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View Poll Results: Do you think the TR are at a disadvantage to the other sides?
Yes, they get their asses kicked! 7 15.22%
Perhaps a little in some areas. 18 39.13%
No way, we fear them, they are all powerful! 21 45.65%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2003-12-05, 10:04 AM   [Ignore Me] #16
Doppler
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I'm getting so sick of whiner balance posts, and even more so their slanted polls. I wish people if they dont know how to write a agree/disagree/no comment poll, whould just stop posting them. But hey what do i know.

The striker and the pounder are still fucking evil, their just not as evil as they used to be, in comparison the MCG got a major boost and now chews up people at the farthest range of any HA weapon effectively. Its more or less endless clip means that if you die, it most likely wont be while reloading. THe cycler is the best goddamn med assault weapon in the game, way bigger clip and smaller COF then the gaus. Comparable to the vanu MA with a better time to kill. The tr have the ONLY area affect max, the only max that can shoot around corners. Combined with audi amps decis become a non issues. Deci's are weaker now then they were 4 months ago, and yet still you bitch just because now you actualy have to stop firigin for a little bit to reload meaning one max cant hold a tower forever.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:08 AM   [Ignore Me] #17
Acaila
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First off, every empire thinks that the other 2 gang up upon them.

Having a main character who is NC, I agree with the sentiments that TR do indeed have it rough in the MAX area. If I am out of decis and running from an enemy MAX and I see an SC approaching, I breath a sigh of relief as it can kick the shit out of most MAXs and infantry.

As TR, I am always switching to AP to help our MAXs down other MAXs as I am not confident in their ability to do so. A DC is almost a free kill for anyone with AP loaded in their HA weapon, and only has a marginal increase in anti-MAX abilities over the SC when not anchored. The Pounder is still very effective AI but is pathetic against another MAX. The Burster is a redeeming feature, it is lethal and has an extremely high "irritation" factor when it spams grunts coming out of doorways. TR has a MAX problem imo.

Any VS who complains about the status of their MAXs now should be shot. The Comet is great against other MAXs and reasonable against infantry, the Quasar has good range and good killing power. The Starfire is great AA, can hurt other MAXs, but is worse than shit against infantry.

The SC is a funny MAX, it is incredibly useful while also being a hopeless peice of crap at the same time. Its MAX vs MAX abilities are great, and its AI is great sometimes, the range however is pathetic. I like it because of the anti-MAX factor whilst also having good AI at close range. The falcon is alright, it does decent AI and decent anti-MAX from range. Upclose it suffers from the same problem as the Pounder, it kills itself. The Sparrow is the best value MAX in the game, great AA, decent anti-MAX, alright AI. Shields are useful, anyone who says otherwise doesn't know when to use them.

I say anti-MAX instead of AV because the anti-MAX abilities of a MAX are far more important than how it doesn't () handle vehicles.

AV is all shit now, all it can achieve is dead MAXs and infrequently kill buggies, lightnings and aircraft outside, or the possibilty of chasing off an MBT if there is enough people using it.

TR have the mobility advantage in AV weapons, you can move constantly and still use the striker effectively. I am aware it takes a bit of skill to do this. VS have the most damage output, but sacrifice an amount of mobility for it. Whilst having the lowest DPS by far, NC have the unique advantage of not requiring LoS, though total mobility is sacrificed for this feature. The only thing that makes the Phoenix powerful is how many of them are currently floating around. They are exponentially more useful in groups, more so than any other weapon in the game, if you compare how useless they are alone.

Personally I don't think that AV is worth 3 cert points, considering what you can obtain as a replacement. AV should have double the ammo per box to make it more viable, I think.

MBTs are a funny topic. The Prowler has the obvious AI advantage now, thanks to its RoF. Though it has the highest damage output, it is the slowest, has the worst acceleration and a massive profile. I consider it Magrider bait. The Vanguard still has good AI, plus the most armour and decent damage output. It has a smaller profile and is lower than the Prowler, making it harder to hit. Whilst the size is less important upclose, when moving and turning at top speed over uneven terrain, like in most MBT vs MBT encounters, it can become an issue. The Mag is the most fun tank to use, and has the best AA capabilities. The HRB can hit enemy aircraft with relative easy. It has the smallest profile, and is the fastest, plus the water advantage. A mag on water is very powerful. Those Cyssor bridge battles are hell when fighting VS because of this. I believe things are more or less balanced in this aspect.

The MCG is a good weapon if you learn that you have to lead your target at any range, it is my favourite HA. I get more kills than I do with a JH, however I believe that can be attributed to it fitting my play style. Even at 1m you have to lead slightly or you will miss alot of your shots.

The Lasher is also a good weapon, except that you have to reload all the time. Also, it causes lash damage, which is damage as it passes a target, not splash damage which is damage caused from an explosion, whoever commented on the Lasher's splash damage.

Surge makes any weapon powerful, the thing that knocks the JH up is the triple shot and the lack of tracers. However try using a JH without surge, unless you catch your target unawares, you are in trouble when it comes to closing the distance. The TTK of the HA weapons is basically the same, only the triple shot gives the JH an edge, which makes up for its poor abilities at range. And by range I mean the distance from the bottom wall of a staircase in a tower to the top wall. Lack of tracers is an advantage, it doesn't give your position away when your target moves suddenly and you miss a shot, anyone who fights a JH regularly knows this. It also makes it difficult to distinguish which NC is shooting at who in crowded situations.

I think HA is fairly balanced, the Lasher could use a slight clip increase. When the anti-warping changes go through, prepare for JH buff threads. ALOT of NC rely upon warping and speed predicion (I don't mean cheating, I mean the prediction algorithm which speeds the user up inorder to update their position. This is akin to warping, but they don't actually disappear.) to use their JH effectively, even though they don't know it. I am sure I am one of them, however I don't complain about weapon balance very often, there is enough people doing that already. I use what I have and try to find the best way how. We won't know until the changes are in effect and have been played for a while.

Buggies are fucking ridiculous compared to MBTs and aren't worth considering until the tech plant requirement is removed.

MA is perfect, few complain about it as there is no reason to.

This got alot longer than I initially intended .

Originally Posted by FraudulentBob
Wheres my official translator?

The period is not your enemy, feel free to use it.
Evidently the apostrophe must be your enemy.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:09 AM   [Ignore Me] #18
FightForFreedom
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I squaded with you last night, Hexen . But I think the TR are pretty well as it is, it seems more or less even with the VS (though both of our AV weapons could use a buff). However, I think we need to fix the NC. Like Hexen said, they have the best HA by a mile and a tank that blows us out of the water. Not to mention (in my opinion) the best AV. And let's not forget their MAX's. ScatterMax has a 3 hit infantry kill at close range. That's about 2 seconds.Their AV Max not only has good AV damage, but it slaughters infantry. About 5-7 shots will kill and infantry target, and that's a few seconds. Not to mention their AA Max is fire-and-forget. They get a lock, I hit my afterburners, they can turn in the other direction, their missles nail me and I'm dead. Ugh.

I don't think it's a question of the TR or VS being too weak, I think it's that the NC are too strong*.

*Please note, all statements above are opinions; however, the numbers are facts.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:11 AM   [Ignore Me] #19
Hexen
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I haven't tried the Phoenix since I began playing again, but back in beta I played NC and I loved that damn thing. All I had to do was hide behind a tree and fire it and then just guide it into whatever I wanted, it was the easiest thing ever.

I agree with previous posts about the high rate of fire being more of a penalty than an asset too, I mean if after every shot, your cone of fire grows, then theoretically your weapon should be worthless at anything but very short range, and that is exactly how it is, and that is also exactly why I got rid of my MCG certification.

I also have the Striker cert, but I don't really find it that weak to be honest. Since I haven't tried the other empire's AT weapons I can't really compare though I guess. I find the Striker to be a reliable anti-MAX weapon when I have some distance, but it seems to be a practically worthless anti-vehicular weapon, the shots simply don't do enough damage. Theres a certain annoyance to emptying a full Striker clip into vehicle, reloading, and emptying another into it, only to get killed by the very thing that you feel really should have been destroyed, considering how much you pumped into it.

Another thing, the lockdown truly is Decimator fodder. Only a few days ago I saw a perfect example of why this is so, a MAX locked down about 10 metres away from an NC spawn room door. An NC Exo soldier came out, surged and promptly sprinted directly behind the MAX, leaving him completely helpless as he frantically tried to get out of lockdown in time to save his own arse, obviously he failed miserably and was killed.

The TR lockdown might as well be a self-inflicted version of the Ghost's lockdown from StarCraft, sitting duck ability.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:11 AM   [Ignore Me] #20
Veteran
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It's funny how the NC and VS are voting on the option that says 'No way, we fear them, they are all powerful'.

Recognize.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:14 AM   [Ignore Me] #21
Acaila
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I voted on "perhaps a little in some areas" .
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:17 AM   [Ignore Me] #22
Hexen
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Meh. This is all in vain really anyway, apparently the devs play NC, and not only that, the NC have a hell of alot of players. For all I know the imbalance is deliberate.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:30 AM   [Ignore Me] #23
sutserikeru
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Argh. Another "My Empire is Worse Than Yours" thread...
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:39 AM   [Ignore Me] #24
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TR is never worse, we're talking about empire assets.
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Old 2003-12-05, 10:40 AM   [Ignore Me] #25
sutserikeru
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Originally Posted by Hexen
Meh. This is all in vain really anyway, apparently the devs play NC, and not only that, the NC have a hell of alot of players. For all I know the imbalance is deliberate.
i agree, i have yet to see a VS dev char...
All i see are NC, i wonder why...
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Old 2003-12-05, 11:03 AM   [Ignore Me] #26
Veteran
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I'm levelling an NC and let me tell you, coming from TR it's a whole new world of power. If my TR weren't br20, maybe things would be different. Frankly, I'm sick of seeing so many XP awards count for nothing. Call it a quirk.

NC is exactly the power-level that all the empires should be. VS is damned close. TR needs a little help.
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Old 2003-12-05, 11:49 AM   [Ignore Me] #27
Kenney
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NC = Good in some things!
TR = Good in some things!
VS = Good in some things!

How about you realize that some people are good at some things and better at others. Stick to what you are good at, other people stick to what they are good at, and at some point it evens out. I dont see one group dominating all continents on all servers. Which means that the empires are somewhat even because the only reason that an empire takes over a huge number of conts is because nobody else is playing at that time. IF NC is so over-powered, why haven't they conquered the world yet?
And by the way, im VS.

STOP BITCHING
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Old 2003-12-05, 12:08 PM   [Ignore Me] #28
Queensidecastle
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There are no overall ballance issues anymore. It really just boils down to what CR5s are online and organized on a given evening
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Old 2003-12-05, 12:19 PM   [Ignore Me] #29
Mango
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Originally Posted by Kenney
NC = Good in some things!
TR = Good in some things!
VS = Good in some things!

How about you realize that some people are good at some things and better at others. Stick to what you are good at, other people stick to what they are good at, and at some point it evens out. I dont see one group dominating all continents on all servers. Which means that the empires are somewhat even because the only reason that an empire takes over a huge number of conts is because nobody else is playing at that time. IF NC is so over-powered, why haven't they conquered the world yet?
And by the way, im VS.

STOP BITCHING
YES!!! All the empires have there own strengths and weaknesses. If you think something sucks then your not using it right.
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Old 2003-12-05, 12:24 PM   [Ignore Me] #30
Madcow
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TR has the best empire specific pistol, especially for infiltrators.

TR has probably the best MA.

TR's HA is now fairly balanced.

The Prowler is much improved but not used enough.

The Burster is freaking hell on wheels and hardly ever used. Forget it's AA aspects, lock that damn thing down on a mountain with a few friends and rain hell on a base. It rips up MAXs and infantry like nothing else, I fear those things a lot more than Vanguard shells or Flail shots raining down. Just don't let anybody get close to you or the game is over...

Honestly, I do think the TR need a little bit of loving but I don't think they're as bad off as many like to make it sound. The biggest problem with TR is that they are so balanced to the point of being 2nd best in a number of empire specific areas. Not having the dominant weapon in those areas makes some TR feel slighted.
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