Responses to some fears people mentioned.

[Traak]

Hold up, thar slick. You never IA to an AMS. It's always to a tower or base. I forget... did IA every take you anywhere that wasn't camped by enemy HA's?

[Bags]

The only times I have used IA it took me to an empty planet where some idiot just hit a landmine.

[Treerat]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

That said, the tanks should have far less infantry gibbing ammo. 30 or 50 rounds, instead of 300+, so that they are more selective and actually use the coax(also all gunners should have a good coax), and infantry could use a better short range AV. The deci had way too little damage potential for how much room it took, and really didn't have that great of a dps advantage either.

I can agree with that point certainly. Using modern tanks as an example, most don't even have the option for high explosive or fragmentation ammunition anymore (that was one reason the M1 Abrams initially had a 105mm gun versus a 120mm) because their entire load is designed for killing tanks and other armored fighting vehicles (APCs, self-propelled artillery, etc). The role of infantry suppression is mostly confined to coaxial and roof-top machine guns and/or the infantry and APCs/ IFVs who accompany them. This way tanks might actually be used to *gasp* fight other tanks and/or "hardened" defenses instead of spamming shells through open doors. I always loathed that part of defending or attacking a tower or door that opened to the outside. Not only did it feel like it was circumventing part of the design of the bases, but it also was miserable in that half the time the attackers own tanks would kill more of their breaching team than the defenders would.

Personally I would think something where each tank had a high AV/ low AI value main armament (like the Magriders main gun) with minimal splash plus a coaxial AI weapon and an additional fixed-forward driver controlled or independent commander/ secondary gunner AI weapon. Plus of course the usual grenade dispensers that are standard on modern tanks.... even if it's just a mix of fragmentation and/or jammers. SOMETHING to drive off the annoying pests who jump on a tank (and attack it with a knife) or hug the sides and you can't just smush them against the closest tree or wall or swat them off with the gun barrel (or poke your rifle out the hatch and ventilate their brains).

I can also agree to the need for better (and more diverse) infantry-portable AV weapons. Something like the Carl Gustav used in the US military (aka. a one-shot and reload/ throw away weapon packing the AV power of 2-3 Deci shots with a much faster projectile). Also some satchel charges or magnetic mines would be great. In actual war one of the tankers worst nightmares was to be ordered (sans infantry support) into a city, dense forest, or other area that provided lots of places for enemy sappers to hide then jump out as the tanks passed to attach satchel charges and anti-tank mines before jumping back out of sight. In Planetside (at least while I was playing), there simply wasn't any sort of explosive that could be attached or "ride" on an enemy vehicle, much less do enough damage seriously damage or destroy an MBT. Some things like that would encourage cooperation between vehicles and infantry; the vehicles need the infantry to clear out the enemy anti-armor ambushes, and the infantry need the vehicles for transport and heavy direct fire.

[Bags]

But I was really sad to play the tank part in Crysis 1 to find my tank only got thirty shots.

[CutterJohn]

Originally Posted by Treerat

In Planetside (at least while I was playing), there simply wasn't any sort of explosive that could be attached or "ride" on an enemy vehicle, much less do enough damage seriously damage or destroy an MBT. Some things like that would encourage cooperation between vehicles and infantry; the vehicles need the infantry to clear out the enemy anti-armor ambushes, and the infantry need the vehicles for transport and heavy direct fire.

I definitely want one of the infantry grenade options to be an AV grenade that sticks to vehicles/MAXs and does some serious, Deci like damage, just in a tiny package with no splash that is difficult to use at range.

Originally Posted by Bags

But I was really sad to play the tank part in Crysis 1 to find my tank only got thirty shots.

That level could have definitely used a new tank midway through, or a repair/rearm station.

For a multiplayer game, though, I think half a hundred instant kill shots is enough. Tank weapons were too spammy in PS1. Should have been more powerful, and more accurate, but extremely ammo limited.

[ShowNoMercy]

hate to bring this up in the convo, but your average player won't like having his ammo severely limited. Again, balance needs to be found between the spamming nature of the average player and the skill or vets/camping abilities of vehicles. Not many of our suggestions in this area will likely be of merit since the overall argument comes down to the numbers and not the concept.

[CutterJohn]

The average player coming from other games would actually be rather surprised at PSs generosity with ammo. They are used to some pretty harsh limitations, especially with the big guns like tanks and rocket launchers.

[ShowNoMercy]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

The average player coming from other games would actually be rather surprised at PSs generosity with ammo. They are used to some pretty harsh limitations, especially with the big guns like tanks and rocket launchers.

I guess it is a matter of opinion. I can't recall many games were I felt much of any ammo restrictions. Then again I have only played a handful of games.

[Traak]

Any tankers here with complaints about spammy tank weapons in PS?

[Sirisian]

Originally Posted by Traak

Any tankers here with complaints about spammy tank weapons in PS?

Having really only used the VS tank which isn't designed to spam so much as snipe I can't really comment. What would be your definition of "spam"? Like door camping and hoping to hit people going up the stairs?

[Bags]

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

That level could have definitely used a new tank midway through, or a repair/rearm station.

For a multiplayer game, though, I think half a hundred instant kill shots is enough. Tank weapons were too spammy in PS1. Should have been more powerful, and more accurate, but extremely ammo limited.

When I ran out of ammo I just used my tank to push enemy tanks over until I found an unused enemy tank.

But yeah, Planetside was a bit excessive. Something like 50 - 75 should be fine.

[CutterJohn]

Originally Posted by Traak

Any tankers here with complaints about spammy tank weapons in PS?

Me. Hardcore tanker. We had too much ammo. I just shot at everything, since repairs would be an issue long before ammo. There was probably enough ammo for 5 minutes of firing. Continuously. Tank guns should be strong, should be capable of gibbing infantry, but ammo should be reduced so that I really don't want to waste my ammo on them if at all possible.

[Coreldan]

There was something good about the amount of ammo we had (well, have now).

As a new player I would certainly be kicked out of every Vanguard when I obviously cant grasp the arc at the few first shots. It would make it quite a steep learning curve to ever really actually getting into them and learning to use it.

[CutterJohn]

Thats the other hope. That arc/shot speed is ridiculous. With lesser ammo, they can be not so ridiculous.

[Warruz]

i fear the loss of immersion personally