Liberators too strong?

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 08:03 PM

So i have had some bad experiences lately with Liberators and just checking if im the only one. To preface this i do roll with an outfit and yes we will have 4-5 dual bursters providing air cover... So how can a lib that is way outside of firing range of a max either Vertical or horizantal (1-2 hex's away but points noise up or to the side so gunner can fire into the base) so DAMNED effective? we took gravel pass last night and started taking some air fire so grabed some max's and positioned them all over they cleared the ESF's no problem but the LIBS! there was 2 that were at max cieling just circling raining the pain down which we could scare off for long enough for them to repair and come back. but couldn't kill them so to scare them off we would lose 2-3 infantry every time. but the WORST was there was a few hovering over ZURVAN! a hex away and would just raise the nose or roll to the side and they would fire in from there completely out of range. So at this point we grabed a few A2A scythes which though they fired a full load of missles only got 2 of them but in the proccess got shot down by the 6-7 other liberators.

Nolerhn · 2012-12-20, 08:14 PM

Originally Posted by Fear The Amish

So i have had some bad experiences lately with Liberators and just checking if im the only one. To preface this i do roll with an outfit and yes we will have 4-5 dual bursters providing air cover... So how can a lib that is way outside of firing range of a max either Vertical or horizantal (1-2 hex's away but points noise up or to the side so gunner can fire into the base) so DAMNED effective? we took gravel pass last night and started taking some air fire so grabed some max's and positioned them all over they cleared the ESF's no problem but the LIBS! there was 2 that were at max cieling just circling raining the pain down which we could scare off for long enough for them to repair and come back. but couldn't kill them so to scare them off we would lose 2-3 infantry every time. but the WORST was there was a few hovering over ZURVAN! a hex away and would just raise the nose or roll to the side and they would fire in from there completely out of range. So at this point we grabed a few A2A scythes which though they fired a full load of missles only got 2 of them but in the proccess got shot down by the 6-7 other liberators.

To me this is a situation where you rally people in your empire to clear the skies. Libs have tons of armor, and I'd like to see that not change, but some people rallying against a very specific threat can have surprising successes.

How many A2A scythes did a your outfit field?

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 08:19 PM

5-10 but my problem is that the Liberators are now equally good at Air 2 Air and Air 2 Ground without changing anything. Were as any other vehicle or infantry in the game is only useful against one. All they have to do is roll to the side and that Dalton is amazing at smacking down an ESF attempting to intercept. You can't go above them and drop on them were they are weak because they sit at cieling. You cant approach from rear or sides because of location of the tail gun turret. you DO NOT! want to approach from bottom or front because they wwill just eat you.

Whiteagle · 2012-12-20, 08:19 PM

Yeah, this might be a symptom of weak G2A AA...

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 08:22 PM

we actually did clear them out... by grabing dalton lib's and doing the same thing....

Whiteagle · 2012-12-20, 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by Fear The Amish

we actually did clear them out... by grabing dalton lib's and doing the same thing....

Ok yeah, if they are bad enough flyers that you can take them out with Cannon fire, then it is DEFININTLY a symptom of weak G2A AA...

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by Whiteagle

Ok yeah, if they are bad enough flyers that you can take them out with Cannon fire, then it is DEFININTLY a symptom of weak G2A AA...

lol actually no we had to get to ceiling then roll to the side and shoot them with a Dalton then turn so the tail gunner could finish like they were doing to our scythes.

GreatMazinkaise · 2012-12-20, 08:32 PM

How are they getting kills at the flight ceiling? Infantry don't render that far up in my experience (unless maybe you're in really sparsely populated fights).

Libs are only strong when they've got air superiority and ground AA is sparse. Skyguards are still fairly bad, but those invisible surprise MAX nests remain incredibly nasty.

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 08:56 PM

the Dalton's bomb is server side no need for "render"

Fear The Amish · 2012-12-20, 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by DjEclipse

Liberators too strong? Duh.

The top ten of the Leadership board is filled with Lib whores.

more looking for what you could do to change there effect

GreatMazinkaise · 2012-12-21, 12:16 AM

Originally Posted by Fear The Amish

the Dalton's bomb is server side no need for "render"

I guess that makes the difference then... we (and most others) use Daltons because the Zephyr is much better for farming infantry - you can't score with a Zephyr without targets rendering.

NoXousX · 2012-12-21, 12:38 AM

The problem is SOE made libs massive slow flying protection warriors that deal a lot of damage. Why is that an issue?

1) The majority of the time libs are either eating people alive, or being eaten alive.
2) That vast (and I mean vast) majority of lib pilots don't have the skill to determine whether or not they can be sucessful defensively when they get attacked by enemy air.
3) In low population scenarios they are unstoppable.
4) In high population scenarios (assuming people actually pull AA), they spend all their time getting flak sniped at a distance.

NoX's solution?
Libs need to be faster and more maneuverable with significantly less health.

Having said that consider the following:
If you put a lib in the hands of a great pilot with a great gunner (for example ScourgeOftheServer/Twf), this lib can single-handedly turn the tides of battles. For any other pilot they are just another target in the sky... an annoyance.

The learning curve is steep, and it's frustrating on both ends.

NoXousX · 2012-12-21, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Fear The Amish

the Dalton's bomb is server side no need for "render"

Show me a video of this, and I'll believe it.

boogy · 2012-12-21, 12:50 AM

Yes Liberators are too strong. Doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.
There are plenty grey areas of balance in this game. Liberators being too strong(offensively) is not one of them.

The damage of their weapons are pure OP ridiculous. The area of effect, splash damage, or whatever crap you call it is out of line. I was a MAX with flack level 3 armor, halfway in a building and got killed by that BS. The feeling a player gets when that happens is akin to being shot through the wall by a hacker. It's frustrating, not fun, enough to make you quit.

Ghoest9 · 2012-12-21, 12:55 AM

Libs should cost more.