Politics of PLanetside (a warning from the past)

[internetn]

I KNOW WARBORN

I was just saying, that the colours made me think of a Russian Conscript, remember Red Alert 2? All there units were red and black.. It just stuck in my mind.. I wasn't saying your empire is a bunch of conscripts, I was just saying what they looked like

Another thing, that loyalty thing is a two sided spear, commiting to another cause, in my veiw, could be a act a disloyalty, but to some it would take extreme courage and yearning to be part of another cause.. What I mean, loyalty to a cause, can be different from loyalty to an empire..

(Ok that really didn't make sense to me)

I would have a hard time leaving the Terran Republic. Even though I don't support their veiws I do believe that it would be better to preserve peace than risk an all out war. But with the intervention of the respawn technology, the oppression would increase as to only let the Terran Republic core access it. Subconsciously idea's of freedom would flood my mind, and as with a number of other people and unrest would occur, especially since the ability of permanent death is gone. I along with numerous others, would seek this opertunity to make our idea's open to the world, and risk our lives to spread it, thus spawns the Vanu Sovereignty(?) and the New Conglomerate
ideals. I sided with the New Conglomerate because the Vanu with the Ancient Vanu weapons makes me think of, To much of a good thing is a bad thing...

BTW get it right, as someone said before the NC are Warmongoring Hippies.. jeeze people these days

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by internetn

I KNOW WARBORN

But the conscripts wore brown greatcoats.

Another thing, that loyalty thing is a two sided spear, commiting to another cause, in my veiw, could be a act a disloyalty, but to some it would take extreme courage and yearning to be part of another cause.. What I mean, loyalty to a cause, can be different from loyalty to an empire..

No, loyalty is very black and white. If you enlist in the military, leaving for any reason apart from army-sanctioned reasons for leaving (honorable discharge, death, etc) is disloyalty. Being loyal isn't something you do when your side is winning, or until you don't agree with some things your side is doing (although in the case of the TR, they've been doing the same thing for a thousand years, so signing up for them and not agreeing with their policies would make you a disloyal soldier to begin with). Being loyal is about doing your duty through the highs and especially the lows. Those guys I read about in the news who evaded their duty to go off and fight in Iraq are disloyal and cowards. It doesn't matter that they don't agree with the war or didn't think they'd need to fight. You enlist, you take an oath, you remain loyal and you do what you signed up to do.

[internetn]

Originally Posted by Warborn

But the conscripts wore brown greatcoats.

Remeber Red Alert 2? I still play that till this day, and the conscripts in that are red, so it stuck with me..

Originally Posted by Warborn

No, loyalty is very black and white. If you enlist in the military, leaving for any reason apart from army-sanctioned reasons for leaving (honorable discharge, death, etc) is disloyalty. Being loyal isn't something you do when your side is winning, or until you don't agree with some things your side is doing (although in the case of the TR, they've been doing the same thing for a thousand years, so signing up for them and not agreeing with their policies would make you a disloyal soldier to begin with). Being loyal is about doing your duty through the highs and especially the lows. Those guys I read about in the news who evaded their duty to go off and fight in Iraq are disloyal and cowards. It doesn't matter that they don't agree with the war or didn't think they'd need to fight. You enlist, you take an oath, you remain loyal and you do what you signed up to do.

Ok you got me there, I just look at the TR as way to oppressive in their govermental standerds. I can't remeber if it was on PSU of the PS website, but it was a bit of lore discribing what the Terrans did. I din't agree with it and that why I am apart of the NC... but this is just a game so that doesnt matter to much

Thank you warborn, you are the best debater(?)/proving somebody wrong kinda guy, makes these forum more interesting

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by internetn

Remeber Red Alert 2? I still play that till this day, and the conscripts in that are red, so it stuck with me..

The conscripts totally have brown greatcoats and little color-coded extras on them (can't recall exactly what parts of them are colored, probably helmets at least).

Actually, just found a screenshot of them. http://img88.exs.cx/img88/713/Consvet.jpg Brown coats, colored shoulder pads. They're still my favorite unit even if they wear brown coats though. For the Union, and all that. I dunno why they're dug in like the GI special ability though, but that's their sprite either way.

Ok you got me there, I just look at the TR as way to oppressive in their govermental standerds. I can't remeber if it was on PSU of the PS website, but it was a bit of lore discribing what the Terrans did. I din't agree with it and that why I am apart of the NC... but this is just a game so that doesnt matter to much

Just for the sake of discussion though, ALL of the people on Auraxis were TR personnel at first. Everyone was either a part of their science division or their military. Even though, yes, it makes no difference, all the people currently not in the TR are in fact turn coats, traitors, quislings, and any other name you want to call them to denote the fact that they betrayed the TR. The only people who aren't traitors are those still doing their duty and serving the TR despite the fact that the wormhole thing closed down.

[internetn]

Originally Posted by Warborn

The conscripts totally have brown greatcoats and little color-coded extras on them (can't recall exactly what parts of them are colored, probably helmets at least).

Red sticks out more...

Originally Posted by Warborn

Even though, yes, it makes no difference, all the people currently not in the TR are in fact turn coats, traitors, quislings, and any other name you want to call them to denote the fact that they betrayed the TR. The only people who aren't traitors are those still doing their duty and serving the TR despite the fact that the wormhole thing closed down.

OK fine then!! I'm a traitor and I'm proud of it! (Why does that sound wrong..)
Though I am curious, if you split or leave a said empire or outfit for reasons based on the failling leadership or horrible military prowess, does that make being a traitor wrong? EX. I know not all Iraqi soldiers before the war liked or approved of Saddam, and in the coming invasion they switched sides or gave up their arms. That makes them Traitors, but does it make them un-honorable? In my opinion they had to choose between the lesser evils.. which is better, supporting a dictator that reigns with terror, or going with people that are going to try liberate you?

I am in no why trying to turn this into a political discussion, well not one of the real world, but it was the best example I could give...

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by internetn

Red sticks out more...

Da, tovarich.

Though I am curious, if you split or leave a said empire or outfit for reasons based on the failling leadership or horrible military prowess, does that make being a traitor wrong? EX. I know not all Iraqi soldiers before the war liked or approved of Saddam, and in the coming invasion they switched sides or gave up their arms. That makes them Traitors, but does it make them un-honorable? In my opinion they had to choose between the lesser evils.. which is better, supporting a dictator that reigns with terror, or going with people that are going to try liberate you?

Yes, it makes them traitors and dishonorable. If they didn't like Saddam they shouldn't have enlisted as soldiers under his regime, then they wouldn't have been stuck with the dilemma of either being a traitor or dying in a hopeless fight. It should be said though that Saddam was a pretty cruel guy, and his military wasn't exactly a peachy bunch of guys either for the most part. I'm sure most of them were very disloyal when the time came, but they probably were happy as clams doing whatever dirty deeds Saddam may have asked of them (murder/maiming/etc) when they really didn't have any wars going on. So it's probably not the case that Saddam's army of virtuous good guys was stuck with the tragedy of either fighting and dying or following their hearts and helping the US. Most who did betray Saddam did so because they knew they were screwed, and were looking out for #1. Doing the "right thing" probably did not come into play whatsoever.

Basically, if you don't agree with the government, you don't enlist in its army. If you do anyway, you still have a responsibility to fight and perhaps die for your country because that's what you signed up to do. Leaving the army because you don't like their practices or their leadership is still disloyalty and in the old days you'd be shot for deserting, regardless of why you left. The only way the loyal soldier leaves the army is through honorable discharge or death.

[Untouchable]

Whoa..... too much text

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by Untouchable

Whoa..... too much text

That's cool, I wasn't replying to you, so if you don't want to read it you're more than welcome to do just that.