont have it. Any novice at the game can get up close to someone and fire an automatic three shots at a person. So, in other words, if they dont get rid of it completely, they should at least put some stratagy into using it.

Now I know that people will counter my response, and people will want to throw bricks through my window with ransom notes saying that they have kidnapped my cat and want a large sum of money if I want her back...(Oh, sorry, got off topic...) Anyway, I just don't like the JackHammer or HA all together.

Well, Im going to go on PS and kill me some JH carrying NC!

[BadAsh]

Originally Posted by Hamma

You don't need a jump on anyone to own them with a lasher, mcg, or JH

4 shots with my Sweeper as to 1-2 shots with a lasher or JH. HA = overpowered and I wish it was never even in the game.

I don�t agree with the idea of banning HA. To me PS is a game of trade offs. To get HA you need to burn up 4 valuable certification points. And for those 4 points you only get an advantage in short range personal combat against other infantry. HA is not really effective for anything else. I mean for my 4 points I could get a Reaver and I�d own any HA I catch outside. He can not match my firepower, armor, or mobility. It�d be a total spank. Now, should I step out of my Reaver and engage in a small arms battle, I�d hope he would have the advantage because that�s where he put his points. Afraid of going inside because of HA? Then spend 3 points and get a Pounder MAX. Heck, to get the Pounder you don�t even need the medium assault prerequisite. So you got more armor and firepower with 3 points then he got with 6. Even if the HA trooper invested an additional 3 points and got a Rexo you�d still have more armor (650 to 150 is still ugly). A MAX simply is the most bang for your buck indoors.

In fact I like my example, so let�s analyze that further

Consider these 2 different character builds, they both have 9 certification points to spend�

Player 1: Rexo, MA, HA
Player 2: MA, Reaver, Pounder MAX

The only time player 1 has the advantage is if he catches player 2 when he is at a equipment or vehicle terminal. And even then player 1 has a chance especially if the battle is not close range� MA owns HA at longer ranges.

BadAsh