Instanced small team combat. - Page 3

Vancha · 2011-07-19, 04:41 AM

Originally Posted by dachlatte

i didnt read any replys but...

Anytime you start a forum post with that, you can be utterly sure, with 100% certainty, that you're doing it wrong.

dachlatte · 2011-07-19, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by Vancha

Anytime you start a forum post with that, you can be utterly sure, with 100% certainty, that you're doing it wrong.

any arguments to support that claim?

Vancha · 2011-07-19, 07:03 AM

Originally Posted by dachlatte

any arguments to support that claim?

If you like.

You said...

Originally Posted by dachlatte

i didnt read any replys but...

HELL NO! go play [enter generic fps]

After this...

Originally Posted by Kitija

No.

Originally Posted by DashRev

Absolutely not.

Originally Posted by Bags

Negatory.

Originally Posted by MrVicchio

That was MY reaction too. However since he's a non-PS player never having even set foot in the original, I thought his outside thinking was worth throwing out here.

Originally Posted by Kitija

Thats what i read there...

Originally Posted by DeeTwoEh

Never ever. What sets PS apart if it's just like every other game out? Answer is nothing. You shouldn't associate yourself with that friend anymore....Unless it happens to be a very attractive female. In that case, have intercourse with her and then cease all further communication.

Originally Posted by MgFalcon

The only way this could work would be for the same empire to go at a mini-game of CTF or something like that.

Take for example that in certain territories there would be an "arena" (craters maybe?) where the same number of opposing players would que into (same empire). Then BOOM! CTF, Death match (team obviously), etc. I believe this could be a great idea, it would urge friendly (by friendly I mean hate) competition inside Empires. And new rankings and what not.

A few ground rules:

-Empire specific (a VS vs. NC competition would be completely useless... go out and capture some territories from them if you really wana fight an opposing faction)
-ONLY accessible when there is no sufficient opposing force on the continent
-NO REWARDS, other than bragging rights and leaderboards
-Each continent would have it's own unique arena (i.e. Indar's arena would be CTF, while Searhus would be Death match)
-No vehicles in the arena
-Temporary color change (to distinguish teams)

I think this would be an interesting idea and could really spur on some Outfit vs. Outfit battles

Originally Posted by Volw

and dilute PS massive battle experience with some piss poor 32 player game? seriously?

Originally Posted by krnasaur

ok, i could maybe see a 30 per side outfit battle event once a year, other than that. no

Originally Posted by Hamma

I think this should exist.

But ONLY for competitions, they did outfit wars and the like and they were rather successful but a bitch to manage because there was no game mechanic for it.

This shouldn't be something anyone can just jump into though. As mentioned above it would take away from gameplay.

Originally Posted by MgFalcon

My main thoughts are always on Outfits, I've never really gave good intentions/thought for the individual player (killwhores) on a game focused on teamwork in global war.

Once a year sounds retarded, once a month would be nice though.

This still is a better idea than:
BFR's
Insta-kinfe
PvE
Destructible environments
BFR's
Getting rid of enter/exit vehicle animations

Originally Posted by ShowNoMercy

Screw ALLLL instances, if you want outfit vs outfit shit make a continent where your only allegiance is to you outfit. All bases captured would belong to your outfit and your outfit would be the only ones experiencing the resource benefits from it. There you go, problem solved, we get a cont specifically for outfit fighting, massive nature is preserved, and stupid lame ass instances can stay out of PS2. Call me Henry Clay.

Originally Posted by Kitija

GLobal Agenda is thataway ------->

Originally Posted by krnasaur

once a month sounds too often, im thinking about once every year have a tournament bracket where the prize is X resources to the winning outfit.

have a platoon bracket(30v30) and a squad bracket(10v10)

Originally Posted by MgFalcon

Good call, Sir. I forgot this part was in the title, and thusly forgot to address this. I like your idea on Continent: Outfit... creamed my pants

Originally Posted by WarChimp130

Hell no! If this game was instanced it would be awful.

Originally Posted by Malorn

Worst idea since the jump-to-conclusions mat.

Horrible idea.

Originally Posted by basti

No, No, never, ever, no, nope.

And if, then ONLY for special events like outfit wars, NOT at all times!

Originally Posted by xcel

I can't believe this is up for debate....NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Originally Posted by Lonehunter187

This is exactly what I was thinking. BUT... it's Planetside.

The only reason I can see putting in an instanced battleground is for squad or outfit competition. How can we achieve this ending goal in a different way? Simply coordinating between squads/outfits, scheduling, planning, and the people to "run it".

"But I don't want to get interrupted or bothered" again.... it's PLANETSIDE

What could help remedy this whole thing is something like a bi-monthly tournament that SOE could run. Do teams of 5,20,100, for different objectives and terrain. Maybe a continent or island is blocked off for a few days to run it.

I really wanna see more events in general. SOE needs to interact with the community in game, not just on forums.

Originally Posted by SKYeXile

yea if you wanted instanced battles play COD or BF, this in a MMOFPS, why would you want to demassify it?

comps is fine, outfit wars was wicked fun, but i would not want to see it as a metagame or anything.

Instance battlesgrounds in everygame i have seen them in ALWAYS detracts from world pvp, the incentives to not hunt for kills and que and do instanced battles generaly reaps better rewards than open world pvp. because of xp or kills per hour, as usual people take the path of least restance to GLORY! and even if SOE can work around that mindset, any player logging into doing instanced pvp is taken away from doing world pvp.

Originally Posted by Volw

^ this

can we close the thread now?

Originally Posted by Hamma

wow..

Now I know how Tool felt in the other thread.

Nobody wants Global Agenda, Nobody wants COD, BF etc.

Some of you people need to really open your eyes and READ.

It's very simple really and I'll spell it out one more time so you guys can read it this time around.

In PlanetSide, they had an "Outfit Wars" event which was a total success and a blast for those involved. But it was very hard for SOE to organize this because there was no place for it.

Something like this, which requires admin intervention would be a good idea when they do those events again.

Or keep your eyes closed and respond the same way everyone has seemed to when they don't like something the past few days. Mention some other game that is not PlanetSide and write it off.

There should NOT BE INSTANCED COMBAT that players can drop into anytime they want. That I agree, but there should be an admin method to get players into one area for an event such as Outfit Wars or Duels which they also had an event for.

Originally Posted by opticalshadow

id sooner take a shot in the ass, and use stagnate water from the everglades to wash it out before trying to remove it with two rusty nails wielded by a nurse who flunked med school and currently has possibly the worst cold ive ever seen in the back of a pickup truck in the middle of a traffic jam then i would say instanced zones for small combat in a game based around the idea of open world largest scale combat in any game ever was a good idea.

Edit: to Hamma, i see what you mean, the problem is, that isnt the aim of ps, it wasnt the aim of ps1 and it isnt the aim of ps2. ps is aimed at massive scale combat. now i get there were events for this, and eventually they did have an area for this, and thats fine and all.

but if your asking me when i think it should be concidered a "feature" it says to me its everything they stated ps is not. so my answer above may seem like my eyes are closed and i dont care about new things, but thats not it, im simply addressing i think it should not be done.

outfits in PS are like platoons in the real world. they train together, they fight togehter, and both take place amogest all the other platoons. ive always felt that outfit vs outfit matches were silly, because the battelfield series offers better tools for that, with maps designed for it.if SOE designs a place for this to happen, thats taking away from features that the core game could use, they can just as easily reuse any of the conts in the game on a diffrent server to run these things and im fine with that, but dont devote resources to creating something new, until the game is out and sucessful, because everything they do that is not part of the core of what PS is, is taking away from why we are all here in the first place.

Originally Posted by Hamma

Nevermind...

Chances are if and when they put it in nobody will know about it till they use it (for an event) anyways.

Originally Posted by Traak

How about organizing it on a CoD server?

Originally Posted by Vancha

While your friend evidently hasn't played Planetside if he thinks you need instances for intense combat, I would ask what these "good points" were...

I mean, you make the thread due to them, but yet you don't elaborate on what they are. Obviously people are going to reject it if you don't explain the benefits.

Originally Posted by Coreldan

No.

...was said.

Perhaps you'd also like me to explain why starting a forum post with...

- "I haven't read the OP, but..."
- "I don't care what any of you say or think, but..."
- "This is a response to a different thread, but..."
- "This is a response to a different thread on a different forum, but..."
- "I'm going to type a random string of letters after the word but, but..."

...also means you can be utterly sure, with 100% certainty, that you're doing it wrong?

dachlatte · 2011-07-19, 07:20 AM

Originally Posted by Vancha

lots of stuff

i read the OP and my statement

Originally Posted by dachlatte

HELL NO! go play [enter generic fps]

was in complete agreement with all the other replys.

notice anything?

Originally Posted by Vancha

Perhaps you'd also like me to explain why starting a forum post with...

please do in as much detail as possible

Lunarchild · 2011-07-19, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by dachlatte

please do in as much detail as possible

It's simple really. Admitting to not reading any of the replies on the topic:

Totally invalidates your opinion, regardless of what you say; and
Is the same as admitting you're a total and utter douchebag who does not care about other's opinion

As such it's generally not a smart thing to do ^^

Aside from all that, your post was totally non-constructive...

Vancha · 2011-07-19, 07:28 AM

Originally Posted by dachlatte

my statement was in complete agreement with all the other replys.

No it wasn't...

Originally Posted by dachlatte

notice anything?

You evidently still have yet to read the thread?

---------
Back on topic, a conversation from the chat room courtesy of CutterJohn.

[12:08] <CutterJohn> i don't understand what the fear of it is
[12:08] <CutterJohn> that it will distract from the game?
[12:09] <CutterJohn> even if it was a team deathmatch, it shouldn't matter
[12:09] <CutterJohn> if someone wants to play like that, by all means, go for it
[12:09] <CutterJohn> I wouldn't mind it from time to time either
[12:10] <Vancha> I'm thinking back to all the events Killa Girlz ran. They had such trouble keeping their tournaments free of griefers I think. A system to accommodate such things would be very useful.
[12:10] <CutterJohn> the game will cater to multiple playstyles, see no reason it can't cater to multiple game styles either
[12:10] <CutterJohn> it wouldn't take much. A few purpose built maps and some new logic/ui elements
[12:12] <CutterJohn> it would broaden the scope of the game and get more people playing. more playing = more paying = more good stuff for everyone!
[12:13] <Vancha> You should make these points in the thread, though your post might get drowned out by the spam of lolno posters.
[12:14] <Vancha> Or I could just copy/paste this conversaion from the point you said "I don't understand what the fear of it is".
[12:16] <CutterJohn> My guess is they think people will play it more
[12:17] <CutterJohn> and that means less people in the field
[12:17] <CutterJohn> but.. thats kind of a selfish move imo
[12:18] <CutterJohn> telling someone how to play for your own benefit
[12:18] <Vancha> Like you say, who knows? Maybe it could attract enough additional people that even if it was the kind of thing people wanted to play regularly, they'd also spend enough time in the field for battles to be even larger.

Coreldan · 2011-07-19, 07:45 AM

There is still a fear of some kind. Battlegrounds in WoW killed the open world PVP for the most parts.

I guess the majority might've preferred it then, but nobody bothered to do it anymore, I guess the spoonfed system of the BGs was so much more easier and u still got to kill people.

CutterJohn · 2011-07-19, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by Coreldan

There is still a fear of some kind. Battlegrounds in WoW killed the open world PVP for the most parts.

It was a loss for those who liked open world pvp, but a gain for those that liked the instanced combat.

PS is a pvp game. PVP only. And if you don't like open world combat, preferring a more structured environment, there is no place for you(And, it appears, you will get insulted as well).

Nobody questions that WoW has multiple options for each for pve and pvp. Theres solo content, world content, instanced raid content, open world raid content, open world pvp, instanced pvp, multiple arena ladders, even duels.

Increasing the variety of gamestyles would do nothing but benefit PS2 by reaching a broader audience. It can only 'ruin' the game if you believe so many people would play the arenas/battlegrounds that combat on the continents would suffer, especially since they can't get any fancy rewards/gear from them.

So, i suppose the question is.. If they had these arenas, and it emptied out the continents, what does that say about PS2 open world content/gameplay?

If the open world gameplay is good, people will play it.
If its not good, or not their preference, people will play the arenas more, but they'll still be playing PS and will go to the continents occasionally for a change of pace.
If its not good, or not their preference, and there are no arenas that they might try, they will simply not play PS2.

The only reason to not include it is to take no chances that something else could distract from what you view as the main focus of the game, to not offer alternatives so people are forced into that. A bit selfish, imo.

dachlatte · 2011-07-19, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by Lunarchild

It's simple really. Admitting to not reading any of the replies on the topic:

Totally invalidates your opinion, regardless of what you say; and
Is the same as admitting you're a total and utter douchebag who does not care about other's opinion

As such it's generally not a smart thing to do ^^

Aside from all that, your post was totally non-constructive...

guilty as charged. topic caused some nerd rage i guess

Sentrosi · 2011-07-19, 08:28 AM

At first I was like all the others on this thread.
No
Hell No
H E Double Hockey sticks NO
No Frakin' way bro
Hamma, I just died a little inside when I read your post...

Blah blah blah

Then I thought about it a bit. I'm older so I'm granted this luxury of looking at things from a different perspective. You will too someday. And you'll have me to thank for that.

I like the idea. I don't want a weekly contest though. Think of it as a quarterly Olympiad. There are the traditional games like Capture the Flag and Rabbit (think old school T2 days). But then they add in things like Resource Runs, ANT(if they are in) races, Best Sniper, etc. The winner gets a distinctive in-game title. If it's an outfit based competition, then all members of the outfit are granted that title. The title is good only until the next competition. The only thing that comes from these competitions is bragging rights and special notations in-game. Hell, everyone in MMOs these days likes titles associated with their names. Lets bring that over to Planetside 2.

Manitou · 2011-07-19, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by Sentrosi

I like the idea. I don't want a weekly contest though. Think of it as a quarterly Olympiad. There are the traditional games like Capture the Flag and Rabbit (think old school T2 days). But then they add in things like Resource Runs, ANT(if they are in) races, Best Sniper, etc. The winner gets a distinctive in-game title. If it's an outfit based competition, then all members of the outfit are granted that title. The title is good only until the next competition. The only thing that comes from these competitions is bragging rights and special notations in-game. Hell, everyone in MMOs these days likes titles associated with their names. Lets bring that over to Planetside 2.

Interesting line of thought...I kind of like that.

Spark · 2011-07-19, 09:10 AM

Add one more to the hell no never on my life side.

Originally Posted by Vancha

[12:18] <Vancha> Like you say, who knows? Maybe it could attract enough additional people that even if it was the kind of thing people wanted to play regularly, they'd also spend enough time in the field for battles to be even larger.

I have seen how this 'quick action' mode can destroy a game and it's sad how developers keep falling into the same trap (Battleground Europe is doing something similar, why splitting their already miniscule community further is mindboggling). The developers of the Natural Selection mod had the very same mindset as you (attract new players with a traditional mindless killing game mode, train them for the real thing etc), but it never works like that. The new players stick to that game mode and rarely cross over. They leech and divide the community while the main game mode gets infected with a selfish K/D obsessed mindset as that style of gameplay washes over, all while other players get fed up and quit. That's one of the major reasons why Natural Selection died and I sure as hell don't want that to happen in PS2.

Vancha · 2011-07-19, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by Spark

I have seen how this 'quick action' mode can destroy a game and it's sad how developers keep falling into the same trap (Battleground Europe is doing something similar, why splitting their already miniscule community further is mindboggling). The developers of the Natural Selection mod had the very same mindset as you (attract new players with a traditional mindless killing game mode, train them for the real thing etc), but it never works like that. The new players stick to that game mode and rarely cross over. They leech and divide the community while the main game mode gets infected with a selfish K/D obsessed mindset as that style of gameplay washes over, all while other players get fed up and quit. That's one of the major reasons why Natural Selection died and I sure as hell don't want that to happen in PS2.

Yup, adding battlegrounds and arenas in WoW really killed off raids...Oh wait.

I've never played Natural Selection, but like someone said above - if people would rather play the small game over the large one, it doesn't say much for the large one.

Besides, I don't think I specified that it would be a "traditional mindless killing game mode". What I said was said in response to people fearing that it would draw people away from the "proper fight" if it happened to be the sort of thing people could play a lot.

Coreldan · 2011-07-19, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by Vancha

Yup, adding battlegrounds and arenas in WoW really killed off raids...Oh wait.

I've never played Natural Selection, but like someone said above - if people would rather play the small game over the large one, it doesn't say much for the large one.

Besides, I don't think I specified that it would be a "traditional mindless killing game mode". What I said was said in response to people fearing that it would draw people away from the "proper fight" if it happened to be the sort of thing people could play a lot.

I don't think PVE should be the comparable thing there, as they have somewhat different playerbases too.

Battleground and arena did, however, kill open world PVP. Now, one can probably argue that in the same way as WoWs PVE and PVP, the instanced combat and "normal combat" in PS would have slightly different playerbases, but they are still a lot more similar than PVE and PVP in wow are, for comparison.

Given, I'm not OVERLY concerned in PS's case for some reason, but I still am. The reason why I probably aint so concerned is that if the game is built from the ground up for the "open PVP" like current planetside, I figure majority of focus would stay on it and this instanced system might actually just a serve for some extra population. However, I still am worried that it may have a negative impact on what this game is unique for.

Hamma · 2011-07-19, 09:30 AM

They did these events before and it didn't kill the game. This simply makes it so griefing asshat's can't get involved.

It doesn't even have to be an instance, it could be a hidden continent that only CSRs/Admins could get to. Just a place to hold events without getting harassed. That's all I want, no battlegrounds, instanced combat, minigames or anything. Simply a walled off area to hold events without harassment or interfering with the main game world combat.

Can't get much more clear than that.