Higby Wants Your Thoughts on Iron Sights for FPS..... - Page 12

Casual · 2012-01-10, 04:15 AM

Originally Posted by DarkFate

Everyone knows that actually using the ironsights feature is optional, right? You don't have to actually ironsight to fire a weapon.

You know what else is optional? Winning.

In most games ADS is in it's flat out better than firing from the hip nearly all the time.

SKYeXile · 2012-01-10, 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by DarkFate

Everyone knows that actually using the ironsights feature is optional, right? You don't have to actually ironsight to fire a weapon.

I hate you so much right now.

Princess Frosty · 2012-01-10, 04:56 AM

Originally Posted by Gandhi

As soon as it affects accuracy it stops being optional. If you want to make it purely a cosmetic thing to 'enhance realism' I'm totally fine with that, but that's not how it's going to be.

Since this game is all about customization why don't we just add a "Shooting From The Hip" attachment? Or at least let us change the iron sight for each gun to something we can live with, from nothing at all to holographic ones to a giant metal rectangle that covers up everything in front of you. That way all that's left is the actual mechanic, which I still don't like for this game but could probably live with.

This makes the assumption that adding in iron sights lowers whatever hip shooting accuracy exists in the game. It could be the case that hip accuracy has not been changed and that ironsights are simply an optional trade off of accuracy vs mobility.

It's always an option whether to use them or not, they're not universally superior to hip firing, if they're done right they offer some benefit/drawback trade off which is player choice to decide to use or not, if you want to just fire from the hip then you can but you'll have to alter your tactics around that so you stay in close range to help make the most of it.

Fate · 2012-01-10, 05:08 AM

Originally Posted by Casual

You know what else is optional? Winning.

In most games ADS is in it's flat out better than firing from the hip nearly all the time.

Because ironsighting with a shotgun in Modern Warfare makes it more accurate, right?

Kouza · 2012-01-10, 05:16 AM

Looks like i`m the last to chime in.

Iron sights, are awesome in games but, to be frank I feel what made planet side unique was its arcade feel. If you put that in you pull from that. That being said, before the games released how could we possibly know.

Casual · 2012-01-10, 06:04 AM

Originally Posted by DarkFate

Because ironsighting with a shotgun in Modern Warfare makes it more accurate, right?

No, but that doesn't invalidate my statement. Just about any assault rifle in that game performs better at almost all ranges in iron sights. It's not a choice when one option is clearly better.

My first post in this thread explains my position on this more clearly. I'm not against ADS, it just has to be done right and actually add to planetside gameplay instead of completely alter the way the game functions.

I want a game that improves upon planetside 1, not just a sequel that looks like it but plays completely different.

Coreldan · 2012-01-10, 06:07 AM

I had a pretty far thought out idea how to implement all this, but seeing that the way ADS will be implemented is probably already implemented, I dont think I can be bother typing it all out lol.

CutterJohn · 2012-01-10, 09:15 AM

Given the futuristic context of the game, its not entirely unreasonable for the weapon and armor to have gizmos that detect where the gun is pointing, exactly, and thus allowing you to fire the weapon without physically using sights.

So.. Maybe keep sights. Those are the basic option. You can also purchase a weapon upgrade that makes sights irrelevant, allowing you to run and gun much more proficiently. The downside to it would be you no longer get zoom.

Coreldan · 2012-01-10, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

So.. Maybe keep sights. Those are the basic option. You can also purchase a weapon upgrade that makes sights irrelevant, allowing you to run and gun much more proficiently. The downside to it would be you no longer get zoom.

This was a big deal in my suggestion I mentioned above that I was too lazy to write about.

So basically, all weapons would be decently accurate to suffice in CQB outside ironsights, but still inaccurate enough that at (at least) 50+ meters you would pretty much feel the need to ironsight to get the extra zoom and perhaps more accuracy too.

Planetside has so big areas that some sort of zoom is needed, personally I rather see it through ironsighting somehow than some "here, have binoculars integrated into your eyeball" that we had in PS

Espion · 2012-01-10, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by CyclesMcHurtz

Almost no non-suppression fire team role will shoot from the hip (IRL), it's just a waste of ammunition.

I hope you're not using too much RL example as a basis for SciFi game development. I'm all for people being able to zoom in, but I think slowing people down is a terrible idea... and if there's no slowdown from zooming then you can't really go crazy with CoF/recoil decreases.

Mechanics that raise the skill ceiling and give players the tools they need to perform better is a much better alternative than artificial bonuses for pressing a button.

Espion · 2012-01-10, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by DarkFate

Because ironsighting with a shotgun in Modern Warfare makes it more accurate, right?

Not sure about CoD but in BF it sure as fuck did. Shotgun with slugs was easier than using a sniper rifle at range

Erendil · 2012-01-11, 05:32 AM

Originally Posted by Espion

I hope you're not using too much RL example as a basis for SciFi game development. I'm all for people being able to zoom in, but I think slowing people down is a terrible idea... and if there's no slowdown from zooming then you can't really go crazy with CoF/recoil decreases.

Mechanics that raise the skill ceiling and give players the tools they need to perform better is a much better alternative than artificial bonuses for pressing a button.

There's nothing intrinsically less skillful about the concept of ADS - only in its implementation of not done properly. In fact, I would argue that if done correctly its presence makes combat more skillful than not having it due to the tactical decisions you have to make on whether to be more accurate but an easier target to hit, or less accurate but a faster target.

There's more to a firefight in a large-scale, semi-tactical shooter than simply run-and-gun. There's providing cover for your teammates, leapfrogging, interlocking and suppressive fire, using cover/concealment, etc. And ADS encourages the use of all of these tactics on-the-fly where accuracy is often more important than dodging ability. But I'm sure you know this.

Originally Posted by Espion

Not sure about CoD but in BF it sure as fuck did. Shotgun with slugs was easier than using a sniper rifle at range

I think it's pretty obvious that DF is referring to a weapon like a shotgun that fires pellets with a fixed spread. Obviously using a shotgun slug is a different beast since you're dealing w/ a single projectile that doesn't have much of a random vector beyond that afforded by the weapon's CoF - a CoF that ADS serves to reduce or almost eliminate.

However, ADS logically won't have nearly as much bearing on the accuracy of a shell filled w/ buckshot - at least given the pellet spread most FPSes inflict on shotguns. And as DF so eloquently pointed out, if it's implemented properly you don't have to use ADS if you don't want to...

TacKLed · 2012-01-11, 06:17 AM

The problem here is that people forgot to take off their massive nostalgia goggles at the door. Ironsights is for the better in my opinion. When PS1 came out, the prevailing FPS games were fast paced cooridor shooters that had no ironsights and relied more on fast paced personal skill. PS1, while promoting teamwork, was essentially using a lot of the mechanics abeit on a larger scale. That was 2003. This is 2012. I'm not saying that it will turn into Call of DUty, which I'm not bashing since it's a fun game every once and awhile, but the addition of ADS will make the game more tactical like Erendil said.

And the major thing you all are forgetting is that this game needs to rely on newcomers to be successful. It is good and all that it is a massive fan service but not ironsights in a game this massive is just not acceptable in this day and age, especially for a game of this scale, and the devs know this

Graywolves · 2012-01-11, 06:31 AM

If there are iron sights, I want an implant to aim for me so I never use them.

Effective · 2012-01-11, 09:11 AM

No to Ironsights.

Didn't read whole thread. Only looked at first 2 pages to see complaints about ADADAD warping. Because people don't understand why warping occurs they fail to realize the extremely low chances of it happening in PS 2.

"WAAAHHH REMOVE SOMETHING THAT ISN'T ACTUALLY GOING TO WORK IN PS2 WAAAHHH" sums up the majority of the comments about warping.