Driver/Gunners... NO! - Page 10

vVRedOctoberVv · 2012-07-10, 07:38 PM

Originally Posted by TheDAWinz

No, i want to be able to control a MBT single handed rather than having to use a lightning to do it. Durp.

Exactly. You want to be able to Rambo it. There is no real substance to your argument than "because I wanna WIN!". Doing it this way, tanks become extensions of MAX suits. They're just bigger, heavier, louder.

There is already a solo tank. The Lightning. It is effective against most everything except the larger tanks. Again, not everyone needs to be able to do EVERYTHING. The whole concept is flawed. The larger tanks are effective against all the other land vehicles, except they require multiple crewmen.

SgtExo · 2012-07-10, 07:38 PM

Originally Posted by SixShooter

With the Magrider they would have to completely re-designed it to have it be more like the other MBT's. I'm down for learning how to master it how it is rather than have them take the time to redesign it since it would probably add another six months or so.

Having a turret less hover tank is not a hard thing to learn to use. When I played BF 2142, I would always take the hover tank over the normal one even if it didn't have a turret. Because of its strafing ability, it can use cover more effectively against other tanks and infantry by not having to show its side while going into and out of cover, it can keep its front armor facing the opposition all the time.

CorvicM · 2012-07-10, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by WorldOfForms

Did everyone forget that the lightning now replaces the skyguard? It has the most powerful vehicle-mounted AA weaponry.

So, yes, it still very much has a role.

so then why have it be a tank then. and not dedicated AA?

vVRedOctoberVv · 2012-07-10, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by TheDAWinz

Simple, humans have monovision. We see 180 degrees, (or atleast in my case i do) and we simply turn our head to see a spot. Also FOV, we can have a higher FOV than our gunners, thus making them useless. I rather see things with my own eyes.

Ok, I'm starting to see what's wrong with you...

#1... Oh fuck it. I'm not even going to bother going into this...

fod · 2012-07-10, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by TheDAWinz

Simple, humans have monovision. We see 180 degrees, (or atleast in my case i do) and we simply turn our head to see a spot. Also FOV, we can have a higher FOV than our gunners, thus making them useless. I rather see things with my own eyes.

simple if we can see 180 degrees then there will be a further 180 degrees that humans CANT see
unless you have eyes on the back of your freakin head

you can turn your head all you like but there will still be a 180 degree blind spot

TheDAWinz · 2012-07-10, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by vVRedOctoberVv

Exactly. You want to be able to Rambo it. There is no real substance to your argument than "because I wanna WIN!". Doing it this way, tanks become extensions of MAX suits. They're just bigger, heavier, louder.

There is already a solo tank. The Lightning. It is effective against most everything except the larger tanks. Again, not everyone needs to be able to do EVERYTHING. The whole concept is flawed. The larger tanks are effective against all the other land vehicles, except they require multiple crewmen.

"I wana WIN" Is a valid argument in a fps. Fuck, if you want that? Play ARMA like everyone else who want that fix of complexity (like me). But when i want a fps, I expect it to play as a fps.

Sephirex · 2012-07-10, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by fod

errr wrong

explain how 1 person sees more than 2?

Kinda makes me think of the Game of Thrones discussion King Robert has about 5 armies being better then one?

He holds up an open hand and wiggles his finger and says "Five".

He then holds up a fist and says "One."

Point was unity is always better then overall numbers.

Don't know if it applies, but still reminded me.

TheDAWinz · 2012-07-10, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by fod

simple if we can see 180 degrees then there will be a further 180 degrees that humans CANT see
unless you have eyes on the back of your freakin head

you can turn your head all you like but there will still be a 180 degree blind spot

Ever heard of 360 FOV? yeah.

Asisdead · 2012-07-10, 07:41 PM

Was trying to read the whole thread but it was moving too fast so i decided to skip ahead to page 9 for my first post. I really think they need to at the very least make it an option for the driver to just drive and the gunner to just gun. Some people talk about people will need to get used to it, or one takes more skill than the other I just dont like that it makes certain things impossible.

Ive been playing planetside since 2004 on and off mainly as VS and with the magrider especially since you have the lowest armor knowing when to dodge and weave can be life or death if you can make the other gunner miss a few of his shots and use your gunners range advantage you can win. This is when i have the most fun tank driving knowing that my clutch driving saved our lives ducking into trees so my gunner can shoot in between cover.

What would I be doing in planetside 2? If i come up on a tank i'll look at it, and shoot it civil war style as we both sit there, or i'll move the tank backwards while aiming at the other tank and shooting while i cant see behind me at all? Will i have to have my gunner be my rear view mirror and call out if theres a tree on vent? I Really hope they think this tank design over or let us have the option to choose since customization has been the name of the game it seems.

Figment · 2012-07-10, 07:42 PM

Alright... here we go AGAIN...

I absolutely hate the idea of a driver/gunner in PlanetSide and will ALWAYS support driver + REQUIRED gunner over the first.

Wrote a huge rant about it, but the argumentation is known.

Basically the argumentation of the people in favour of solo MBTs:

"Just driving is not fun!"
BULL! Speak for yourself, not for everyone else! You're a tiny minority! I don't know anyone who I play with who thinks driving is boring. That's over 150 PS players on my list! Not one of them thinks it's boring! Weird, because the few supporters always try to make it seem an universal known fact.
"I can't find gunners!"
BULL! You just don't know where to look! HINT: NOT at the end of the vehicle terminal and stop driving Raiders! Don't wait behind a vehicle pad, but on the path from base to vpad! Because everyone assumes no ride is available and thus will first go for the term and by then they already summoned their own vehicle! If the base/CY is almost empty, look near towers, look near AMSes near the edge of a battlefield! Those people are in need of transportation and LOVE gunner positions because they don't have to go back and get their own vehicle!
"People from other games want solo vehicles!"
BULL! If that was true, we wouldn't be having this discussion! We're all originally from solo play games and we all grown accustomed to it! And we like it so much we have very heated, passionate debate over it!
"But multicrew vehicles will still be better when you got a gunner!"
BULL! Because why would you get a gunner, if you can get double the hitpoints by getting another tank with instant switch-multirole weapons that are even more powerful?
"But multicrew vehicles will be able to fend of aircraft better!"
BULL! Because in PS2 it appears you can instantly switch between driver and secondary gunner position! Which means that despite having to stand still, you have equal AA power if you brought the custom gun and if you brought another tank you have double the AA power, while both a single and multicrew tank die equally fast to hits, meaning two tanks is better again as when one dies the other still continues to fire.
"But the resource system will balance that!"
Probably bull! By the above argumentation, teamwork vehicles drain faster because they're underpowered in comparison to groups of solo-vehicles.

I've not heard a single even slightly convincing argument in favour of multicrew vehicles being driven solo.

Personally, I'm almost under the impression the entire goal of the change is to encourage people to drive as many vehicles solo as possible for three reasons:

1. The devs think in zerg play more than team game play and therefore intend to have as many vehicles out there as possible.

2. The more vehicles are out there, the more people will buy customized parts and skins.

3. More tanks means a larger drain on resources, so it might be in the hope that people go through their resources faster and thus either buy some boosters or have to gun or grunt after all.

None of those three arguments appeals to me.

TheDAWinz · 2012-07-10, 07:42 PM

Originally Posted by Asisdead

Was trying to read the whole thread but it was moving too fast so i decided to skip ahead to page 9 for my first post. I really think they need to at the very least make it an option for the driver to just drive and the gunner to just gun. Some people talk about people will need to get used to it, or one takes more skill than the other I just dont like that it makes certain things impossible.

Ive been playing planetside since 2004 on and off mainly as VS and with the magrider especially since you have the lowest armor knowing when to dodge and weave can be life or death if you can make the other gunner miss a few of his shots and use your gunners range advantage you can win. This is when i have the most fun tank driving knowing that my clutch driving saved our lives ducking into trees so my gunner can shoot in between cover.

What would I be doing in planetside 2? If i come up on a tank i'll look at it, and shoot it civil war style as we both sit there, or i'll move the tank backwards while aiming at the other tank and shooting while i cant see behind me at all? Will i have to have my gunner be my rear view mirror and call out if theres a tree on vent? I Really hope they think this tank design over or let us have the option to choose since customization has been the name of the game it seems.

Press V to look behind you. I imagine a similar system in planetside.

Azarga · 2012-07-10, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by fod

simple if we can see 180 degrees then there will be a further 180 degrees that humans CANT see
unless you have eyes on the back of your freakin head

you can turn your head all you like but there will still be a 180 degree blind spot

To achieve that the gunner will have to be turned to direction opposite to movement. Shooting from that position seems very situational to me.

fod · 2012-07-10, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by TheDAWinz

Ever heard of 360 FOV? yeah.

cant have 360 fov in ps2 they have said it will be limited to something like 110 degrees

next.!

(just admit it you are a rambo solo player that wants to do everything himself)

Originally Posted by WorldOfForms

Did everyone forget that the lightning now replaces the skyguard? It has the most powerful vehicle-mounted AA weaponry.

So, yes, it still very much has a role.

mbt's will also have AA weaponry so again there is no need for lightnings if everyone can solo drive a mbt

TheDAWinz · 2012-07-10, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by fod

cant have 360 fov in ps2 they have said it will be limited to something like 110 degrees

next.!

(just admit it you are a rambo solo player that wants to do everything himself)

mbt's will also have AA weaponry so again there is no need for lightnings if everyone can solo drive a mbt

Press v to look behind you. Take battlefield, go in third person, always spot people behind me.

fod · 2012-07-10, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by Azarga

To achieve that the gunner will have to be turned to direction opposite to movement. Shooting from that position seems very situational to me.

happens all the time in ps1

Originally Posted by TheDAWinz

Press v to look behind you. Take battlefield, go in third person, always spot people behind me.

while you are pressing v to look behind you a chopper takes you out from the front because you wasnt looking in that direction