Can anyone win? - Page 2

Littleman · 2012-07-03, 04:28 PM

While I can understand people wanting a "total victory" in booting their enemies off the continent, that's contradictory to the purpose of not only Planetside, but MMO's in general.

Simply put: The credits should never roll (except in Mabinogi.)

There should always be some place to fight that is fun and competitive. Lock out timers prevent this, and frankly removing footholds is akin to removing sanctuaries, or rather their access to the continent via warpgate.

Bases are a good major victory. I'm hoping in Planetside 2 the very fact we're taking them in portions makes the final capture feel that much sweeter. We'll be able to see the control of the base ebb and flow between 2 or 3 parties until one dominates it entirely.

Either way, come night fall and early dawn in the real world, everything essentially resets anyway. At least after the first few months when we remember what sleep is and the good it can do for you.

Bravix · 2012-07-03, 04:37 PM

Gotta say, I don't like the idea of footholds on every cont. In PS1, you got that "I won" feel from taking enemy continents.

It just won't be possible now. Once one faction gets far enough, it'll be forced to face 2 empires at once and ultimately won't be able to capture every single hex.

This was easier to do in PS1, including total world domination, due to using bases instead of hex's.

Sirisian · 2012-07-03, 04:39 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nl3UduQprZ4#t=6m23s

Anubisstargate · 2012-07-03, 05:13 PM

Hmm, I do see the point, this is why I pointed out that maybe after total domination the hex's get reset. I mean how many times is the whole continent going to fall under total domination? O.o If you know it's possible you are going to try your best to make sure that doesn't happen to your faction.

Right now at it's current state I don't see taking an opposing factions area for them to get a hex outside their bio-dome. You never have that feeling of winning. In every PvP game you aim to kill players to win, in this you 'win' battles and 'win' bases. Overall you don't win the war, I know this game is a consistent warzone, but I'm sure a big portion of the playerbase do you want to 'win' against the opposing factions. On PS1 you can get world domination and sanc lock a faction. Sure the loading screen is the only difference, but because of that you saw you won, you still got that feeling that you won. This game now has permanent 3 faction safe zone's on each continent, no longer do you have NC vs VS in one place, you have the TR there all the time as well.

Countless amount of times you get "oh there's a 3 way battle, I'm going elsewhere" With the resources in this game it's going to be draining to all factions, now yeah even if you lose a fight you still get resources that you may or may not have lost. But that doesn't make up for the fact some people cannot be bothered with the big cluster fights that happen. With all the factions sitting in each of the continents that is going to happen far too much now, a lot of people are going to separate themselves because they don't like 3 way battles. People will get tired because yes it is tedious and time consuming. So many people have limited time to play due to work and like quick battles, this is why a lot of people turn to battlefield and call of duty.

I know PS2 is making this game quicker not having sanc's, but that doesn't make too much of a difference to the overall speed of the game, though we don't want it too fast because that makes taking bases even more pointless.

Even if no bio-domes can be taken, capturing loads of bases for resources for upgrading is nice, but then what? I know it's going to take ages to cert yourself and upgrade all your items. But then what? I'm sure that's what made a lot of people grow tired of PS1, taking the same bases over and over again. With the event that happened this week-end it's been really nice coming back to PS1 and doing it, but already it's "Capture this" and it's the same thing over and over, you play for years and you've probably captured that same base 100's of times over. There should be something ever so slightly different, otherwise it's going to be the same as PS1, just even more repetitive with safe zone's on the actual continent.

Sorry for the big long post xD

Gonefshn · 2012-07-03, 05:21 PM

This has been beaten into the ground on the forums and has been talked about so much by the devs they understand the concern.

My opinion. If you have never played the original Planetside you might be looking at it with too narrow of a perspective. People are so used to "win conditions" it's hard to see outside of that mindset. In Planetside 1 you could never win truly. Just because you could take over a continent doesn't make it any more of a win than the PS2 system. Taking a tower, base, continent, hex. It's all the same thing really cause it can all be taken back.

In PS1 it just worked. You forgot about win conditions. If you haven't played the original you have no idea just how much the faction loyalty and daily battle with the SAME people fighting the SAME people adds to the experience. Win conditions werent necessary in PS1. You play to be part of the war and to kick ass with your fellow soldiers. I say stop worrying so much about win conditions and give PS2 a try. Get in an outfit, immerse yourself in the experience and you will see what I'm talking about. Win conditions seem small and insignificant when you experience the epic nature of persistant neverending warfare.

infected · 2012-07-03, 05:30 PM

i think they need to move sanctuary off continent. give them a continent of its own. let the playable continents be fully conquerable like the original.

fvdham · 2012-07-03, 05:40 PM

I think I have seen VS conquer the entire world 4 times.
The NC and TR were camped outside the warpgates.

Anubisstargate · 2012-07-03, 05:42 PM

I have played PS1 and I'm with the Outcasters outfit and it's nice having a really good team, even call them friends. But I get that with loads of games and nothing is more enjoyable than playing a game where you win with friends, all of you going "We're the best, we're unstoppable" For me that's the best part about playing with other people.

In all games I've played with PvP me and my friends/guildies always strive to be the best, it's the competitive side in people that shine out the most in games, no competition and you do eventually grow tired and bored. It's like doing the house work, so what if you share the chores with your wife, change what to do maybe, it's still the same old same old, clean something, it gets dirty, clean it again, it gets dirty. That's called doing a chore and that is what it feels like.

For me one of my favourite games was MAG (Before they started nerfing everything). That was a persistent war game with a win to it. Soo many times I played with my friends and if we were in a squad together that pretty much meant we won, we loved playing together and having the winning in each battle was awesome, to then see that our faction had won the bonus, it encouraged us to keep playing, to keep getting better and better, if we lost we can consequences, the other factions had a few bonuses because they were better, so we strived harder and harder each day to get better and better. To me that's perfect, I know this is free to play, I know SOE are trying to grab a very wide audience to play their game, but catching the audience is one thing, keeping them is another.

Bravix · 2012-07-03, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by infected

i think they need to move sanctuary off continent. give them a continent of its own. let the playable continents be fully conquerable like the original.

I agree.

I think there should be a sort of 'dead-zone' around warpgates. Right now, there are hex's right next to it. Will make them incredibly hard to defend from the people who are trying to push out of the warpgate. Gonna be extremely hard to keep a continent, at least compared to PS1.

infected · 2012-07-03, 05:47 PM

or maybe rather than making the sanctuary be off continent, they could at least move them back, away from such close proximity to any capture-able areas. as it stands its quite easy to walk out and cap several areas just because they are so close to spawn. that makes it quite hard to gain victory over a continent if the losing side can walk a few feet and find 6 possible areas to capture. its just too close.

Otleaz · 2012-07-03, 05:48 PM

Ideally, I would want to see sanctuaries off shore or maybe on a massive aircraft. If you want to retake a continent, you should need to use galaxies as transport until you manage to take a warp gate.

SixShooter · 2012-07-03, 05:53 PM

BOOOO!!! We so don't need new win condition/foothold hater threads
I say again - BOOOOO!!!

Anubisstargate · 2012-07-03, 05:53 PM

Yeah a faction over sea platform would be cool. Imagine doing a mass recall. Gather light assault ships, gals and flying over at once. Opposing faction waiting on the cliff's firing, now imagine that at night. It would equal the balance and probably bring a tear to my eye for the awesomeness. That also classes itself under the state of true war.

I don't remember any wars in history having a some what safe zone, maybe an area that is so well defended no one can go near it, but not something you can never touch. If someone says "It's not a war game" ... It is, it has guns, factions, squads, platoon's, outfits, aircraft's, tanks, bases, resources. That's pretty much a war to me unless all those history classes years ago meant nothing.

Otleaz · 2012-07-03, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Anubisstargate

Yeah a faction over sea platform would be cool. Imagine doing a mass recall. Gather light assault ships, gals and flying over at once. Opposing faction waiting on the cliff's firing, now imagine that at night. It would equal the balance and probably bring a tear to my eye for the awesomeness. That also classes itself under the state of true war.

I don't remember any wars in history having a some what safe zone, maybe an area that is so well defended no one can go near it, but not something you can never touch. If someone says "It's not a war game" ... It is, it has guns, factions, squads, platoon's, outfits, aircraft's, tanks, bases, resources. That's pretty much a war to me unless all those history classes years ago meant nothing.

A safe zone is fine imo, even in a war game. Just don't put it in the middle of the enemy's fucking territory.

Bravix · 2012-07-03, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by infected

or maybe rather than making the sanctuary be off continent, they could at least move them back, away from such close proximity to any capture-able areas. as it stands its quite easy to walk out and cap several areas just because they are so close to spawn. that makes it quite hard to gain victory over a continent if the losing side can walk a few feet and find 6 possible areas to capture. its just too close.

Unless you're the VS, in which case you just bring out the Mags