The Decimator - Page 3

Cease · 2003-09-13, 03:45 PM

First of all, claiming that the Pounder is the only good MAX in the game, and therefore anything that makes it harder to kill a MAX is a buff for the TR is not only bullshit, it also makes you sound like an idiot.

Not sure if this was directed at me. I think it was. I never said the Pounder was the only good MAX. I said it was the best AI MAX. Just look in this thread and read the small amount of strategies brought about "Taking on Pounders." Go to the official forums and you'll find a ton of threads discussing nothing but how to deal with the typical TR anchored Pounders with engineer/medic support. Tactical discussions on how to route them out of towers and out fo areas where there is no "backdoor". Now go find me a ONE thread with similar concerns on Scattercannon and Quasar Maxes. The fact is, you won't find one.

Whats my point? My point is the Pounder is a damn good MAX. I'm not saying its overpowered. I'm just saying it kicks ass. The change to the Decimator in-directly buffed all Maxes across all empires if only a little. And since TR is often considered at having the best Maxes -- this obviously favors TR more than the other empires.

Xxzard · 2003-09-13, 03:45 PM

DECIs are cool

Jagd · 2003-09-13, 03:54 PM

The thing is, you can't have all equivalent certs balanced equally across all factions, but as long as they balance out as a whole the game works fine. Ok, enough people think the pounder is the ultimate MAX that's great and I'll agree with you, but our heavy assault cert is definitely the worst of the 3 because it is so inaccurate, and eats through ammo like nothing else. If you want to take the pounder down a notch, take the jackhammer and lasher down a notch, and then you have to give the lasher an AV alt-fire because it's the only heavy assault weapon that is useless against armor. Oh but then everyone would cry and they'd take away the AV damage again because the lasher was so powerful everyone was going Vanu. Sound familiar? Things are pretty damn equal when you look at an empire's vehicles and weaponry as a whole.

Cease · 2003-09-13, 04:48 PM

I never claimed it threw anything out of balance. After fighting for a few hours last night I feel it has made the differences between the Pounder and the other AI maxes distinctly clear for this die-hard Decimator user.

I did experience more difficulty with Pounders as to be expected. However, Quasars and Scattercannons were still pretty much Decimator fodder.

Flammey · 2003-09-13, 11:16 PM

Okay, yes, it does say in the instruction booklet that the Decimator is an Anti-vehicle weapon. But if that is so, why is it not in Common Pool AV??

As for the fix on the Decimator. It's fine. I can not speak for the sit still part of the Pheonix too much, except that when I fire my stolen Pheonix's, I'm usually behind an object. But what fool would stand still to fire a Decimator? Wouldn't it be easier to set it for dumb fire, shot, move, shot, move?? I don't know. I tried the Decimator out before the fix, and I felt it was fine, and that fire mode didn't matter. And I tried it out this morning, and it was the same, from my point of view. Maybe I just didn't notice. As for thinking your fucked now against maxes. Meh, grab a Lancer, or a Pheonix, or a Striker. Or continue using Decimators. When I went up in a Max against a Decimator before, I was always thinking to myself, Oh shit, I'm fucked. I don't think that's going to change.

Cease · 2003-09-14, 02:37 AM

I never said I was fucked when facing maxes. I merely stated it was more difficult now which is what I expected and which I'm sure was the purpose of the change in the first place. As a max user I understand, respect, and welcome the change.

But this doesnt change my opinion on how this will affect gameplay as it currently stands. It also doesn't change my opinion that this pronounces the gap between the Pounder and the other AI maxes.

Acaila · 2003-09-14, 02:43 AM

I am glad they fixed this. I felt almost sorry for maxs moving inside of facilities. I would see them, think "you poor bastard", pull out the deci, bang bang and it is dead before it knows what is happening. Atleast now they have a chance against them. And seriously, using the deci in alternate fire now is still they way to go in most situations. The splash damage is not insignificant, 3 near misses still kill a max. And finally lightnings will be able to attempt to escape, before this they were deci fodder (and imho lightnings need an armour/speed buff).

I wasn't the least bit afraid of tangling with a max before this fix, except possibly an anchored pounder. Even then if it is alone, you can usually come out on top or get a double frag. Now I am alot more cautious. No more 1-2sec max kills.

SandTrout · 2003-09-14, 02:45 AM

Maybe the effects of the Decimator nerf will encourage the pounder to be rebalanced(read: nerf the indirect fire!). I don't cry nerf at the drop of a hat, but the pounder IS the only max with indirect fire capability.

Zakaah · 2003-09-14, 04:53 AM

one way to fix the pounder get rid of indirect fire not nerf it then you could actually have some cover around a corner and take pot shots with not just decis but rocklets they could kick arse then other wise pounders will be the bane of enyone who sees one for years to come

Acaila · 2003-09-14, 05:57 AM

I think nerf the AV damage. A pounder should not be able to beat an AV max even when it is anchored.

Cease · 2003-09-14, 11:09 AM

I dont think nerfing is the answer. I think the Scattercannon and Quasar need a slight damage increase. The power of the Pounder isn't its indirect fire -- its its AE damage. The ability to hit multiple grunts is where its power lies. And the grenades are brutal, so it only takes a few splashes to kill a grunt. Thats the other area of power in the Pounder - killing grunts fast.

Essentially this allows the Pounder to handle multiple grunts, and doesn't require much accuracy either. The Scatter and Quasar have to deal with one grunt at a time and they require accuracy in order to do damage. In addition the Pounders damage simply kills grunts faster than the other AI maxes. IMO, they need a slight increase in damage in order to kill infantry faster. They do decent damage now, but I think they need just a little bit more damage per round.

I personally feel ALL AI maxes need to demons at killing grunts. The Pounder is, but the other two aren't. I can't go 1 on 1 with a Pounder anymore as a grunt. And thats great! But the fact is I can go 1 on 1 with Scatter and Quasar and win more than I lose. I think thats a problem. They take too long to kill a grunt.

By increasing the Scatter and Quasar's damage you make them better AI maxes but you're not robbing the Pounder of being the king.

Slice · 2003-09-14, 11:41 AM

I agree Cease. Having played both VS and NC, the Quasar, IMO, is the only decent VS max, and it needs help. (havent tried the new AA max yet) As NC, the first cert I got was the Scattercannon, thinking "Hell yea, just like my pounder, get the AI max, roll in the kills and BR!" Instead, I could only kill troops one-on-one and if there were multiple troops and one of em had rocklet, or both, I was screwed. Considered, I probly suck with the scattercannon, but my point still stands. Buff the DPR slightly with the VS and NC AI max.

SandTrout · 2003-09-14, 12:48 PM

I aggree that the scatter and quasar need a buff. The quazar should do more damage and the scattercannon should have a tighter pellet spread in general.

However, they still need to remove the indirect fire from the pounder, because they can spam nades down a corodoor at anyone comeing if they have audio amp(and by my experience, most do).

Acaila brought up another good point that the pounder still does good AV damage, and they can take on other maxes easaly at medium range.

JuSTCHiLLiN · 2003-09-14, 04:55 PM

I've never been anything other than a SA user with my primary character.

I used the deci in secondary mode long before it was popular. I always thought that's how it was intended though because you can't move/dodge while using it.

Now, when taking down a pounder by myself I just equip 2 deci's. It's actually faster, I find.

Oh, and the pounder is definately the best AI max in the game and a locked down punder can take out both NC's and Vanu's AV maxes one-on-one. It's an area affect weapon, no aiming required.

What I would like to see is either phoenix users get 3 shots like the striker or the striker has to reload after each shot. Back when the phoenix could navigate hallways in the beta I could understand the 1 shot per reload but now, with it's 250m limited range, lack of mobility, and slow refire rate, I think it's the worst AV weapon. It does have the advantage of being to scout for a target (over base walls) but I think all of it's short comings out weigh that.

Prophaniti · 2003-09-14, 10:02 PM

I realize the noobishness of my earlier post, and i apologize. i dont own PS, just play at my friends house, and i havent gone and memorized all the weapon names. Seeing as i never use the decimator, i got it mixed up with.. i guess a phoenix or something. I'm not quite sure on that one. Oh, Happy Li'l Elf? You cant say anything to me because at least I'm not some loser who replies to every freakin' post on the forums.