PS:N another look at the possibility of Space Combat

[Corax]

Hey guys and gals, I wanted to post this to a new thread because I was hoping to get some honest feedback on this idea that I have been kicking around since they put out that survey wayback when. Please take some time and read through and leave some good 'ole honest feedback and critiques on this idea as it is something that I personally would feel would add a tremendous amount of fun to PS:N. And be warned it is a bit of a wall of words. Thank you.

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I would love to see planetside 2 taken in a few directions which i will detail in the next few posts
1. Space battles
2. Fortress fights
3. City fights
4. Naval Warfare

1. Space Battles-
Meaning that players will be able to fight in a Zero G environment. Ranging from on foot to capital class cruisers.

This will allow for an extensive amount of new vehicals, weapons, and items.
The premise would be that each faction is vying for ultimate control of battle stations orbiting the planets in geo synchronous orbits. Each of these stations provide 3 main functions.

1.These "main" stations are where the HART travels to to allow for hot dropping into warzones.
2.. They have the fire control systems for the Orbital Strikes
3.They provide the only platforms for construction of the capital class battle ships.

Each of these battle stations will be the size of roughly 5 bases or possibly a sanctuary. Throughout the battle station there will be Hub's that control vital systems for the space station.

Ex: Hub #1 controls the security stations, allowing for the attacker/defender to trigger security fields (laser shielded doors) or spitfire wall turrets. Hub #2 contains control points for external turrets and defenses. Hub #3 Controls access to the H.A.R.T. Hub# 4 Controls access to the fire control systems for Orbital Strikes. Hub #5 Controls access to Vehicle creation bays. Hub #6 controls access to the generators.

The objective for any invader is to take each of these vital control points. Having control of all of them will award the victor bonuses to their empires fight on the planet below them. IE: Quicker recharge of their orbital strikes, faster troop deployments. Able to hot drop inside zones of influences. This is also a great way to attack a locked continent, as it will allow for the attackers to have an initial staging point.

Now the attackers need a way to attack these battle stations, and the defenders need a way to defend them on the outside.
This is where Planetside 2's core game engine can get a real overhaul to handle Zero G combat and physics.
Planetside will now feature space battle's.
For these engagements there will be 4 main types of ships.
1.Fighter
2.Frigates
3.Cruisers
4.Capital Ships
5.Flag Ship

Fighters come in two forms. The 1 man fighter or the 2 man bomber. Essentially easy to mass produce and use. Any space cadet will be able to use one of these. Crew's 1 - 2
Think from a wasp to a Liberator.
Can be piloted by anyone.


Frigates are a step up from a fighter. They have better shielding and weapons and are still nimble enough to avoid heavier guns. Very customizable for the players choice. Has a crew of 1 – 3
Think a main battle tank

Cruisers: This is where the game takes a new turn. The cruiser acts as a mobile spawn point in space. And it has a vehicle bay that can create fighters. Roughly the size of a tower. It provides weaponry to fend off smaller ships and can feature a main weapon to engage capital class ships. Crew 1 – 5
Think: Bang Bus
Can be Piloted by anyone

Capital Ships: This is the big boy. Its roughly the size of a base. It has point defense weapons as well as main weapons. The point defense weapons range from automated spitfire turrets, to man-able emplacements (wall turret). The main weapons are designed to engage enemy capital class ships at a distance. Features control Hubs for its critical systems as well as a docking bay. Crew 1 – 10
Think: Flying base
Can only be piloted by Cr 3 - 5

Flag Ship: The Empires biggest ship in that sector. Can only have a limit of 1. It features a doomsday weapon (very powerful, limited fires). Numerous control hubs for critical systems.
Think 2 Bases stuck together
Can only be piloted by CR 4's and 5's
.
Features of the game:
Crews:
For the ships in space they can have what is essentially a crew. If a player does not fill this crew spot it becomes automated. Anyone can crew, but only the owner can fly. Each of these crew locations will provide significant boosts if a player fills it.
Pilot: Actively flys and maneuvers
-Automated: Drifts/pilots to nearest friendly ship/etc
Targeter: Provides lock on for tracking targets and target data. (health, armor, shields, trajectory, etc)
-Automated: Allows players to see on radar
Weapons (possible for multiple): Fires weapons
-Automated: Acts as a spitfire/wall turret etc
Power: Can adjust power levels in ship for stronger shields/weapons/speed. Ie: divert engine power to shields to bulk them up
-Automated: Keeps all power levels even

Base sized ships:
Hubs: Each of these hubs control a critical system that can be hacked/destroyed.
Security: Controls for locked doors and automated turrets and blast doors.
External defenses: Control automated outer defense weapons (anti-boarding)
Generator: Disable the generator to disable all systems. Blow it up to destroy the ship entirely(very very very hard to do)/ Also controls gravity in ship. Disable to fight in Zero G.
Communications room: Controls all non whisper or squad chat
Spawn Tubes: Players spawn room
CC room (Bridge): Controls ownership of ship
Engine Room: Controls engines for ship
ETC


New Equipment
New E.V.A suit for surviving in space or vacumless areas. Has boosters for maneuvering.
Breaching charges. High-yield boomer charges for cutting through space ship hulls. Long delay on trigger.
Blast-doors
Capital class weapons. Makes a flail look like a pea shooter.
Boarding torpedos.
This equipment allows a single player burrow into a hull of a ship and assault it right away.
Can also provide for a spawn point
Squad sized torpedos that act as an AMS.
Ion cannons and weapons. Acts as an emp charge for ship wide systems.
Escape Pods
-Allows multiple players to eject from a dying ship. Acts as a drop pod from a H.A.R.T.

Gameplay Mechanics
Full Zero G environments outside of ships / Full range of motion.
Ships can navigate in 3d
Full real world physics.
Full hull destructibility.
This means depending on the strength of the hull (walls) certain weapons may pierce them and cause explosive decompression. So capital class weapons may be able to pierce multiple hulls at once. Blast-doors will automatically seal off breached areas
Decompression
If a hull is breached players can be sucked out into space. After decompressing the area now is a vaccum. Any player without a E.V.A or Rexo suit will die (slowly).
Players will have the option to destroy the critical structures from the outside with capital ship weapons and bombing or strafing runs. Or if they are feeling bold, board the ship and capture it for themselves. Or destroy it from the inside out with demolition charges.
-IE: Destroy engines on ship to disable movement. Communication array to disable chat. Targeting array to disable lock ons, etc.
It terms of time:
Destroy systems from inside – Fastest
Capture systems from inside – medium
Destroy systems from the outside – longest

It terms of difficulty:
Capture from inside: Hardest
Destroy from inside: Medium
Destroy from outside: Easiest
Etc

Escape Pods for players to escape from dying ships. Depending on damage either a ship will take some time to break apart. Or it will go critical and just explode out right. Ships are capable of coming apart in pieces thus allowing some players a chance to survive.

Destroyed ships will leave debris for quite some time for further challenges and a very dynamic battlefield

Can include deep space combat. So players can experience worm holes, asteroid belts, black holes, stars, learning to fly against gravity wells, hyperspace, etc.
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Thoughts, ideas, comments?

[Raymac]

Dude, it looks like you have a whole game worked out there. And I believe that might be the problem. If there is 1 thing the caves taught us is that creating a whole area seperate from the main battlefield only splits the players. While in the early days, that wasn't much of a problem with mulitple pop-locks on mulitple servers, it certainly is a problem now, so it may be something thats better left for an Expansion once PS:N is well established.

I do like the idea though, but it might just be because I'm a Star Wars geek. Also it reminds me a bit of the very very first online mulitplayer game that I ever played called Decent back in 1996. We strung a phone cord between 2 dorm rooms to link up our computers. Oh how far we've come.

[Corax]

Yea, I can see what you mean in that it would detract from the initial release.

One of the ways that it could be incorporated into the natural flow would be to have so you could use those space stations to invade empire controlled continents, so that way battles could have a sort of natural progression....

For example:
Players are at sanc, the continent for attack is locked out. So players launch a fleet, commence attack on and siege space station, they cap it and then gain a link that can be used to invade that continent.

Another thing that would actually be pretty interesting if it could be implemented that has been mentioned beforethat would really make this idea work nicely would be to have a seamless transition from space to land through the use of atmospheric entry. Also control of the station would allow players to hot drop ground vehicals or deploy via squad sized drop pods thus allowing for a very nice tactical advantage.

The other way this would enhance the game just from an artistic standpoint would be folks on the ground would have a clear view of these atmospheric entry's and exits that could add some really nice aesthetic feels to the game and add a clear sense of connection to the two battlefields. And it could be cool to see ships crashing from space or blowing up in the atmosphere

[Corax]

Yea, I can see what you mean in that it would detract from the initial release.

One of the ways that it could be incorporated into the natural flow would be to have so you could use those space stations to invade empire controlled continents, so that way battles could have a sort of natural progression....

For example:
Players are at sanc, the continent for attack is locked out. So players launch a fleet, commence attack on and siege space station, they cap it and then gain a link that can be used to invade that continent.

Another thing that would actually be pretty interesting if it could be implemented that has been mentioned beforethat would really make this idea work nicely would be to have a seamless transition from space to land through the use of atmospheric entry. Also control of the station would allow players to hot drop ground vehicals or deploy via squad sized drop pods thus allowing for a very nice tactical advantage.

The other way this would enhance the game just from an artistic standpoint would be folks on the ground would have a clear view of these atmospheric entry's and exits that could add some really nice aesthetic feels to the game and add a clear sense of connection to the two battlefields. And it could be cool to see ships crashing from space or blowing up in the atmosphere

[Raymac]

I like where your head is at Corax. I can see it in my mind's eye now and it would be glorious. There's a vid out there, and I'm at work so I don't have time to look it up, but it's showing off some engine where they start off showing detail on a space station in orbit over a planet, and then it zooms down seamlessly to the surface showing the landscape. IF they could do something like that, it would be beyond awesome. In fact, the game that does make that a reality will be my pimp.

Just playing devil's advocate here though, the way you described the space stations linking with continents is actually extremely similar to how the caves work, so that wouldn't solve the problem of splitting the population. In fact it's hard for me to imagine a way to intigrate it without splitting the population.

Hopefully, PS:N (or PS2) will be such a huge success that we have a problem with over-crowding, and splitting the forces is a benefit. Personally, I'd love to see a 6 axis, Zero G environment to fight in. The X-Wing and Tie Fighter games are some of my all time favorites, so combining something like that to Planetside....OMG....sorry I need to go get a towel.

[Traak]

There are only three axes.

[Raymac]

Originally Posted by Traak

There are only three axes.

Yeah, I know, six directions along 3 lines. You know what I meant, dude.

[Tikuto]

I'd like how space combat brings human colonists closer to the remnants of the collapsed wormhole nearby in deadspace.

I'd also like the suggestion of how space combat would segregate infantry and vehicles.

[Corax]

I see what ya mean Ray. But for sake of argument, what would need to be done to make it so it does not go the way of core combat and splits everything, but in fact is part of the natural progression of attack?

One of the solutions I thought of would be to treat it like its own "continent" in that it is just another area for the factions to vie over. For instance instead of say Esamir, we now have a orbital fleet engagement. That way control of these space stations can still affect the planetary fight, but would still be another area to take over that is necessary for global domination. That way its just another battle field.

Perhaps IF it were included in the release, it would be perceived as a vital aspect of fighting, rather more so then a secondary objective to take and hold. Meaning that if were important enough to be seen as a primary objective and battle ground it would see a whole lot more of fights. Like I said above it would be a brand new "continent" so it would be treated as a viable primary battlefield like old oshur, cyssor, esamir, etc etc.

WHat do you think, or what are some ideas you think this gameplay could be incorporated?

@Tikuto, precisely. It would be an excellent way to break up the pace of constant ground pounding combat and add variety to the game. While also allowing players to fight in a way that really opens up the possibilities for creative tactical planning. And the inclusion of space can open up new vistas to explore. Ie: the collapsed wormhole, asteroids, black holes, nebulae, etc etc

[opticalshadow]

Originally Posted by Raymac

There's a vid out there, and I'm at work so I don't have time to look it up, but it's showing off some engine where they start off showing detail on a space station in orbit over a planet, and then it zooms down seamlessly to the surface showing the landscape..

right now the best example i could imagine for space to planetary travel is an independent MMO dev behind http://www.infinity-universe.com/

its a game with a universe (or will be, with many planets galxies and such, and im talking like, scale to real planets and real universe size here)

in anycase the entire engine as of now is zoneless, all one seamless enviremoent and if you watch the videos the one has the guy going from a space station to a planet surface, maybe what you were thinking of?

[Raymac]

Originally Posted by opticalshadow

right now the best example i could imagine for space to planetary travel is an independent MMO dev behind http://www.infinity-universe.com/

its a game with a universe (or will be, with many planets galxies and such, and im talking like, scale to real planets and real universe size here)

in anycase the entire engine as of now is zoneless, all one seamless enviremoent and if you watch the videos the one has the guy going from a space station to a planet surface, maybe what you were thinking of?

Yup, that is exactly the game I was thinking of. Very cool videos.

@Corax - I'm not sure of a better way than what you described. It's a different environment so it would be difficult for it to exist in the same place as a planet surface. Perhaps simply having it be its own zone is the best thing so it wouldn't split the population any more than any other zone would. I think it would be really cool to see an idea like yours in the game.

[MgFalcon]

The next CoD (after MW3) has been alluding to space combat. http://www.computerandvideogames.com...t-year-report/

Just saying