Orbital Strikes - Page 2

Sirisian · 2011-06-02, 09:55 PM

Originally Posted by Tikuto

*disregards whole thread*

Check link in my signature!

It's called Planetside 2. lol

BorisBlade · 2011-06-02, 11:21 PM

The over abundance of cr5's issue is not related. its due to the quadrupling of cep, which ended up making 10x more cr5's than you would have otherwise. If it took forever, not only would people just not get it, but they would also be discouraged and not even try. That rank in ps2 would be small even in the long run if they dont do anymore of the retarded xp multipliers and keep it where it used to be.

As far as limiting OS's you just need to charge CEP for em. However to keep you from just hoggin all the xp once you get cr5, you could also spend BEP but at a much higher cost. Both would continue toi be earned even once you got the xp cap. But you would be limited to a cap on the usuable pool. Somethin along the lines of 2 or 3x the cost of the OS. You could save up for 3 of em (still have the timer between them tho), but you would have to continue to earn cep/bep to keep using them once the xp is gone. So this requires you to keep leading to use OS'es, or you could use bep but at such a high cost it takes much much longer to get the points required (possibly uses a full bar of stored bep instead of 1/3 when cep is used). The OS is a leader's weapon, so lead if you want to use it.

Effective · 2011-06-02, 11:49 PM

Originally Posted by BorisBlade

The over abundance of cr5's issue is not related. its due to the quadrupling of cep, which ended up making 10x more cr5's than you would have otherwise. If it took forever, not only would people just not get it, but they would also be discouraged and not even try. That rank in ps2 would be small even in the long run if they dont do anymore of the retarded xp multipliers and keep it where it used to be.

As far as limiting OS's you just need to charge CEP for em. However to keep you from just hoggin all the xp once you get cr5, you could also spend BEP but at a much higher cost. Both would continue toi be earned even once you got the xp cap. But you would be limited to a cap on the usuable pool. Somethin along the lines of 2 or 3x the cost of the OS. You could save up for 3 of em (still have the timer between them tho), but you would have to continue to earn cep/bep to keep using them once the xp is gone. So this requires you to keep leading to use OS'es, or you could use bep but at such a high cost it takes much much longer to get the points required (possibly uses a full bar of stored bep instead of 1/3 when cep is used). The OS is a leader's weapon, so lead if you want to use it.

I don't like this idea. It's an idea that punishes small outfits with few players.

Firefly · 2011-06-03, 12:29 AM

I always liked the idea of spending outfit experience for certain things if Planetside ever expanded... like outfit base ownership, outfit HART or outfit cruisers, etc. Maybe in keeping with purchasing an OS, burn some outfit XP too.

Rbstr · 2011-06-03, 12:56 AM

I don't like the idea of having to purchase things that are disposable or using currency. The game, by nature, has a high turnover rate on equipment, and it's no fun to have to grind up points to purchase things you lose in this kind of game. (Contrast to EVE where I've got equipment that's somehow managed to stay alive for years)

I'd much rather have skill-point like systems like cert points. Outfit can level up (somehow normalized to the number of players in the outfit) and gain outfit upgrade points and spend them on permanent upgrades, and they can switch them up occasionally.

Bags · 2011-06-03, 02:52 AM

Originally Posted by Firefly

Another fucking retarded idea.

Don't punish the player for earning CR5. Devs need to implement a better system.

How does limiting the number of CR5s punish people for getting CR5?

Another fucking retarded post from Firefly. Seriously, I recommend looking over your posts before hitting submit. Then you won't look like the massive tool that you are.

Firefly · 2011-06-03, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by Bags

How does limiting the number of CR5s punish people for getting CR5?

Awww isn't that cute? Little Ballbag got pissy. Oh well. I'm going to ignore your butt-hurt weak attempt at a comeback because you simply don't rate. So I selectively quoted the piece which is relevant.

The Good Lord tells me that I should suffer the weak-of-mind, so I'm going to attempt to take it easy on you. Let me explain this since you're too busy fapping to gay anime to have learned a bit of reading comprehension before you graduated from whatever facility of higher learning from which you claim to have gestated. This is basically what I intuit from your original post: "Oh, boo-hoo, there's too many CR5s spamming global and/or command chat. Oh, boo-hoo, there's too many CR5s because the game's been out for eight years. Oh, boo-hoo there's too many CR5s because I can't walk outside and get my Mossie Bailure without getting OS'd. Waa waa waa, me me me, I I I, he stole my cookie, I hate this game, that guy's a ****** for OS'ing me, boo hoo hoo. So here's my contribution to the shallow end of the gene pool guyz! In PS2 let's limit the number of CR5s because people don't know how to play the way I want them to play! okai?!?!" So why is this a fucking retarded idea? Not just because it's Bags who's a known forum crybaby, no. There are a number of ideas in this thread, some good, some bad, some a little farfetched, plus your stupid post, all of them at least attempt to address the issue in a non-flippant manner except yours.

Putting a cap on the number of CR5s IN PS2/PSN whatever the fuck they're going to call it, simply because you're a crybaby who wants everything HIS way and because you're butt-hurt about the CR5s and their antics/their spam/their OSes, is a stupid fucking idea. Let's just get that out of the way. Your personal motivation for having it done is retarded. How does it punish everyone else? It punishes people by virtue of the fact that your maladjusted idea LIMITS THE NUMBER OF CR5s just because you don't like the way people "abuse" the CR5 abilities SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT AS MUCH. Why should there be an elite class that only a few can get into and once its filled nobody else is allowed in? That smacks of elitist bullshit or very piss poor implementation and for those that don't get in, it punishes those people. "Sorry fellas, you can't have a spot because we said only 100 CR5s [random made-up number]." Your idea, which is still fucking idiotic by the way, puts a set number on CR5s - which, given the time and population and fight, anyone could theoretically earn. CR5 is not a god rank - it's a fucking level in a fucking video game. There's no way to control the intelligence factor among CR5s, there's no way to stop the spam without heavy moderation (which sucks for all parties involved, ever been an MMO CSR?). You'll see those limited spots fill up quickly by people who are racing to be one of The Chosen. Which means no-life basement-dwelling grinders, squad invite-spammers, unemployed fatties, AFK-in-warpgate Squad Leaders, and people who aren't leading at all but rather are whoring CEP, will be the first to claim those spots. So you just filled the gene pool with piss. Good job, Einstein.

But let's presume that everyone's equal and smart and we're all neck-in-neck in the race to be one of the limited number of CR5s. Who's to decide who gets CR5 and how to fill those limited spots? Should it be first-come/first-serve or will there be elitist cocksuckers like you judging the merit of the up-and-coming CR4s? Do we vote on it? YAY a popularity contest! Do you reserve spots for tried-and-true CR5s? Ooh, I know! How about saving space for people who join the game well after release? What about people who get CR5 and then fuck it up? Do you kick them out of the CR5 Boys Club, O Holier Than Thou? Narrowing the field simply because YOU are a fucking prick who hates anyone who doesn't do things exactly the way you want IS PUNISHMENT for the misdeeds of others (misdeeds being subjective, based on your whiny bitching). Don't penalize players because of poor game mechanics or for being trolls like you. Poor game mechanics do not get fixed by limiting the people who have access to it. If your opinion is that it's crappy (surprise surprise), it's still going to be crappy, just with less amounts of crap. Fix the problem and fix the game mechanics, not band-aid it by limiting the number of players who can annoy you. I mean, seriously? "I hate all of you, so let me limit the number of people I have to hate". Really?

Did that explanation make it any clearer, or are you still a fucking dumb sack of knuckles?

Lonehunter · 2011-06-03, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by Firefly

Another fucking retarded idea.

Don't punish the player for earning CR5. Devs need to implement a better system.

First off, I'm not bothering with your recent wall of text post lol.

But this is a retarted retort.

I can't believe you, of all people, don't think there where too many CR5s in planetside. The rank doesn't have anything to do with leading people anymore, they just had SL during a hack. Everyone wants to global and have a big OS.

CR5 should actually mean something. I always thought a character's CEP should reset after a certain amount of time. Basically, only the people actively leading, get the bonuses of being a commander.

Lonehunter · 2011-06-03, 12:33 PM

There are ways to limit the total number of CR5s without punishing the player. If so many people are grinding CEP just to get an OS isn't there a problem?

Furret · 2011-06-03, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Firefly

Putting a cap on the number of CR5s IN PS2/PSN whatever the fuck they're going to call it, simply because you're a crybaby who wants everything HIS way and because you're butt-hurt about the CR5s and their antics/their spam/their OSes, is a stupid fucking idea. Let's just get that out of the way. Your personal motivation for having it done is retarded. How does it punish everyone else? It punishes people by virtue of the fact that your maladjusted idea LIMITS THE NUMBER OF CR5s just because you don't like the way people "abuse" the CR5 abilities SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO DEAL WITH IT AS MUCH. Why should there be an elite class that only a few can get into and once its filled nobody else is allowed in? That smacks of elitist bullshit or very piss poor implementation and for those that don't get in, it punishes those people. "Sorry fellas, you can't have a spot because we said only 100 CR5s [random made-up number]." Your idea, which is still fucking idiotic by the way, puts a set number on CR5s - which, given the time and population and fight, anyone could theoretically earn. CR5 is not a god rank - it's a fucking level in a fucking video game. There's no way to control the intelligence factor among CR5s, there's no way to stop the spam without heavy moderation (which sucks for all parties involved, ever been an MMO CSR?). You'll see those limited spots fill up quickly by people who are racing to be one of The Chosen. Which means no-life basement-dwelling grinders, squad invite-spammers, unemployed fatties, AFK-in-warpgate Squad Leaders, and people who aren't leading at all but rather are whoring CEP, will be the first to claim those spots. So you just filled the gene pool with piss. Good job, Einstein.

But let's presume that everyone's equal and smart and we're all neck-in-neck in the race to be one of the limited number of CR5s. Who's to decide who gets CR5 and how to fill those limited spots? Should it be first-come/first-serve or will there be elitist cocksuckers like you judging the merit of the up-and-coming CR4s? Do we vote on it? YAY a popularity contest! Do you reserve spots for tried-and-true CR5s? Ooh, I know! How about saving space for people who join the game well after release? What about people who get CR5 and then fuck it up? Do you kick them out of the CR5 Boys Club, O Holier Than Thou? Narrowing the field simply because YOU are a fucking prick who hates anyone who doesn't do things exactly the way you want IS PUNISHMENT for the misdeeds of others (misdeeds being subjective, based on your whiny bitching). Don't penalize players because of poor game mechanics or for being trolls like you. Poor game mechanics do not get fixed by limiting the people who have access to it.

This is all very true. The only solution I can think of that forces a limited number of CR5's but still allows some change, is having the the players in the top percentile of CEP hold the CR5 position, and scale it from there.

Originally Posted by Firefly

You'll see those limited spots fill up quickly by people who are racing to be one of The Chosen. Which means grinders, squad invite-spammers, AFK-in-warpgate Squad Leaders, and people who aren't leading at all but rather are whoring CEP, will be the first to claim those spots.

This would still be an issue however.

The only way I can think of that keeps the CR5 rank from being overrun by CEP grinders who don't care about leading is to have some sort of voting system. Sure, it would be a popularity contest, but isn't that the point? You want the players to choose who leads, because they'll want someone who cares about winning instead of a CEP whore.

Alternatively, instead of nuking the city to kill the ant, we could fix the ACTUAL problem, the orbital strikes. Obviously, the number of OS's need to be limited, there's no other way around it. Nerfing them wouldn't work, because they'd lose their tactical power. I don't know if OS could cost certification points, because the killwhore CR5's would all get it anyway.

Actually, I have another idea that I'm going to write in another post to stop clutter and text walls

Furret · 2011-06-03, 01:03 PM

PART 2:

Fix CEP.

Main Problem: Too many OS's

Main Reason: Too many CR5's

Cause: Too easy to get to CR5, no limit on number of CR5's

Cause: CEP is easy to whore. <- Underlying problem.

My fix

A squad assists in the capture of the base. The entire squad is awarded 100 points for capturing the base for each player in the squad. Since this squad has 10 players in it, the experience pool for the squad is 1,000. Each player in the squad, upon being awarded the points, determines how he wants to use his experience. The leader will likely put most or all of his 100 points into command. The other players, depending on how generous they're feeling, can give up to 100 of their personal points to the squad leader's command experience.

This way, a CEP whore would invite 10 randoms to his squad, AFK as his empire takes the base, and most likely earn 100 CEP for it, because his 'squadmates' would feel no inclination to give away their experience.

A seasoned leader with squad mates who respected him, would most likely earn his own 100 CEP, and perhaps 30 from each of his members, netting him 100 + (9 x 30) = 370 CEP for one base. This way, someone who actually commands would earn experience 3.7 times faster than someone who just whores it.

Only problem I can still see is someone and his group of 9 friends that don't care too much, and give all of their experience to the squad leader, who may or may not be doing anything. I don't think that would be TOO much of an issue, because the lazy leader would still have to get together nine people who don't care.

Questions and Comments?

Firefly · 2011-06-03, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by Lonehunter187

I can't believe you, of all people, don't think there where too many CR5s in planetside. The rank doesn't have anything to do with leading people anymore, they just had SL during a hack. Everyone wants to global and have a big OS.

CR5 should actually mean something. I always thought a character's CEP should reset after a certain amount of time. Basically, only the people actively leading, get the bonuses of being a commander.

I never bothered to give my opinion, but it should have been obvious considering I was attempting to positively contribute to the discussion until Debbie Downer came along. Are there too many CR5s? Yes. I agree. I disagree with handling it in such a juvenile, elitist manner. I think putting a cap on the number of people who can max out their levels is fucking stupid. That doesn't mean I don't think there are too many CR5s. Bags' whiny reason for wanting to handle it is pesonally-motivated, just look at his post history on the subject. Bags' idea for handling the problem is stupid and punitive in nature. I'm not very affected by the problem. I either have command chat turned off or I summarily ignore it because it's full of 4chan/SomethingAwful rejects and people like Ballbags. I've died due to Orbital Strike a sum total of three times in the last six months. It's not that big of an issue to me, and I don't let it affect my gaming or my forum crying. I see the issue and my minuscule amounts of concern for the happiness of others allows me to recognize the issue, and my game developer background allows me to see beyond the haze of red caused by being butt-hurt about the issue, to find an appropriate solution that isn't akin to "kill em all and let the Bags of the world sort em out."

The problem is that Planetside has been around for eight years. CR5, when the game came out, was an integral part of the game. As more and more people dilute that, it loses its value. Orbital strike is another weapon, that's all. EMP is another weapon, that's all. Command chat is a joke. Globals are abused. You don't resolve those problems by saying "X-amount of people can do this". That doesn't change anything except the fact that fewer people are doing it. THEY ARE STILL DOING IT. You don't cull the herd of retards by having a smaller herd. There are other solutions. Examples: more stringent requirements to use Orbital Strike, policing command chat, longer OS timers, requiring Command Cert points to purchase abilities, CEP degrading (sort of like reverse rested XP), only a CR5 SL or OL can use OS, purchased with outfit points, making it a serious fucking pain to get to CR5 like it used to be, etc.

Raymac · 2011-06-03, 01:12 PM

It's an interesting problem. Because now, 8 years later, yeah there are too many CR5's and too many OS's. But back in the first year or 2, there wern't too many. In fact, I think it was in a "goldilocks" stage of being just right for a good amount of time. So the question is, how do you pre-fix something that isn't broken at first, but breaks after a long period of time? (We are all hoping PS2 lasts as long if not longer than the original)

I have no answer, I just like stating the obvious.

GTGD · 2011-06-03, 01:27 PM

There's a very simple way to end this which has already been said: don't quadruple the amount of CEP earned. Most of the stupid CR5s are Fodderside scrubs who began in like 2008, if not more recently. Otherwise I see no problem. People leading squads frequently since the release of the game SHOULD be a CR5 right now, and they should be able to enjoy their powers. There is no problem with the amount of CR5s right now, the problem is the percentage of people playing, the time the game has been out for, and the lack of support for so long.

1) There are plenty of CR5s. But if there were more lower leveled characters by weekend warriors and casual gamers, it wouldn't be as much as a problem. The problem right now is that there are so few playing, the amount of people that can OS seem to outnumber the people who cert or are bothered to pull AMSes.

2) This game has been out for 8 years. CR5 was never an impossible task, it was just tedious especially considering how long some fights could last without any base captures. Multiplier or not, there would be a bunch of CR5s. It's just all the new players happened to stumble onto the multipliers from the get-go and easily achieved what took others a significantly longer amount of time.

3) If this game had any real support from SOE following Aftershock, something would have been done. New CRs, changes to current CRs, whatever. They already moved continental chat to only CR5s after it was available to CR4s. Things could have been adjusted.

MooK · 2011-06-03, 03:07 PM

The problem is not that there are too many CR5s. The problem is that there are too many CR5s abusing the powers they've earned. How do we limit this?

First and foremost, implement limitations through creative and imaginative means. Like many have stated here, the basic dynamic to limit CR5 abilities, is to adapt the current certification system for use with command rank. This is not very difficult and actually adds positively to the game mechanic.

Let's say, besides command certification points, commanders have absolutely no benefits other than cosmetic changes to their character uniform. For each command level awarded, additional options are presented to the character and a new certification point is also awarded. Each option costs one certification point, and may or may not be affected by changes in command rank.

Here we have the basic necessities slightly adjusted:

Command Chat 1
For each CR rank awarded, the radius is increased appropriately.

Continental/Global Chat 5
Continental Cooldown 5 Minutes
Global Cooldown: 10 Minutes
Each announcement requires a large disperse of energy to accomplish the task of reaching all soldiers within the specified area. As such, to maintain energy stores aboard solar powered orbital satellites, they must be limited.

Reveal Friendlies/Reveal Enemies 2
Cooldown: 20 Minutes
Lasts: 5 Minutes
This provides a great tactical option besides seeking potential OS targets.

Electromagnetic Pulse 3
Cooldown: 20 Minutes.
Radius: Depends on command rank.
It ain't broke, don't fix it.

Orbital Strike 4
Cooldown: 24 Hours.
Limit: One every five minutes per continent
Radius: Depends on command rank.
The orbital strike as it's currently implemented makes sense. However, the allotted power dispersion per commander per day must be maintained in such a fashion to allow multiple commanders to make use of the facilities. As such, per commander, only one orbital strike may be utilized per day. To maintain operating levels, only one orbital strike may be launched per five minutes, per continent.

Now, we just have to come up with additional worthwhile expansions to the system. As mentioned before:

Rally Call 5
Cooldown: 6 Hours
Lasts: 20 Minutes
Limit: One every half hour
Radius: One base SOI.
This alerts individuals to a location, and increases their reward for fighting at that specified location.

Unmaned Aerial Surveillance 3
Cooldown: 4 Hours
Lasts: 10 Minutes (two runs if it survives)
Radius: One base SOI.
This would provide the same features as a moving interlink. Commanders would choose a flight trajectory. The vehicle would descend from space, make two runs (forward and backward) and return to it's satellite. It would be a targetable object, but being that it's so high up, only viable for air-to-air battle.

Oh well, I can't finish this post right now, but you get the idea.