Encouraging Teamwork in PS2 - Page 3

Trolltaxi · 2011-10-30, 10:43 AM

You won't get real teamwork just because you remove stats, esp. K/D.

Teamwork means training, means a lot of time spent together, means tactics and procedures, means good leadership and coordination.

You won't instantly get these as soon as they remove stats. You'll get teamwork with your outfit. Most players need k/d, let them have it! I personally always focused on my assist/death (at least that was positive), and didn't care if anyone came with his uber k/d. (That meant either a spawncamper or a reaverwhore most of the times anyways.)

Killwhores won firefights, but AMS-drivers won the battle, and good leadership won the continent. That's what counts.

Raka Maru · 2011-10-30, 01:30 PM

Build the mechanics. People will use them. Don't force it.

Even RPG's allow any class to do their quests solo, but players learn quickly that teamwork is much better. What sucks is if your random team causes you grief. Thus, forced team play is a recipe for bad experiences. This has been seen over and over.

Xyntech · 2011-10-30, 03:54 PM

Yeah, I never want to force team work, I just want solo play to be fun and team play to be even more fun, with a lot of mechanics to invite players to give team play a try. They may not realize that team play can be more fun than solo. Lets educate some noobs.

DviddLeff · 2011-10-30, 04:59 PM

Its the times where the solo players see what can be accomplished with a bit of teamwork that will win them over; seeing a tank column or organised gal drops cutting through the enemy will show them how much more effective they can be if they join an outfit.

The solo zerg is certainly powerful, but nothing compared to the same number of coordinated troops.

EASyEightyEight · 2011-10-30, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by DviddLeff

Its the times where the solo players see what can be accomplished with a bit of teamwork that will win them over; seeing a tank column or organised gal drops cutting through the enemy will show them how much more effective they can be if they join an outfit.

The solo zerg is certainly powerful, but nothing compared to the same number of coordinated troops.

Not to mention how ****ing cool/intimidating it looks. Really, that's the first bit that gets them, not its effectiveness. They're not paying too close attention to how destructive a column can be.

HELLFISH88 · 2011-10-30, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by Mirror

What makes you think that DT are going VS in PS2? We are yet to decide.

Well then. You and I should have a drink Friend.

SKYeXile · 2011-10-30, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by Mirror

What makes you think that DT are going VS in PS2? We are yet to decide.

Knew you guys were not homo enough to stay VS.

Bravix · 2011-10-30, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by SKYeXile

Knew you guys were not homo enough to stay VS.

Sky honey, quit bothering with those Delta Tools and come back to bed

FIREk · 2011-10-30, 07:26 PM

I kind of agree with Malorn, however moving the K/D somewhere less convenient, or removing it utterly, will never encourage teamwork. I would, however, remove one of the mechanics that promote killwhoring for the sole purpose of farming numbers.

In games like CoD and Battlefield, where you've got timelimits, your kills, or K/D is the only way to compare your e-peen to other players' e-peens. You will either play for kills, or to win the map (if it's Battlefield), but at the end of the map there's this huge scoreboard that shows whose e-peen is the longest/thickest. :P
In PlanetSide, however, there's so much more that you can do, however, and the e-peen measurement system should be centered around what you did for your faction, not what you did for yourself.

What could be used to measure your performance instead of K/D, though? The answer may seem obvious (territory gained, resources gathered), but this is excruciatingly non-trivial. If you used territory and resources for measurement, a good player playing on the losing empire's side will be told his performance is bad. This would be both unfair and would lead to empire hopping, on an alt account for instance.
So what can be used as a team-oriented e-peen meter? I don't know. But every FPS needs one, even if the K/D meter sucks for a game like PlanetSide.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but was the "session stats indicator" added post-launch? I haven't played PS1 seriously in many years, but I have this memory of the Outcasters Teamspeak chatter degenerating to "my K/D is X/Y" soon after session stats were either implemented or after they gained popularity. That's around the time when some of my fav outfitmates turned into solo Reaverwhores, too... I think the Werner NC started farming tubes instead of blowing them around that time, as well... :P

Bravix · 2011-10-30, 07:33 PM

I like BF3's version. It shows Kills and deaths, but points are what put you in first and its a lot easier to get first by helping the team as opposed to being a kill-whore.

2coolforu · 2011-10-30, 07:43 PM

The only true way to create teamwork is to force people to depend on others. One man MBT's is the worst thing you can do, for such a centrepiece of battles to be mostly solo controlled is a crippling blow to cooperation.

The reason Planetside had such a good playerbase was due to the fact it was impossible to get very far on your own, especially at the start.

Bags · 2011-10-30, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by Bravix

I like BF3's version. It shows Kills and deaths, but points are what put you in first and its a lot easier to get first by helping the team as opposed to being a kill-whore.

No, it's a lot easier to get points for being a kill whore since they're worth as much as an entire objective.

EASyEightyEight · 2011-10-30, 08:06 PM

Originally Posted by 2coolforu

The only true way to create teamwork is to force people to depend on others. One man MBT's is the worst thing you can do, for such a centrepiece of battles to be mostly solo controlled is a crippling blow to cooperation.

The reason Planetside had such a good playerbase was due to the fact it was impossible to get very far on your own, especially at the start.

It will still be that way. A tank with a dedicated gunner and a dedicated driver > a tank with a single dedicated driver and gunner. One can focus on evasion and not running into things, the other shoots. The solo guy doesn't get that luxury and has to manage it all himself. The tank is still effective, but not 100% so.

Raymac · 2011-10-30, 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by 2coolforu

One man MBT's is the worst thing you can do, for such a centrepiece of battles to be mostly solo controlled is a crippling blow to cooperation.

Pretty sure the MBTs have 2 seats, so the sky is not falling.

Raka Maru · 2011-10-31, 02:45 AM

There will never be a "time limit" so what's the need of a "victory screen"???

Everyone knows if that area is all red then the TR were there.