End Game

[Graywolves]

When you talk about endgame in planetside I think about the power or things that a max'd out player has available to them.

If we want to talk content, then that makes me think about how areas are going to be catered towards air, foot, and armor battles. So a high end player would be able to optimally perform in each theatre?

I don't know. I've said it 10000000000000 times and I'll say it again. I love planetside for the endless conquest, it's all I need.

[Canaris]

although that said, John Smedly did give us an indication that they might add more sandboxed elements to PS2 like with the customisation, I think a kind of Outfit end game will be likely, outfit bases perhaps or other goodies to reward close team work.

[Sifer2]

It's funny that a lot of people are just casually shrugging off the topic. Truth is this is in fact a reason a LOT of people left the game in the early days. Being a MMO the game was interesting for more than just FPS players. While the FPS player is used to playing the same map for years straight with no real goal other than to kill time. The MMO player craves progression and a sense of purpose. Planetside 1 utterly failed to provide that beyond the BR which maxed out fairly quickly. And so a lot of the more MMO crowd ditched the game. You only had the FPS players left an then some of them bled over time to other shooters.


I think SOE has figured this out already though. Which is why they are adding resources an talking of sandbox style stuff for future updates.

[The Barn Cat]

SoE has said there will be end game events maybe even a AI faction one day

[ShockNC]

Originally Posted by Sifer2

It's funny that a lot of people are just casually shrugging off the topic. Truth is this is in fact a reason a LOT of people left the game in the early days. Being a MMO the game was interesting for more than just FPS players. While the FPS player is used to playing the same map for years straight with no real goal other than to kill time. The MMO player craves progression and a sense of purpose. Planetside 1 utterly failed to provide that beyond the BR which maxed out fairly quickly. And so a lot of the more MMO crowd ditched the game. You only had the FPS players left an then some of them bled over time to other shooters.

The problem is that the BR needs set at a level where one person doesn't have access to everything at one time (the current one man armies does away with the outfit specializations and makes the game very predictable at times) otherwise, it takes away the challenge of dealing with an enemy that there is no easy way out. so SOE is doing away with that idea in favor of more specialization instead of the past mistake of allowing you access to everything.

as for the sandbox elements, i wonder if it would be like EVE were resources can be traded and used for more "side upgrades" and ammo. when an outfit claims a certain base, are they getting a part of the resource along with the empire as a whole? we are just going to have to wait and find out.

[sylphaen]

Here is a description of a popular round based FPS:
people play the same game again and again and again and they are told after each round if their "team" won/lost. (if we can call a group of random nobodies from a public server a "team")

Here is a description of Planetside:
people play the same game again and again and again and they know when their "team" has won/lost the engagement.

Differences:
+ Planetside offers lot more victory conditions than a traditional FPS and more strategies to bring that empire to its knees.
+ in PS, your empire losing means a whole lot more to you than losing a few rounds because that ground will not retake itself alone.
+ in PS, You get to know the people you play with or against
+ in PS, e-peen is not only about K/D
- In general, victory conditions in Planetside require more time since the overall game cycle is slower
- Planetside will not show you how bad-ass your K/D ratio so you need the extra effort of advertising of much you own.


I really do not think that PS lacked of victory conditions. It may not have blatantly thrown them in your face but they were there. They were battles to win, towers to take, bases to take, continents to take and respect from your peers when you delivered on the battlefield.


I think people who blame the "lack" of win conditions may be blaming the wrong thing. I think they had trouble with the facts that:
- It was not realistically possible to take out a whole empire because of the 3rd empire (assuming normal game conditions).
- when they went off-line, the tables (or game scenario) might be completely turned around when they logged back on.
- there wasn't much one single soldier could do to change the steam when his empire was being ground to dust with all its elements in full-retreat mode. You may save a whole round in CS in a 1-on-5 and feel like a hero; in PS, feeling like a hero was a lot different and it usually involved having a group because with uneven pop, you could only delay the inevitable.
- PS cycles were somewhat long. There was no round time-limit of 5 minutes and taking a base could often take well over how much time someone could afford to play.


I think just those 4 items would make someone feel like it is not possible to win and hence complain "there is no win conditions!". Planetside was very different from other games. It was not for everyone and especially not for those who could not live with that concept.

Fortunately, PS2 seems to be working on some of those. The mission system should help the people who like congratulations pop-ups feel like there are victory conditions in PS2. The faster game-cycle may also allow players to get right into the action faster which will help them feel they did less waiting and more fighting i.e. more winning/losing.


However, be warned... Something will NOT change: the epic long large-scale battles for territory.

[HELLFISH88]

There is no traditional endgame. The only comparable challenge or achievement would have been a Planet lock where one faction controls all contestable territories.

Planetside's "Endgame" is being a motivated and skilled enough player to coordinate with other like minded players and practice advance tactic's and strategy. Coordinate alliances, maximize resource intake and the like. There are no Good drops in Planetside. Success,Honor and reward come through team work and inteligence; not a stat table on a percentage drop item.

[xSlideShow]

Originally Posted by HELLFISH88

There is no traditional endgame. The only comparable challenge or achievement would have been a Planet lock where one faction controls all contestable territories.

Planetside's "Endgame" is being a motivated and skilled enough player to coordinate with other like minded players and practice advance tactic's and strategy. Coordinate alliances, maximize resource intake and the like. There are no Good drops in Planetside. Success,Honor and reward come through team work and inteligence; not a stat table on a percentage drop item.

This pretty much but I wanted to add something.

The end game content in Planetside is that their is no in game content the 3 year plan shows that it's going to continue to evolve and we're gonna get new toys, even bases. If they keep updating the game I don't see why you would need a raid.

However, they have mentioned multiple times they want to add in AI also. I think that's a little lame. Anyway I've only ever been able to associate end game with RPG, not FPS. If we could get some examples of how other FPS's in general have done endgame maybe we'll get a better idea.

Personally, I don't think Planetside needs an Endgame. The game is fun enough for me. Although you have a good point, that the game could get stale from time to time. If you didn't have your outfit/friends online to cause mayhem with.

[Rbstr]

The word endgame just doesn't make sense in anything that's PVP-centric with a large amount of open-ness or sandbox-type play.

Do you call anything in EVE the "endgame"? I wouldn't. Everyone can be involved in anything, basically out of the box, even if they kinda suck at it. You could call holding space the "end game" but it's not the end.

Persistent world + end simply wouldn't make sense.

[ShockNC]

Originally Posted by Rbstr

The word endgame just doesn't make sense in anything that's PVP-centric with a large amount of open-ness or sandbox-type play.

Do you call anything in EVE the "endgame"? I wouldn't. Everyone can be involved in anything, basically out of the box, even if they kinda suck at it. You could call holding space the "end game" but it's not the end.

Persistent world + end simply wouldn't make sense.

In EVE, the end game is basically sitting in a Titan in a POS all day.

[SKYeXile]

Originally Posted by Rbstr

The word endgame just doesn't make sense in anything that's PVP-centric with a large amount of open-ness or sandbox-type play.

Do you call anything in EVE the "endgame"? I wouldn't. Everyone can be involved in anything, basically out of the box, even if they kinda suck at it. You could call holding space the "end game" but it's not the end.

Persistent world + end simply wouldn't make sense.

In planetside (2) you can sub that involved out for influential though.

the one thing that makes planetside different from 99.99% of other MMO's out there.

[Captain1nsaneo]

Originally Posted by xSlideShow

However, they have mentioned multiple times they want to add in AI also.

Quick correction, I don't remember the devs ever saying they "wanted" to add AI just that it was a possibility.

As for victory, if one side controls everything have an AI alien invasion occur that starts resetting bases.

[NewSith]

In mmorpg PvP is an addiditon to PvE In mmofps PvE is an addition to PvP. Endgame is a PvE property. Games like APB, GA and many others do just fine without gameend. And to counter your "players leaving due to no end" arguement - I'm gonna buy SWTOR just to finish it in one month and never sub again.

[Aractain]

A lot of peeps seem to think end game (the term) can only mean raid bosses etc. But endgame in the context of PS is simply what you do when you gone through the progression content (leveling up skills, implants, achivments, done massive raids, taken out good players 1v1 whatever your interested in).

[Mirror]

I've always considered end game to be able to go against the odds and win.