Extra Pistol Slot for Infils

[Madcow]

Originally Posted by Doppler

You dont like JagD who i know runs a cloaker extensively and you dont like me, both because we see this as a setback not a whole end of the world scenario, get a grip my friend.

I don't like JagD and I don't like you? I don't even know either of you, I don't like or dislike either. It's an odd concept, but I don't get emotionally attached to people on a message board. But let's look at what you said shall we?

"You don't like JagD who i know runs a cloaker extensively"

Actually, JagD stated before that he tried cloaking for 2 weeks and gave it up because it didn't fit his play style. Feel free to go ahead and visit this thread:
http://planetside-universe.com/forum...4&page=2&pp=15
to see pictures of his favorite loadouts. If he's got infil armor on with those loadouts you might want to go ahead and /report him for cheating.

So do I think that Jagd (who tried infil for two weeks before these base benefits took effect) or yourself (who puts on an infil suit on occasion for kicks) are the people that should be listened to in this scenario? Or do I think that myself and others who have characters dedicated to using the infil suit might have slightly more valuable info? Hmm, I wonder.

[PLaYbOrk]

FIrst off I am a hacker and a I have been an inful as well but I dunno unlike you people it takes me a spit second to switch between my REK and magscatter.
1) open inv, right click on REK
2)press tab aim hack and start
3)press tab keep arrow over mag scatter
4) if jumped right click mag scatter press tab and kill

[Jagd]

Originally Posted by Madcow

I don't like JagD and I don't like you? I don't even know either of you, I don't like or dislike either. It's an odd concept, but I don't get emotionally attached to people on a message board. But let's look at what you said shall we?

"You don't like JagD who i know runs a cloaker extensively"

blah blah blah

Wow, I feel so special, you're talking about me.

The only problem with your scenario of only asking for infiltraitor's feedback is that in case you haven't noticed, everyone seems to think that their empire/cert/whatever is unbalanced and needs a buff, and that everything else that they don't/won't/can't use is unbalanced and needs a nerf. Witness the lasher, striker, pounder, prowler, beamer, guass rifle, and every other god damn piece of gear in the game that has been hashed and rehashed and griped about on these and other forums since before the game was launched.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again-- for 2 cert points you should be damn happy with being invisible. Advanced medical costs 2 and all it does is lets you revive a dead guy once every blue moon.

[Madcow]

Originally Posted by Jagd

I've said it before, and I'll say it again-- for 2 cert points you should be damn happy with being invisible. Advanced medical costs 2 and all it does is lets you revive a dead guy once every blue moon.

Your input might be valuable if you bothered to read what other people write, but since you don't it's really not. Cloakers suffer more bugs than any other class, some of which render the invisibility nil. If for 2 cert points it was a worthwhile class, chances are pretty good you would have kept the certification instead of dumping it after 2 weeks. We're also talking about something common pool here, which is seeing a drop in every single empire. This isn't the same as bitching about nerfs being needed on an empire specific weapon. Do you honestly think that the comparison was valid?
In regards to the advanced med comment, I agree that it needs buffing as well. It actually has received one nice buff from the devs so at least it's on their radar. I wouldn't mind seeing your body stay in place while you are selecting your spawn point and during that entire countdown, rather than disappearing immediately when you elect to spawn. Seems an easy enough fix, and gives advanced medics in the area the chance to get to you and res you before you spawn.

[Queensidecastle]

I think you missed about half of the thread. "Infiltration" isnt just 2 certs, it is about BR 15-17 worth of Certs. The suit is worth 2 points but I would like to know what you think you are going to do with that having no support certs to back it up. Also Infils arent and never have been invisible since you can clearly see them when they are moving. Add to that 2 implants made to counter Infiltrators and the picture starts to look very different indeed.

Finally, are you missing out on the fact that Infiltrators crouch walking while cloaked are as visible as any other unit when there is an Interlink facility? and you think that is ok? Motion detectors in the SoI show cloaked infils that arent even moving. Hello, motion detectors detecting motionLESS cloaked individuals? Its just ridiculous is what it is

[Jagd]

Ok gripe on then, but so far nobody has explained why being invisible should make you ethereal as well; radar bounces off objects whether they're glass or solid or what have you.

Well anyways, I hope the devs give you what you want so you can stop feeling so sorry for yourselves.

[1024]

I'd liek to point a out a very pointy point.

MOTION Detectors. MOTION

How would that detect a still cloaker?

And it is a fact taht infiltrators have it off the worst(in terms of bugs/imbalances).

[Jagd]

I really want to let this go, but as I am sure you would agree 1024, it is very hard to let the other side have the last word, especially when they keep bringing up your points...

Motion detectors have always been an extension of the radar system. Their name is, however, somewhat misleading as I have yet to set off a spitfire/motion sensor trap and been able to have them shut themselves off by simply standing still. So you're right, the name "motion sensor" implies that it senses motion when in fact they have never really done just that, and have always acted as an extension to the base/tower radar networks. To me, this means they are de facto radar beacons, and it's a fact that this affects all players and not just the poor, downtrodden spandex crowd.

'Nuff said? I doubt it.

[Madcow]

You're right, it isn't 'nuff said. The reason for that is pretty simple. You're wrong.

Whether you wear infil suit, standard, agile, reinforced, anything you were always able to either crouch walk or hold shift and walk past/around/up to spitfires or motion sensors without them once noticing you. It was not always a 'de facto' radar beacon, although I appreciate you spicing up your post to make it sound a bit more thought out. Before the interlink benefit if you set off a spitfire you could go completely still and survive even with the infil suit on. It was far easier with any sort of armor. I did it many times. Why don't you try it now against an empire without the interlink facility benefit? Maybe you'll learn something new. Sure, it won't be as fun as being sarcastic without any facts to back up your argument but you'll get by.

[SandTrout]

Originally Posted by Jagd

Motion detectors have always been an extension of the radar system. Their name is, however, somewhat misleading as I have yet to set off a spitfire/motion sensor trap and been able to have them shut themselves off by simply standing still. So you're right, the name "motion sensor" implies that it senses motion when in fact they have never really done just that, and have always acted as an extension to the base/tower radar networks.

I would like to point out several flaws in your logic, Jagd.

A) It is not a "radar" network, that name is, how did you put it? Oh yeah, missleading. It is a sensor network that people commonly misname a "radar" network. It doesn't matter what you consider it, the motion sensor is not a fucking piece of radar equipment. It is just what it's name says "Motion-Detector" as in it "detects motion".

B) Before the interlink benifit, motion sensors ALWAYS removed you from enemy radar as soon as you stopped moveing. It is true that spitfires did not automaticly stop fireing, but that is more like a delayed reaction effect that is programed into them(same as if you shoot them).

C) What the hell is a radar pulse going to bounce off of from an infiltrator? You couldn't say its clothing because there is not necisaraly any large amount of metal or glass(think plastic). His weapon? Not realy because how would you distinguish between the metal of the pistol and the random bullets, shells, and natural metals found in the ground.

D) Yes, it does affect more than just in the infiltrator, but stop deludeing yourself. The infiltrator is prety much 100% dependant on his ability to remain UN-FUCKING-DETECTED to get anything accomplished. There is [b]no[b] other type of player that relies on this as heavily as the infiltrator.

Sorry to rant, but that was an amazeingly stupid and hypocritical(sp?) post JagD

[Doppler]

Originally Posted by Queensidecastle

I think you missed about half of the thread. "Infiltration" isnt just 2 certs, it is about BR 15-17 worth of Certs. The suit is worth 2 points but I would like to know what you think you are going to do with that having no support certs to back it up. Also Infils arent and never have been invisible since you can clearly see them when they are moving. Add to that 2 implants made to counter Infiltrators and the picture starts to look very different indeed.

Finally, are you missing out on the fact that Infiltrators crouch walking while cloaked are as visible as any other unit when there is an Interlink facility? and you think that is ok? Motion detectors in the SoI show cloaked infils that arent even moving. Hello, motion detectors detecting motionLESS cloaked individuals? Its just ridiculous is what it is

I meant to hit on this earlier but never got around to it. Being an infiltrator designed just to kill people requires only those 2 cert points, everything else is completely up to your style of play. About the only requirement for infiltrators (and this is debatable) is advanced hacking so you can do those sneak in and resecures. If you want to be a infiltrator that kills people those two cert points are all you need.
Enjoy your AMP gun, enjoy your gernades, enjoy your knife.

[Madcow]

Originally Posted by Doppler

I meant to hit on this earlier but never got around to it. Being an infiltrator designed just to kill people requires only those 2 cert points, everything else is completely up to your style of play. About the only requirement for infiltrators (and this is debatable) is advanced hacking so you can do those sneak in and resecures. If you want to be a infiltrator that kills people those two cert points are all you need.
Enjoy your AMP gun, enjoy your gernades, enjoy your knife.

Bad point. In order to be a grunt it requires 0 cert points. Anything else is completely up to your style of play.

Next?

[Jagd]

Sandtrout you're right, that was a little over the top. Madcow you're a fucking idiot dude, sorry to break it to you like this.

[Doppler]

Originally Posted by Madcow

Bad point. In order to be a grunt it requires 0 cert points. Anything else is completely up to your style of play.

Next?

Yes but then i whouldnt be invisable now whould I?

[Happy lil Elf]

I'd be all for a slot that has a dedicated REK in it maybe. Or a cert that acts like a REK and lets you hack just long enough off of a full stamina bar to hack/rehack a base on a full bar of stamina with a margin of maybe 10% stamina to help prevent lag etc from making you get to 95% of a hack and then sputter out.

I don't think infiltrators should get an extra slot for all use though. Throw a grenade then quick change and unload with a pistol would be kinda unfair imo.