Is the Galaxy a viable spawn? - Page 2

Blue Sam · 2012-08-31, 12:11 PM

Thus far, we've been using Galaxies as spawns almost exclusively. The vast majority of our attacking operations (and the majority of those that have been done against us) have been a case of landing 1-3 Galaxies on/around whatever we've been attacking and pushing from there. The only real differences have been where there's been an excess of enemy fighters stopping us from landing a galaxy (like that epic push up to the Crown yesterday; that was really interesting), or when we've had small groups roaming around in lightnings and the like quickly wiping up the minor bases. If anything, Galaxies are too viable a spawn, since actually using Galaxies for gal drops has been rare to non-existent thus far, because we can just as easily park on one of those convenient landing spots and run in, but that might just because people haven't yet worked out defending those entrances properly, or because there aren't yet the numbers in the beta at once to do that adequately along a lengthy frontier.

Only viable in zergs and if you're bullying far smaller teams than yours.

It's not suited to spec ops. or any other type combat. Evilpig, I would like to remind you that your outfit is numerically a zerg (not saying anything about its organization), but you basically prove that it works within large groups of players. Just like medic class works in large groups of players, but is entirely insufficient for groups smaller than 10.

I've been doing it in groups of 6-8 half the time, and doing it without much trouble. Most of them haven't even been organised groups, just a matter of somebody sticking a galaxy down at warpgate and a handful of people jumping in it. For example, yesterday somebody spawned a galaxy for 2-3 of his mates, had a couple of randoms jump in with them, and I tagged along in a scythe. As we arrived, we got attacked by a couple of Mosquitoes that I was able to hold off for just long enough for the Galaxy to land and deploy before I got shot down, then respawned at the Galaxy and we pushed the Mosquitoes off and then took the base in question.

(For reference, I'm VS on EU1, and I haven't seen TR significantly below a 10 point lead in terms of numbers over the other two factions at all so far, so we've been pretty badly outnumbered most of the time).

Figment · 2012-08-31, 12:18 PM

Also because there's only two classes of infantry that can damage a Galaxy and neither class can actually deal enough damage to kill it even if you have three people firing constantly.

Worse, HA can't hit a moving Galaxy because you're basically firing decimators with a strong gravitational arc. That leaves a MAX with dual Burster and those can't even kill Liberators on their own. Same for AA Wall Turrets.

On the other hand, if you bring a Liberator, it's piss easy to kill anything, especially infantry and stationary Galaxies.

Haro · 2012-08-31, 12:23 PM

I love the gal's current implementation, but I'd be open to a sunderer alternative if it's available. Gal spawns are a little on the rare side outside of big base caps, when you see them on landing pads, but I think it's a good balance. However, a less powerful, more common spawn would be cool, especially if we start seeing more emphasis on big battles away from bases.

EVILPIG · 2012-08-31, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by Figment

Also because there's only two classes of infantry that can damage a Galaxy and neither class can actually deal enough damage to kill it even if you have three people firing constantly.

Worse, HA can't hit a moving Galaxy because you're basically firing decimators with a strong gravitational arc. That leaves a MAX with dual Burster and those can't even kill Liberators on their own. Same for AA Wall Turrets.

On the other hand, if you bring a Liberator, it's piss easy to kill anything, especially infantry and stationary Galaxies.

HA has lock-on AA and AV available to it.

Figment · 2012-08-31, 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

HA has lock-on AA and AV available to it.

If you can spare 7.500 for the AV and 12.500 for the AA, thus in total 20.000 Auraxium you can have both, yes.

Meaning only few will spend on that as they are upgrading their Lightnings and other units. Meaning pretty much none of the players actually do right now. In about half a year you'll see it become common, but for now you can't comment on that it's viable because you can park your Gal: you simply have not the opposition you will have in due time. In Tech Test for instance, it was far harder to keep a Galaxy alive in close because people had lock on then en mass.

And even then people will have to change class, just to combat you. I at least am not happy with either prospect, it severely lacks creative options and "JUST BRING 5 ZILLION ROCKUTZ AFTUHR EVERYUN SPECIAZ... GENERALIZED" is getting old fast. (Unlimited) certs next to temporarily unviable opposed to purchasable weapons are no recipy for prolonged balance.

Saxywolf · 2012-08-31, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

If you are referring to a cloaking bubble, I completely disagree that claoking is needed on any spawn vehicle in Planetside 2. The cloaking is about survivability, which was a concern due to the time it would take to replace an AMS. If your Galaxy dies, you can spawn a new one and have it back in it's position in about 1 minute.

And to clarify, I have never believed that anyone's AMS "deserved" to live forever, as so many AMS drivers come off that way.

I don't know what he was referring to, but...

Can you park the Galaxy on a slope? Can you get it between a couple trees for protection? Can you park it right nearby but they still have to actually find it? Can you park it between a couple buildings to limit which directions it can be attacked from? Can you hide it at a base so that only a small team can use it to attack while undefended depending on it being hidden so that the enemy must search for the spawn? Much of this depends on the map of course.

I never thought my AMS should live forever... in fact, depending on the situation, after deploying one I would spawn at a nearby base to grab another. I would simply run between them killing enemy troops and hop in and out of them so that neither would de-spawn.

Crator · 2012-08-31, 12:33 PM

I still don't get why folks talk against the AMS type vehicle. Also don't understand why the DEVs don't want to try it out even. Only thing I can think of is they are trying to control the Frames Per Second issues by attempting to spread out the players.

EVILPIG · 2012-08-31, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by Figment

If you can spare 7.500 for the AV and 12.500 for the AA, thus in total 20.000 Auraxium you can have both, yes.

Meaning only few will spend on that as they are upgrading their Lightnings and other units. Meaning pretty much none of the players actually do right now. In about half a year you'll see it become common, but for now you can't comment on that it's viable because you can park your Gal: you simply have not the opposition you will have in due time. In Tech Test for instance, it was far harder to keep a Galaxy alive in close because people had lock on then en mass.

And even then people will have to change class, just to combat you. I at least am not happy with either prospect, it severely lacks creative options and "JUST BRING 5 ZILLION ROCKUTZ AFTUHR EVERYUN SPECIAZ... GENERALIZED" is getting old fast. (Unlimited) certs next to temporarily unviable opposed to purchasable weapons are no recipy for prolonged balance.

You spoke as if the lock on didn't exist. I was just informing you. Also, not every infantry class should have an anti-vehicle or anti-air option. That's the point of the Heavy Assault. HA will specialize in anti-infantry and anti-vehicle and will have to choose between those two roles.

We don't know what the final pricing for unlocking weapons will be, but it won't take 6 months to see most everything on the battlefield.

Originally Posted by Crator

I still don't get why folks talk against the AMS type vehicle. Also don't understand why the DEVs don't want to try it out even. Only thing I can think of is they are trying to control the Frames Per Second issues by attempting to spread out the players.

I believe the issue is that there would be hundreds of small, cloaked vehicles acting as spawn points all over the map. Due to the cloaking bubble, they have to have a proximity limitation or you could make entire territories invisible. Then, when you do have the proximity limitation, you get all the jerk-offs who TK AMS's just so that they can place their own. Given the size of the terrain, a cloaked spawnpoint could be too OP.

NewSith · 2012-08-31, 01:14 PM

So far I like the Galaxy.

Kain · 2012-08-31, 01:17 PM

I believe they are, yes (and this is in no way due to me being one of the main taxi drivers for my Outfit :P).

If you organise yourselves to have four holding the Galaxy (the pilot and three others) with the other eight forming the spearhead of the attack, it can be an invaluable point of insurance for your empire.

New players and those who do not realise the tactical importance of a well placed Galaxy spawn point would be well served by veterans highlighting that defending the Galaxy is just as important as attacking the base in question.

ringring · 2012-08-31, 01:18 PM

I'm for an ams.

Although I have to admit the galaxy has grown on me. I don't know how Bio labs can be won without a galaxy or two parked on the air pad.

The thing is, the devs want the galaxy as a spawn for some reason, and they've had to bend over backwards to achieve it by giving it shields and a rediculous amount of armour.

I'd still want the ams. The ams allows stealthy operations the gal doesn't. All in all, remove the Bio Lab issue and an ams is better in all scenarios.

Figment · 2012-08-31, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by Blue Sam

I've been doing it in groups of 6-8 half the time, and doing it without much trouble. Most of them haven't even been organised groups, just a matter of somebody sticking a galaxy down at warpgate and a handful of people jumping in it. For example, yesterday somebody spawned a galaxy for 2-3 of his mates, had a couple of randoms jump in with them, and I tagged along in a scythe. As we arrived, we got attacked by a couple of Mosquitoes that I was able to hold off for just long enough for the Galaxy to land and deploy before I got shot down, then respawned at the Galaxy and we pushed the Mosquitoes off and then took the base in question.

(For reference, I'm VS on EU1, and I haven't seen TR significantly below a 10 point lead in terms of numbers over the other two factions at all so far, so we've been pretty badly outnumbered most of the time).

You mention a few mosquitos, how many players were actually present?

And no, the amount of players on the continent doesn't matter one bit. Pop indicators don't say anything about the resistance you have so saying "looky, we're VS and we're understaffed" is pointless if TR are actually off fighting the NC, which they usualy were due the west-east orientation of the Indar map (VS tended to have next to no opposition, especially on ex-VS (north) turf where next to no NC or TR were found, ever due to the map layout). And yes, I've managed to take bases with 3-6 points on my own regularly as well as long as next to nobody responds and you have a bit of a territorial edge advantage.

I can't see your group of 8 capturing a large base against 20 NC or TR. Meaning I'm under the impression you're highly exagerating the numbers you've been fighting. Landing the Gal isn't a big problem even if there's some fire. Keeping it alive if there's actually a local zerg present is.

Killing it with a relatively small group has also proven to be a problem and that occurs the moment you're more preoccupied with whack-a-mole due to the constant ticker time pressure than with taking out the Galaxy.

Shogun · 2012-08-31, 02:24 PM

i like the galaxy. haven´t piloted one yet, but the functionality is ok.

but a cloakable flexible ams wouldn´t hurt the game. maybe a cert variant of the sunderer. like sacrificing transport functionality to get sparntube instead and sacrifice vehicle repair module for cloakbubble.

Figment · 2012-08-31, 02:35 PM

Btw, for those that say the Galaxy is fine, given the amount of players in PS2 and if it's as easy and intuitive as they say it is... Why is it there is very very very very often NO Galaxy spawnpoint available on the entire continent?

And do they realise that far away positions may have no places where you can get a Galaxy on short notice at all?

Further more, what's wrong with some of you lot? You think it's AWESOME that there's "alternative customizable, personalizable play styles" because there's lots of different guns (not yet) available (that do next to nothing differently, mind, took a look at all their stats and even between empires they are almost all the same), yet if you want to do something differently from the zergGalaxies, then it's suddenly "not needed" and "get an outfit", etc.

Hypocritical much? Spec Ops don't work like zergfits. Don't make us use Galaxies when it doesn't suit our playstyle. If this game really is about playing as you want (which it isn't, at all), then ffs give us alternative options!

typhaon · 2012-08-31, 02:54 PM

Galaxy is perfectly viable. It's tough and can be made even tougher... has quite an impressive arsenal, especially now with the upgraded AA gun and better firing position.

Park it somewhere that it can be blasted non-stop by enemy armor or tower guns and it will fall... as it should.

Otherwise, it's absolutely fantastic.