Infiltration Suit weaponry

[Shyfted One]

Originally posted by Warborn
However, I did think that AvPx or whatever it was called (it's a mod) was fantastic. Truly a great mod, and I wish more servers ran it. The Predator was a little more balanced, as were the Aliens, and the various interesting classes you could be (Combat Synthetic to Alien Queen) really topped it off. I never got tired of playing it, but I couldn't ever find a server for it.

InfamousAndy, the oldest member in Alpha, helped Karnivore a lot in testing that mod. It was a great and you're right about there never being a server around with it on. Andy has been working on his own mod for a while now and his newest version is going to add new types of weaponry and try to balance the game as much as possible, should be pretty good once it's finished. A few clans are plannign to put it on their server once it's done, so I'll put up a post in the Lounge about when it's released incase you're somewhat interested.

Specific certs would be nice since those who use the IS will already be very limited due to their small inventory and combat effectiveness.

[Tobias]

an IS with melee boster and doing secound attack would proably do tons of damage, proably a kill if you knife them in the head and they are a light. If not, whip out your pistol and start shootin. Keep regen implant or get the medical skills and heal, then go on to your next kill.

[Warborn]

Keep regen implant or get the medical skills and heal, then go on to your next kill.

Unless the enemy is totall unorganized, there won't be a next kill. Once you blow your cover and reveal your presence, people will be specifically looking for enemies in an IS. If you're in a base, they'll spray corridors and rooms before entering, and they'll probably travel in groups and use grenades a lot also. Unless you're just dicking around, and not trying to actually accomplish any sort of mission, you're better off using your implant slots for more important accessories.

[Tobias]

Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

[SpaceDrake]

Originally posted by Tobias
Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

Bah. We "IS people" create enough havoc to distract the guys inside the fortress to weaken the defenses so that the main assault force can barge in without taking as many casualties as they might otherwise take.

As for killing people... give a group of 10 guys in IS suits Beamers for anti-vehicle work or MAG-Scatters for anti-troop work and a good knife, and we'll kill plenty of people.

[Warborn]

Originally posted by Tobias
Im glad im only going to be dicking around in the game, but IS people are sissy's, not real men (and women) like us snipers.

They go out with no armor and no weapon bigger than a pistol, while you hide in the bushes and fight from 100 yards away. I think we both know who the real men really are.

As for killing people... give a group of 10 guys in IS suits Beamers for anti-vehicle work or MAG-Scatters for anti-troop work and a good knife, and we'll kill plenty of people.

Shotguns can fire solid slugs too. I'm sure the MAG-Scatter will have anti-armor rounds also. But, realistically, I don't think you're going to be able to hold enough anti-armor rounds in an IS to seriously harm, let alone take out any vehicles or MAX suits before you and your 9 friends are wiped out. They're pistols, after all. And you have no armor. If 10 guys with no armor and pistols could kill a lot of people, I'd be worried what 10 guys with Reinforced armor and heavy weapons and rifles could do.

[chaos1428]

Exactly, Warborn.

I 'can' see how a few more I.S. will be a little more effective, but I'm sorry, 1 worthless soldier + 9 worthless soldier = worthless squad. (worthless in the aspect of combat)

[SpaceDrake]

I still think that people underestimate the power of an IS suit. While we'd be worthless in a traditional firefight, much of the power of the IS suit is it's element of surprise. When they first get into a base undetected, they can gang up on individual guys and kill them before they know what hit them, or sneak up on a control/rearming center, toss plasma grenades in there (the IS suit can carry a few grenades IIRC), and then pump shotgun blasts/laser beams/rapid-fire pistol rounds/magnum shots into the ensuing chaos. The real trick would then be hiding yourselves while they search for you, and then causing more havoc with the search teams. Meanwhile, while the base is having to devote precious resources to hunting you down, the assault force you've been in contact with since the beginning starts it's assault on the now-distracted base.

And what about taking out remote defenses? The guys manning those will probably often find knives sticking out of their backs if they're not really careful (and if the infiltrator is really patient, not even then would he be entirely safe.) Or the infiltrators hack the security systems of a base, and suddenly nothing in the base works at all? The possibilities are endless. They're certainly not the ultimate soldier - but I certainly think they're more useful than people give them credit for.

(And I'm sorry, but if ten guys set their Beamers to anti-vehicle mode and shoot in unison at a Galaxy, it at the least will be too rickety to try and land in a hot LZ.)

[SandTrout]

We dont want the assassins from DAoC in this game. There needs to be another armor suitible for combat than just the stealth suit(which shouldnt be suitable for combat).

You either sneak, or your fight, chances are you cant do both.

[SpaceDrake]

Well now, keep in mind that once the initial element of surprise wears off, an IS group has to be REAL good at hiding and sneaking if they expect to survive more than a few seconds. Once the *** is up, they should have to think fast or they're dead.

I don't want uber invisible guys - I'm enough of an MMOG veteran to know that's a bad thing (TM). But if they're as useless as people make them out to be, what's the point?

[chaos1428]

SpaceDrake

I didn;t say they were worthless. In fact, attacking a base would be harder without them. I was just simply saying, fomr a combat standpoint, they SHOULD be worthless. If you ever played DAoC, then you know what SandTrout is talking about.

But hey, if you can manage to round up 10 I.S. guys, then more power to ya. Thats the beauty of MMOG's, creativity. Sometimes its for the better, sometimes its for the worse, but nonetheless, people. People make the game. If you can get 10 I.S. guys together, and start terrorising the battlefield, then shit ya man, do it. My point is simply that one I.S. should be worthless in combat. I.S.'s main concern should not be how mahy kills he can get, it SHOULD be taking out remote defenses. It SHOULD be hacking terminals. It SHOULD be to scare the bajesus out of base defenders.
So if anyone misunderstood my original point, I hope that clears it up

[NapalmEnima]

I think you gues are ignoring an important weapon available to everyone save MAXes.

Grenades.

If an infiltrator drops a plasma grenade on your head... chances are you'll just die.

But I think an infiltrator that has to kill someone has already messed up.

I see their role as more intel/sabatoge. Scoping out the enemy defenses, camping out near the command terminal or generators, waiting for the signal from their subtlety-impaired compainions outside.

When that signal is given, say goodbye to the gens, wall turrets, and command consol. It's been said you can hack the fixed turrets to disable them. To bad you can't actually take control of them... that would rock. Imagine a squad of infiltrators taking over all a bases turrets right before their friends arrive. Mayhem.

Suddenly going from fragile infiltrators to turret operators (heavily armed and armored) would most likely be a fun experience. I wouldn't envy the defenders...

[Ludio]

I think people dont understand SpaceDrake (if I'm wrong about this then sorry), while they are useless in traditional combat, a well played IS will never let people have that chance. They are sort of like snipers, if you can kill a person before they know you are there, then you are safe, a sniper is useless in 'traditional' combat, but he is still deadly. I too agree that their main role will be disruption of base defense by hacking the systems and such, but they can also take out a few defenders.

Perhaps the best comparison would be to TFC spies (although of course an IS suit is different because its invisible as opposed to looking like the enemy). They can kill heavily armed people with suprise, but they are useless when revealed. This means that an infiltrator will be able to take out a few people, but when faced with a group or someone who is extremely cautious and clears rooms with grenades then they will be dead, or at least on the defensive. They are not going to be unstoppable tanks, they are going to be patient and deadly killers who will only take out a few people, but more importantly cause fear in the enemy ranks. If the people defending a base have to clear a room with a grenade first, or travel in groups then the IS has done a fine job, regardless of how many people he has killed, he has lowered the efficiency of the defenders, allowing the attackers to take the base with less casualties.

Oh yes, and by a few people, I don't mean all at once, they will hunt individuals and ambush them from behind one at a time, with secondary knife attacks, or use grenades. Thats not to say they will be uselss if there is more than one person, just that they will have to be very good. If an IS gets more than a few than it means that the base defense is probably lazy and deserves to die

And if you thought that hacking a console was stressfull because you cant see whats going on around you, imagine counter-hacking a console when there is an IS running around in your base.

And I am not just a person trying to justify their role in the game, I really want to be a MAX heavy assault guy, lets see some IS try and backstab a walking tank!

[Zatrais]

So let me get this straight, you IS people are going to run into a base and start to knife people whit a knife that makes a sound in its secondary fire mode and hope to kill the person before he/she turns around and blows you away whit a jackhammer(or anny other weapon)..... Beeing stealthy is going to be hard, sound magnification, darklight emiters and just plain kick ass sound systems or headphones are going to be bad for you IS folks.

btw NapalmEnima could you point out where you got the info that a MAX can't use grenades? MAX's still got hands that could be used for grenade lobbing tho not for handeling anny equipment... I know a dev has stated that MAX's can't use anny BANKS, hacker tools, medkits etc but never heard them state it about grenades... heck MAX's might be able to use a pistol and grenades.... *shrug*

[�io]

People really should read our site a bit more.

Mechanized Assault eXo-suit
These are the big armors that have incredibly large weapons and special abilities. The drawback to these suits is that most miscellaneous equipment (like ACEs, BANKs, Med Applicators, etc.) can't be used due to the extreme clunkiness of the armors.

Just think of a MAX as a walking tank. No nades, no rifles, no REKs, nothing.