Gameplay: Rotary Grenade Launcher for Engineer

[Madrey]

I posted this in the official forums but the only responses I got were people just venting frustrations about the current state of the game and what they think should be added in other words they just came in and took a big steamy one on my idea.

I hope I can get a little more constructive feedback on PSU, because you guys have better conversations.

So here goes...

What I had in mind is a non damage/debuff weapon that has a 12 round clip. The clip would be divided in to three sections allowing you to carry 3 types of ammo that can be switch to by pressing the alt fire button.

>This weapon would have access to every grenade type except damage, in the game.

>So you could pretty much equip 4 flash, 4 emp, and 4 concussion grenades.

>When an Engineer equips this gun they are allowed to equip a SMG in their secondary slot.

>You can only have 1 clip and resupply at terminals.

>You can buy extra clips (up to 2 having 3 total).

>The grenades will have a weaker/shorter effect but a larger radius than the hand grenade variant (think instead of a flash grenade lasting 5 seconds it will only last 3).

And that's it.

Thoughts?

[Rothnang]

That would just be overpowered, sorry.

The non-damage grenades aren't worse than the damaging grenades, they are balanced to be different but equally powerful, so chucking 12 of them in a row isn't suddenly balanced just because you said you can't put damaging grenades in the weapon.

Also SMGs aren't a significant step down from a Carbine, in fact they are better in some situations, so saying you're allowed to equip only an SMG alongside of this also isn't really a real balancing factor. SMGs are designed to be a valid alternative to carbines.



The main thing that any idea needs to contain IMO is a reason why this would improve the game. It has to inhabit a niche that currently nothing adequately fills, and I just don't see this niche of "There is nothing that allows a single player to fill an entire building with grenades" that needs filling.


I would actually like the idea better if the weapon shot damaging grenades that could be balanced so they aren't horribly lethal unless several of them hit you, sort of like the Demoman in TF2. If you've ever gone up against flashbangs or concussion grenades used right though you'd know how absurdly powerful it would be to have someone able to unleash 12 in a row on you.

[Madrey]

Originally Posted by Rothnang

That would just be overpowered, sorry.

The non-damage grenades aren't worse than the damaging grenades, they are balanced to be different but equally powerful, so chucking 12 of them in a row isn't suddenly balanced just because you said you can't put damaging grenades in the weapon.

Also SMGs aren't a significant step down from a Carbine, in fact they are better in some situations, so saying you're allowed to equip only an SMG alongside of this also isn't really a real balancing factor. SMGs are designed to be a valid alternative to carbines.



The main thing that any idea needs to contain IMO is a reason why this would improve the game. It has to inhabit a niche that currently nothing adequately fills, and I just don't see this niche of "There is nothing that allows a single player to fill an entire building with grenades" that needs filling.


I would actually like the idea better if the weapon shot damaging grenades that could be balanced so they aren't horribly lethal unless several of them hit you, sort of like the Demoman in TF2. If you've ever gone up against flashbangs or concussion grenades used right though you'd know how absurdly powerful it would be to have someone able to unleash 12 in a row on you.

I think you got the wrong idea on some of this, let me clarify somethings.

I never said you could shoot 12 of the same type in a row, and the grenades would be a "weaker" version of the hand held one. Weaker implying there would be no damage what so ever only status effect.

The whole point of the weapon was to create a new play style (Crowd Control) for all players not just engineers, who want to do something a little more tactical. Which is something that I feel is spread out across all the jobs(a flash here, an EMP there) and needs to be center on one.

The SMG idea comes from the fact that you won't be able to do any damage with this weapon. Plus SMG's have a smaller ammo pool and are slightly harder to range with.

I thought that if it shot 12 standard grenades or sticky's it would be the Under Barrel on steroids, that would be OP.

Thanks for the feedback.

[ShadetheDruid]

I think a grenade launcher would make more sense as an AI option for the heavy's tertiary slot (ie. to replace the rocket launcher). Having some utility for it beyond just damage grenades would be interesting though regardless, like loading it up with smoke grenades.

[rompafrolic]

SMGs are one of the more powerful CQC weapons around, and if we recall, engineers have an ammo pack. I would limit the secondary weapon to a pistol.

As for the grenade launcher, it would be far better to have damaging grenades than specialist grenades (even with a reduced radius/effect). Reason? Specialist grenades are called that for a reason: they exist to fulfill specific roles, and to allow classes other than the big three to take part in effective combat.

Also: great idea, it would fit the role of the engineer to a T!

[Rothnang]

Originally Posted by Madrey

The whole point of the weapon was to create a new play style (Crowd Control) for all players not just engineers, who want to do something a little more tactical. Which is something that I feel is spread out across all the jobs(a flash here, an EMP there) and needs to be center on one.

Yea, I just don't think the game would benefit from a dedicated crowd control class. If you're in a really big infantry battle you can already get into a situation where the game becomes near unplayable because there is so much smoke, the screen shakes the entire time etc.

I personally don't see why it would be desirable to have more of that.

[rompafrolic]

The thing about a multiple-class available weapon is that at some point you will end up with a lot of spam. If you have it as a side-grade to standard weapons, but forfeit your ability to throw grenades (for example), it could work: it presents some new and viable tactical options.

[MrMak]

The way i see grenade launchers working is making them empire specific and only allowing you to carry a pistol. Although iI can see a problem with giving them to the engineer since he can just plop down an ammo pack and just sti all tday by himself lobing grenades. Hell you can already do that with an underslung launcher. Maybe for the light assault?

Anyway they would work like this:

All lunchers would have a minimum range below which the grenades dont detonate, much like the underslung launchers but a bit further away. each aluncher would be diferent to reflect the faction it belongs to.

NC: Classic one shot per clip launcher with a long reload but powerfull projectile. the power of the [rojectile should be in blast radious rather than significantly increased power. It would be able to damage more people than an underslung but not necesarely do that much moredamage to them, at least the ones on the edge of the blast.

TR: Another classic, a Revolver mag style launcher. In fuctionality it would be similar to the Fury, lucnhing up to 6 weak grenades per clip with a decent fireing rate.

VS: It woudl have a slow sih fireing rate but 3 shots ber battery. I would fire plasma grenades which while less dmageing than the other launchers would leave a damaging plasma cloud on the impact site for several seconds kind of like that plama gun which could be mounted on one of the NC BFR's in PS1if i remember corectly. This woudl be more of a supression weapon.

NS: This would me a sort of middle of thel ine launcher avaliable to all factions. It would have 2 barrels much like the Loch-n-load from team fortress 2. Kind of like a dubble barreld shotgun but with grenades. The grenades would be pretty much equivalent to the ones from underbarrle launchers but you would get 2 per clip and a slightly faster relaoad.


Ammo: All of these would hve a set of ammo certs tht modify their functionality.

Armor piercing: If we went along and gave the thing to Light assaults, anti armor grenades could be installed turing the launchers to light Anti armor weapons. They would not be particularly powerfull in this role and would lose most of their blast radious. Say a full clip from the TR launcher in the back of the lightning would be about 1/3rd of its "health" with MBTs and sunderers being more resitant.

Incindirery: This would be only for the NS launcher. It woudl give it similar but inferior functionality to the VS launcher. This is so other factions have the option to supress enemy (and not complain VS are overpowered becouse they got those grenades). Incindirary nades would do little damage on impant and instead relay on the short area effect.