Warning, very unpopular opinion! Why kill-cam desperately needs to return - Page 15

Baneblade · 2013-09-15, 08:08 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

In preparation for the BF4 beta I just started playing BF3 again and in no way I experienced a single situation where the kill-cam was "giving away position" or "ruining the tactical game play". This whole kill-cam rage is just thin-foiled crap, can't make anything else out of it.

Empirical evidence is not evidence.

CrankyTRex · 2013-09-15, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by Baneblade

Empirical evidence is not evidence.

It's funny because if it were evidence, it would be evidence that there's no reason to implement a kill cam. If it doesn't give away the position of the attacker, it isn't going to help the kill-ee any, and therefore is unnecessary.

GreyFrog · 2013-09-15, 09:47 PM

Kickban Roflski*, send him a video of how you did it and see if he learns >

*This is not a srs bzns post.

Mastachief · 2013-09-16, 03:55 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

In preparation for the BF4 beta I just started playing BF3 again and in no way I experienced a single situation where the kill-cam was "giving away position" or "ruining the tactical game play". This whole kill-cam rage is just thin-foiled crap, can't make anything else out of it.

Cool story bro, tell it again.

Public BF3 doesn't have tactical play, it's a round based clusterfuck.

How about picking a comparable game... like PS1. As i've already told you you lack the ability to understand what you are seeing on killcam and take advantage of it, lots of us do not have this failing. You may consider this "elitist" but you are not a good FPS player so your opinion on these sorts of matters has little credit, capable/good fps players have none of the issues you have been trotting out in this thread they put the effort in to learn and self improve this is what a fps game is all about, it is supposed to be challenging.

Have fun in BF4.

skwerlman · 2013-09-26, 06:50 PM

Perhaps if you were to limit kill cams to non-stealth attacks. For instance, if you've spent the certs to silence your weapon, then you shouldn't have your position given away by a kill cam. But if you kill someone with an assault rifle without a silencer, I think a kill cam is still reasonable. And if you further reduce kill cams to new players, then there's no real disadvantage to the hardcore community. Unless they're afraid of being killed by a br1.

Violin · 2013-09-27, 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by Mastachief

You may consider this "elitist" but you are not a good FPS player so your opinion on these sorts of matters has little credit, capable/good fps players have none of the issues you have been trotting out in this thread they put the effort in to learn and self improve this is what a fps game is all about, it is supposed to be challenging.

+1
And thank you for saying it, because this is literally the thought that crosses my mind everytime I read one of Rolfski's post on any subject.

VaderShake · 2013-09-27, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

In preparation for the BF4 beta I just started playing BF3 again and in no way I experienced a single situation where the kill-cam was "giving away position" or "ruining the tactical game play". This whole kill-cam rage is just thin-foiled crap, can't make anything else out of it.

LOL...in BF3 the maps are so small and their are so few players even without a kill-cam it's really easy to figure out were the enemy is at, the kill cam just confirms it in BF3......not to mention with destruction you can eliminate most cover so it becomes event easier to know where the enemy is and where they will come from.

BF3 is dumbed down beyond belief and I expect more of the same from BF4 which is why I will pass on it..

VaderShake · 2013-09-27, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by Mastachief

put the effort in to learn and self improve this is what a fps game is all about, it is supposed to be challenging.

Have fun in BF4.

This.....

I often chuckle at these type of threads since I have been gaming for over 30 years and games were never easier to figure out than they are now. I would like to see some people try and figure out old school games like Maze-A-Tron, DiscWorld, and Contra (Without the Code)...all this without the collective brain of the internet to help either.

Grow a sack and get better...that's my advice...

Rolfski · 2013-09-30, 04:12 AM

Originally Posted by Mastachief

Public BF3 doesn't have tactical play, it's a round based clusterfuck.

Sorry to hurt your ego but this game is as much of a clusterfuck as BF3. Tactical play in this game is rarely about single player positions that might be "given away". Not unlike BF3, battles are generally too chaotic, hectic and flow too quickly to make kill-cam anything of a game-breaking issue.

As i've already told you you lack the ability to understand what you are seeing on killcam and take advantage of it, lots of us do not have this failing. You may consider this "elitist" but you are not a good FPS player so your opinion on these sorts of matters has little credit, capable/good fps players have none of the issues you have been trotting out in this thread they put the effort in to learn and self improve this is what a fps game is all about, it is supposed to be challenging.

Your short-sighted arrogance amuses me and I feel sorry for you that you need to get your self-esteem out of BR and KDR, but at the end of the day a few BR 100 no-lifers is NOT what keeps this game going.

Sorry to burst your bubble but SOE has a business to run here. For this game to succeed on the long run it needs to be equally fun and rewarding for new-comers and casuals as well. You cannot just place NBA all-stars and amateurs on the same basketball field like this game does and expect that everything will work out just fine.

There's nothing wrong with an insane high skill ceiling (it keeps players like you running), but if that means that you literally need to spend hundreds of hours in order to have anywhere near a fun and rewarding time (which is now the case with air), then there's something terribly wrong with game design.
Whether you like kill-cam or not, this game needs skill gap-bridging mechanics. Catering it to BR 100 hardcores only is a one-way ticket to commercial failure.

Originally Posted by Violin

+1
And thank you for saying it, because this is literally the thought that crosses my mind everytime I read one of Rolfski's post on any subject.

Thank you for your kind words and compliments. You are really doing your "respected" outfit a favour.

Blynd · 2013-09-30, 07:58 AM

Oh god please can someone close this thread. The op is ion lala land. Kill cams won't be intoduced so get over it.

Again please mods close this thread cause its beyond a joke now.

Mastachief · 2013-09-30, 08:09 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

Sorry to hurt your ego but this game is as much of a clusterfuck as BF3. Tactical play in this game is rarely about single player positions that might be "given away". Not unlike BF3, battles are generally too chaotic, hectic and flow too quickly to make kill-cam anything of a game-breaking issue.

Try playing along side a proper team rather than a zerg and you will see the difference... you won't understand it but you'll see it.

Your short-sighted arrogance amuses me and I feel sorry for you that you need to get your self-esteem out of BR and KDR, but at the end of the day a few BR 100 no-lifers is NOT what keeps this game going.

This is a computer game, it has no bearing on my self esteem. I feel for you if it effects you so badly. BR100 is not a marker on a lack of life or KDR, and again you are wrong here the pursuit of br100 and those that have attained it has and does keep this game running as generally these and the people putting up the cash and driving the development to keep this game challenging enough to justify a 10year life cycle and constant development.

Sorry to burst your bubble but SOE has a business to run here. For this game to succeed on the long run it needs to be equally fun and rewarding for new-comers and casuals as well. You cannot just place NBA all-stars and amateurs on the same basketball field like this game does and expect that everything will work out just fine.

This is where you completely don't get it, any and i do mean any FPS player worth their salt (oh look move mouse click button... profit) that are prepared to apply an IQ off 110+ can pick up this game and through a little effort jump in for free and enjoy the game with decent performance metrics (kdr 1.0+ and spm of 100+). Within a week or so of average playing time (2hours per session) will improve their metrics by a substantial margin. Then through looking listening and maybe a little searching (you know effort) they will improve a little bit more. Why should we cheapen the game for all the players that fall into the wide open pool from average to good to excellent to cater to the small group of people that are lazy here today gone tomorrow ADHD sufferers that will come and go without spending a dime.

There's nothing wrong with an insane high skill ceiling (it keeps players like you running),

There is no high skill ceiling, this is not arma. Planetside 2 is a very forgiving arcade spray and pray shoot em up. At best it's medium.

but if that means that you literally need to spend hundreds of hours in order to have anywhere near a fun and rewarding time (which is now the case with air)

Again not the case, an hour spent on youtube and 3hours spent practicing will get you to a good level in the air. Also people are getting their nerf to air to air combat skill.

, then there's something terribly wrong with game design.
Whether you like kill-cam or not, this game needs skill gap-bridging mechanics. Catering it to BR 100 hardcores only is a one-way ticket to commercial failure.

Again with the BR100 thing, it's just a number. There are plenty of terrible br100's. Skill gap bridging, FACEPALM. "Hi noob101 sorry that dude that is better at this game than you owned your ass here have this crutch feature to get the one up on him next time" yeh that sounds like a game that will last for years to come...

Thank you for your kind words and compliments. You are really doing your "respected" outfit a favour.

And around we go again. Give it up our points are very real and very valid yours are not. You disregard any and all comments from players of all skill / playstyles because they don't fit in your deluded little ideal to create a carebear environment in what is supposed to be a visceral FPS experience. You cannot have both worlds and maintain the persistent nature of the game.

The only thing that should have heavy time investment (dev) is the intro training environment and scenarios. Compliment these with artwork that provides direction in bases that direct people to key features such as jump pads, control points and spawns etc.

Calista · 2013-09-30, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by Blynd

Oh god please can someone close this thread. The op is ion lala land. Kill cams won't be intoduced so get over it.

Again please mods close this thread cause its beyond a joke now.

I agree. Even SOE dev said it wasn't coming back so why is this thread still going?

Violin · 2013-09-30, 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

Thank you for your kind words and compliments. You are really doing your "respected" outfit a favour.

Well first off, I was simply agreeing with the other person that called you out.

Secondly, I speak for myself and myself alone, my outfit has nothing to do with my thoughts on you.

And lastly, if you really want to bring outfits into this, I am sure all three of the respected outfits* you belong to are really proud of this 15 page shitshow you have created. Personally though I wouldn't hold it against them, because clearly on this matter you are speaking for yourself, which the last 15 pages have proven

.

*notice the lack of quotations, as in I am being sincere, those of us with an ounce of sense in us realize that any outfit with staying power in this game is worthy of being respected, and in that regard 666, GOTR and BRTD have certainly earned my respect.

Rolfski · 2013-09-30, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by Calista

I agree. Even SOE dev said it wasn't coming back so why is this thread still going?

I was wondering that as well tbh. My last response was more than 2 weeks ago and I've long made my point, but somehow people keep coming back with all kinds of 12 year old epeen bullshit, suggesting that you need at least to have BR 100 and a KDR of 3+ or so in order to be "credible" and take part in a fps discussion. Biggest pile of crap I've ever heard, seriously.

By taking a stance for casual/newer players in a hardcore community, I wasn't exactly expecting any popularity prizes. But the arrogance and disrespect I've been put up so far, even surprises me.

So Chip, please close this thread. Apparently, discussing on this forum is only allowed for "credible" people with a high enough KDR that have popular opinions.

Wahooo · 2013-09-30, 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by Rolfski

I was wondering that as well tbh. My last response was more than 2 weeks ago and I've long made my point, but somehow people keep coming back with all kinds of 12 year old epeen bullshit, suggesting that you need at least to have BR 100 and a KDR of 3+ or so in order to be "credible" and take part in a fps discussion. Biggest pile of crap I've ever heard, seriously.

By taking a stance for casual/newer players in a hardcore community, I wasn't exactly expecting any popularity prizes. But the arrogance and disrespect I've been put up so far, even surprises me.

So Chip, please close this thread. Apparently, discussing on this forum is only allowed for "credible" people with a high enough KDR that have popular opinions.

Casual doesn't mean bad.

I'm casual, you are bad.

Credibility comes from not being a dumb ass. You lost a lot of credibility through this thread.
You have contradicted yourself countless times. You have failed to say anything other than talk about obviously limited personal experiences as examples and call it a counter argument, then come back with an air of arrogance to tell others they don't know what they are talking about when they clearly have a ton more experience on these matters.

It boils down to a few things here. You have been arrogant, ignorant and stubborn through this whole thread. Maybe if you were stubborn but get off your high horse and not post with such a belittling attitude you may get a better response. But the fact remains everything you've posted has been done in a manner that says "I'm smarter and I know better, despite your experiences."

At this point I could actually give a fuck about kill cam. I don't care about how much or little people play or how good at the game others are. The person that I've gotten to know through this thread that is Rolfski is a person, that if they offered me a beer I'd probably turn it down because I really can't imagine being around him for any length of time. I've read this entire thread a couple times, and again recently, and I STILL disagree with absolutely everything Rolf has said.