Is the Galaxy a viable spawn? - Page 3

Visperas · 2012-08-31, 01:55 PM

I like the galaxy but I think that another ground vehicle with less armour than a Gal should work as a spawn point aswell. And I think that's the Sunderer. It doesn't need to be cloakable. Just the way it is but with spawning options. It could even work as a global beacon so players need to drop from the sky.
PS: Dropping is cool. The cooldownd on the two different ways for dropping are too high in my opinion.

Sleepy · 2012-08-31, 02:01 PM

Yes, the Galaxy is a viable spawn. However, it is, to this point in Beta, not enough.

Galaxies require dedicated, or nearly so, pilots. You have to take a significant amount of time to Cert, learn to fly, and learn where to land properly around the entirety of the map. They are for organized medium-large Outfits. In this way, they will never become redundant, as you can fly over obstacles and enemies en route to your objectives, quickly. Even escorted by fighters from Outfit mates.

What about the rest of the Empire (ie, the 'zerg')?

There will be copious numbers of players in the game who just log on for brief periods (<1 hour), or just to play with a friend. Some don't like TS and have to listen to people; they just want to be immersed in the game world. An AMS projects Empire assaults - not just Outfit ones. The Devs said you aren't required to use TS and be in an Outfit to play (paraphrasing: Smed blogged that solo play is viable).

Currently, this game plays like a 400 meter dash. Sprint sprint sprint into a high TTK environment. Then sprint again. The Vehicle Dev stated he 'just can't see' a viable reason for AMS. Well, I remember the Dev Team stating a design goal being less downtime. This game has no less DT than PS1. Sure, you respawn faster, but die a lot quicker and usually spawn 400m from where you died. Most fights I've been at in the Beta do not have Gals supporting them, and if they do, they are also parked >400m from the fight, if not on the roof.

An AMS adds Organic depth to the game. That same Vehicle Dev said that 'there are plenty of spawn points' as another reason AMS is not needed. Fixed spawns offer no compelling gameplay. The Tension created around:
- getting your AMS to the target safely
- parking it as to maximize it's stealth potential
- protecting it/repairing it for soldiers
- knowing that it will eventually be found (adding to the pressure)
- Defenders having a shared goal to find and destroy it (them) to break the back of the assault

It's no wonder during that twitch Dev meeting that so many people cried out "AMS!" when Higby asked if the audience have questions.

Having said all this, PS2 is a fun game, and all of us appreciate the unprecedented Developer interaction. Hopefully, more PS1 gameplay can enrich PS2's experience - right now, as even Smed observed: "It plays like MMOBF3."

EVILPIG · 2012-08-31, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Figment

Btw, for those that say the Galaxy is fine, given the amount of players in PS2 and if it's as easy and intuitive as they say it is... Why is it there is very very very very often NO Galaxy spawnpoint available on the entire continent?

And do they realise that far away positions may have no places where you can get a Galaxy on short notice at all?

Further more, what's wrong with some of you lot? You think it's AWESOME that there's "alternative customizable, personalizable play styles" because there's lots of different guns (not yet) available (that do next to nothing differently, mind, took a look at all their stats and even between empires they are almost all the same), yet if you want to do something differently from the zergGalaxies, then it's suddenly "not needed" and "get an outfit", etc.

Hypocritical much? Spec Ops don't work like zergfits. Don't make us use Galaxies when it doesn't suit our playstyle. If this game really is about playing as you want (which it isn't, at all), then ffs give us alternative options!

I rarely see "no galaxy spawns available". If you do, I would suggest you set one up for your empire.

The weapons that are unavailable are just placeholders. You shouldn't read into their stats too much.

You make it sound as if all Spec Ops are done by small groups, which I disagree with, but that is besides the point. Most Spec Ops are done at low or not populated enemy facilities. For this, you really don't need a mobile spawnpoint, though it helps. A good Spec Op will have the right personal to ensure that the operation can sustain it's self. You sound too reliant on the AMS as a crutch. I love the AMS and hated to see it go, but it is not necessary and you have to think about the overall effect. Having a cloaked AMS means that there will tons of them out there. It may make clearing a territory of enemy too difficult, and I say that with a grain of salt. The truth is that the distance from one facility to another is not far. It does not take long to run from base to base. You should be placing Galaxies near your next target, they certainly help until you get a hard spawn. You just have to look at the overall effect of having the AMS in the game would have. That, we do not know yet.

Lastly, why can't this be discussed without you getting angry? Is it just that others disagree with you?

MrBloodworth · 2012-08-31, 02:24 PM

Game play has shown that the Gal as an AMS has marginalized one of the most iconic things from Planetside.

The hot drop.

Even after the squad spawn change to a beacon. I have not seen Gal-drops with any sort of frequency. I am quite sure it is due to the Galaxy being a spawn point.

If you can put a spawn point anywhere, at any elevation, hot dropping on the top of a base becomes moot. The AMS did not cause this problem, and did not overlap with Galaxy Hot-dropping.

No more real proof needed than this.

Joe · 2012-08-31, 02:30 PM

The Gal is a great spawn if you r organized and protect it a driven spawn unit would be great 2 however

Wizkid45 · 2012-08-31, 02:32 PM

The Gal is viable, but I dont feel it fits every role. I still feel that an AMS or deployable Sundy would be beneficial for the game. Lets be honest, the Gal is a giant target for everyone on the other team to shoot at, and while it has been made stronger over the past patches, it is still super easy to kill one. I think having a Sundy/AMS would allow you to have more covert tactics by being able to more easily hide your spawn point, but at a cost of say a much higher respawn time and the inability to spawn/pull a MAX at it to keep people from flooding them. I'm sure there will be more Gals being used in release or later in beta if they continue to be tweaked, but a smaller, specialty vehicle would be nice. There just currently aren't enough around to alleviate the agonizing 5 minute run from a spawn point to a base only to be killed as soon as you get there.

Crator · 2012-08-31, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by EVILPIG

Lastly, why can't this be discussed without you getting angry? Is it just that others disagree with you?

Nothing wrong with being passionate about an idea and showing emotion (as much as you can via text) over it.

You're one of the only ones here that I've seen talking against the need/want for an AMS.

Bittermen · 2012-08-31, 02:50 PM

I'd love to see a cert for the Sunderer that allows squad spawning.

I like options.

waldizzo · 2012-08-31, 03:02 PM

Getting a Galaxy into a highly contested area successfully takes coordination, skill and some luck. Once in place, it is an asset worth keeping around because of the difficulty involved in replacing it.

What I would like to see is a certification that is deep within the sunderer tree that allows for AMS like ability. Certifying into this should be a dedicated effort by the player and not easily obtained. The AMS was too prevelent in the original game, I'm of the opinion that having an expensive certification cost would greatly reduce the amount of these we would see on the battlefield. Most players would rather invest in themselves. Dedicated support players want to invest in the team.

TheSaltySeagull · 2012-08-31, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Hamma

The Galaxy is now our mobile spawn point and with the introduction of a deployment mode and shields it's quite a powerhouse on the ground. Do you think it's viable? Does it need more tools to be functional or should the Sunderer also be made a spawn?

watching your steam it appears you spend a good deal of time flying the gal. So I am curious what you yourself think about it and what you would do to improve it if you feel it needs to be improved at all?

EVILPIG · 2012-08-31, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by waldizzo

Getting a Galaxy into a highly contested area successfully takes coordination, skill and some luck. Once in place, it is an asset worth keeping around because of the difficulty involved in replacing it.

What I would like to see is a certification that is deep within the sunderer tree that allows for AMS like ability. Certifying into this should be a dedicated effort by the player and not easily obtained. The AMS was too prevelent in the original game, I'm of the opinion that having an expensive certification cost would greatly reduce the amount of these we would see on the battlefield. Most players would rather invest in themselves. Dedicated support players want to invest in the team.

The only skill is sticking the landing, and that is also easy. You spawn Galaxy at Warpgate and fly about 30 seconds to your waypoint and land. That is not hard.

ringring · 2012-08-31, 04:16 PM

You're quite right figgy, gal is not suitable for covert actions .... and you're also right that there is often not one available.

AMS please.

Fenrys · 2012-08-31, 04:58 PM

It does not work. You can't really park a galaxy any closer than the peripheral capture points, so attackers will always have a too-long jog to get to the fight.

NewSith · 2012-08-31, 05:04 PM

I used to drive AMS in PS1 alot and now fly Galaxy alot.

I'm from anti-AMS camp, because AMS will just be overpowered in this game. With cloaking bubble or without it. I will elaborate it in one key phrase: Size Matters. Big Galaxy cannot be parked harmlessly right next to a capture point. With equal forces it has low chance to stand there for long.

AMS, however will just keep spawning people right into the point without any real counter except for an OS. TWhich, above all, is not unlocked yet.

That being said - imagine an AMS parked in the basement of a PS1 biolab right next to a CC. That's what AMS will be like until they actually change the capture mechanics.

Kipper · 2012-08-31, 05:14 PM

For me, doing a 'spec ops' in a galaxy would be something like flying over a target area, hot dropping a small squad from it, who then proceed to set up a 'proper' squad/platoon/empire spawn beacon in a discreet place without drawing too much attention.

Galaxy then retreats to a safe distance to become a backup spawn point where people can pull MAX or change classes.