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Old 2013-01-13, 04:29 AM   [Ignore Me] #16
FreeSpeech
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Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


You dare take away self-repair points. It's a poxy amount of XP per tick as it is, you want to make it even harder for engineers? And it's not seconds to repair an ESF. I'm one off the max and it does not take mere seconds to repair a tank!

ESF's need a big damage output buff and Libs need a big health nerf. You can leave their guns stupidly powerful if you like but a Lib should not be able to just calmly sit there while you unleash 3 entire salvos of A2G rockets into it and it's still living and then simply float away while you continue to pelt it and it still doesn't die. You can't be so blind not to see that as a major problem when AIR can't take out AIR!!

Although don't buff Scythes, they're stupidly powerful as it is, the maneoverability and dodgy "thin" shape of the craft makes them insane at the moment, just lightly bump Mosquitos and seriously buff the crappy Reaver.

Last edited by FreeSpeech; 2013-01-13 at 04:30 AM.
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Old 2013-01-13, 05:04 AM   [Ignore Me] #17
Solkanarmy
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Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


Originally Posted by FreeSpeech View Post

ESF's need a big damage output buff and Libs need a big health nerf. You can leave their guns stupidly powerful if you like but a Lib should not be able to just calmly sit there while you unleash 3 entire salvos of A2G rockets into it and it's still living and then simply float away while you continue to pelt it and it still doesn't die. You can't be so blind not to see that as a major problem when AIR can't take out AIR!!
ESFs don't need a damage output buff at all, if you use the correct weapons to take out liberators you'll find they die a lot more easily. However, this would mean that you can't rocket spam or infantry snipe as the FotM crowd are doing currently.

Also, Liberators feel pretty balanced for the moment - their health pool means that they, as a 3-man vehicle, usually have superiority over a single guy in a single plane, or a single guy on the ground, but if you get 2-3 people on that lib it'll go down, simples. The game should not be built around what you personally want to do in your single-seater plane.

Originally Posted by FreeSpeech View Post
Although don't buff Scythes, they're stupidly powerful as it is, the maneoverability and dodgy "thin" shape of the craft makes them insane at the moment, just lightly bump Mosquitos and seriously buff the crappy Reaver.
This part I agree with, Scythes are too manoeuvrable, and Reavers have issues hovering... Mosquitoes seem fine, in fairness.
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Old 2013-01-13, 07:07 AM   [Ignore Me] #18
ShadetheDruid
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Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


Originally Posted by FreeSpeech View Post
ESF's need a big damage output buff and Libs need a big health nerf. You can leave their guns stupidly powerful if you like but a Lib should not be able to just calmly sit there while you unleash 3 entire salvos of A2G rockets into it and it's still living and then simply float away while you continue to pelt it and it still doesn't die. You can't be so blind not to see that as a major problem when AIR can't take out AIR!!
Maybe try using your nose gun? That's what it's there for. I go Lib hunting all the time when I fly and have a lot of success with it. Yes, it does take a few magazines to take them out, but it's not like they move very fast.
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Old 2013-01-13, 03:24 PM   [Ignore Me] #19
Meecrob
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Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


Ok ill go a little more indepth this time:

Originally Posted by Legolas View Post
Suggestions

Dynamic XP.
- If a weapon like the Rocket Pod is being exploited, lower the XP gained from killing certain target types with them. I.e; infantry killed with pods grants you less XP than infantry killed with the main cannon. Dynamic XP could reward decent play as opposed to spammy behaviour. There could even be more XP rewarded for people flying fast and close to the ground, or upside down to highlight better skill or behaviour.
The dynamic experience that will come in effect on the 30th will decrease xp/hour for rocket pods, trust me. a chunk of kills come from shooting people on top of spawnbuildings / next to sunderers. These kills will be pretty much worthless.

No XP for Repairing Yourself.
- Nobody I know wants this.
In some way i do want this. I would like to see airpads work like they worked in PS1. Meaning they will repair you aswell. You won't get any repair xp for this.

Repairing Yourself.
- Its too cheap that an ESF can be repaired in seconds. The same goes for other vehicles. Maybe slow the repair rate down? You could make it so that every time you take over __% damage you loose _% off the total health permanently, meaning that your ESF gets weaker over time as you constantly repair it? That could stop the self-repair spam.
Here i can't say i agree in the slightest. Maxes can get repaired, tanks can get repaired, infantry can get healed. None of this works any different. ESF's even have the disadvantage they can't get repaired in combat wich all the previously mentioned can.


A2A Missiles.
- Make it so we have to maintain a tight CoF on the target in order to keep the lock. This is more interesting and dynamic than the FaF we have now.
Agreed actually , but..... like someone else stated this will just work adversly against holding back the rocket spam. Which most people seem to want.

Rocket Pod Rocket Speed.
- Rockets could be slower or build up speed before they fully ignite to encourage actual aiming/piloting. It would also lower their effectiveness against aircraft which is good because the Pods aren't meant to be used against other ESFs. Didn't a previous patch back in Beta have more of an acceleration thing with the rockets like this?
1. rocket speed is allready pretty low
2. Their effectiveness has allready been reduced against aircraft, there used to be a time where you could kill a lib with 1 salvo of rockets and some maincannon fire.
3. Rocketpods arent meant to be used against air? You clearly havent played PS1. A slow and big target like a gal should be a good target. And hitting a ESF is just plain hard to do.
4. Like i said the pods arent effective.... so much so its now better to shoot your maincannon than rockets.

Rocket Pod Rocket Dynamic CoF.
- Maybe a dynamic CoF could be used so that the more you are turning the higher the CoF you have. This is only to stop pilots using them against other ESFs as much. If you want a pod that can hurt other aircraft you should be using A2A not A2G.
This doesnt make sense to me. The rockets are fired from pods mechanicly, why would they get drift while moving?

Longer Rearming Time.
- It is far too easy to fully rearm all your rockets. Nothing else in the game, almost, can fill its ammo back up so easily. We desperately need to eliminate the rocket spam and I think that if pilots want rockets they should learn to use them more sparingly and efficiently. The ease of rearming grants you too much power too quickly. Tanks can't just completely rearm inside minutes so why should one man aircraft? The amount of power you get with ammo certs and these fast reloading times is over the top in my opinion.
Nothing else in game is out of ammo as fast aswell.

Less Ammo For Rocket Pods.
- Less is more. Make us pilots work to get kills. Pilots should be far more careful with their rockets, and be encouraged to use their "primary" cannon more often. If something is a secondary weapon it should have a secondary role.
Its not a secondary weapon, its a weapon for a different role. I have the ammo capacity maxed, wich gives me (assuming 6 rockets per infantry kill) a max of 12 kills with a full load. This is lower than any other vehicle weapon i can think of (by order of magnitudes).

Accel/Decel.
- I think ESFs should have slower initial accel so that pilots are less likely to hover-farm hover-spam doorways, as they would not be able to just fly-stop-spam-escape so easily.
- I also think slower decel would encourage dogfighting rather than slow turnfighting and reduce the almost FPS-like stop-aim-shoot. Too often I see aircraft stalling so that their turning (aiming) radius is shorter, so that they may shoot the enemy faster.
- Giving ESFs the ability to insta-stop makes them too effective and easy to control. They should be more like normal fighters.
I guess you can make this argument, but its subjective. I think it's fine the way it is.

Flak.
- Make flak rattle an ESF more. Make it harder to control when under heavy flak fire, kind of like a flinching mechanic. Do not overdo it like explosions though. This would add a small portion of challenge for us and make it more interesting.
For me flak allready works this way. I never go ..... ow im getting hit by some flak lets keep doing what im doing ;P.

Spotting change.
- Remove spotted infantry but keep spotted vehicles. Also make it so when any friendly vehicles and infantry are within your line of sight that they are instantly spotted for you and you only. As a pilot I know that this would help tremendously in keeping aircraft off of general players and pitching them against other air and vehicles which is where they should be.
I think a bigger problem here is the infrared/thermal vision. I rarely use spotted infantry this way. (seeing as the render distance for infantry is the way it is).

Anther misconception here " keeping aircraft off of general players and pitching them against other air and vehicles which is where they should be."
Aircraft in PS1 were meant to be effective against infantry. They are here aswell. I think if you want a semi realistic war scenario this is true. In real life aircraft are pretty much unstoppable by a person on the field (think napalm). I think its good that its toned down compared to reallife, but you shouldnt remove it, if you want a decent simulation of war.

Increase the Speed.
- They feel too much like weird helicopters at the moment and are less satisfying to fly than in Beta.
Like i said... invest in racer airframe. I have it maxed.

Dual Fire.
- After the above changes, make it so we can fire the primary cannon and the secondary pods at the same time. Not being able to do this is weird and would be unnecessary if the secondaries were balanced to begin with. Perhaps this could be certed into somehow as to avoid any scope upgrade problems.
Seeing as the 2 weapons usually have a different role i dont see this as a problem. And seeing that you can reload one weapon while firing the other makes this allready sort off possible when you use skill.

Additional Rocket Changes
- Make them more powerful against infantry. Having to fire dozens of rockets against a single HA is stupid and feels wrong. This change must be in addition to the Less Ammo change and the Longer Rearm Time change, as well as the Rocket Splash change.
This was aallready suggested before, but this will only make it worse from the infantry perspective seeing as the TTK in a reaver vs infantry will go down, meaning less time for the infantry to respond to the fact that hes being shot.

MAX AA
- This is strictly an immersion peeve: I think the AA MAX is really overpowered for its size. That small gun it has should not be so effective against a large vehicle as an ESF. Just look at it... its pathetic. I can understand a large turret AA gun messing my aircraft up but that punny MAX AA gun is too small. Maybe make the MAX AA ability a homing missile instead? The MAX should be effective, but that tiny AA cannon it has weirds me out.
Someone allready said the VS and NC max worked this way in PS1 (the TR max was the flak wich all AA maxes are based on now). The problem is that if you would do that now the fighters would actually have a counter measure against maxes, namely flares.

The biggest problem i see with AA maxes right now (and higby agrees) is their render distance. They can shoot at you without you ever knowing where its coming from. This makes ESF's unable to fight them effectively (like they did in PS1 where a AA max vs a reaver in a 1v1 could go either way).

Friendly Air Collision.
- This really needs fixing somehow. Other people crash into me on airpads and in the air far too often, just as I crash into them in the air too. Not sure what to suggest here. You might think its a minor annoyance but it seems to happen all the time. I suppose I just have to "deal with it" but if there was a way to smooth it out...
Fly more and it will happen less, i promise. Try not to get into situations where it might happen (camping a spawnbuilding with more than 3 aircraft for instance). Ofcourse it still happens to me sometimes, but its not a source of frustration for me.
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Old 2013-01-13, 03:50 PM   [Ignore Me] #20
FreeSpeech
Corporal
 
Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


When I said 3 salvos I probably should have also mentioned that includes the nose gun. So we're talking 3 salvos of main gun and breaker rockets and the liberator isn't even near death. In that time it takes any even remotely able player to simply get in the tail gun and blat you in 4 hits.

3 ESF's on one lib - as VS that happens a lot, but as NC, ha ha , you're lucky if you see Reavers in the air long enough!
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Old 2013-01-13, 03:55 PM   [Ignore Me] #21
StumpyTheOzzie
Second Lieutenant
 
Re: [Suggestion] ESF Changes: from a pilot's perspective


Originally Posted by Beerbeer View Post
I don't believe you should get ANY experience for repairing your own vehicle. It's just stupid as you are doing it for yourself to begin with.

If legolas' repair idea isn't good, then nerf the crap out of repair times. Make it four to six times longer for tanks, esfs and libs. It should take a long time to be able to quickly bring that power back.
Hey! wow! That's actually a REALLY good idea!

The only downside is things like forward deployed sunderers. I know you didn't mention them in your post and I just want to emphasise that.

I'd hate my spawn points to be more fragile than they already are. Could a deployed sundy maybe have a 500% armour buff or something?
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