End Game: Pros and Cons

[texico]

Originally Posted by Higby

What do you guys think of the idea of a weekend type event like that? During the week it's your standard persistent PlanetSide experience, during the weekend there are win conditions and you can sort of play "matches" which reset when someone "wins" or at midnight or something?

Maybe there are different servers you can play on that are set up like that?

NOTE: I have no idea if that'd work from our point of view, I'd have to think about it, so please consider this just me contributing to the conversation rather than an actual idea about something being added to the game.

I wouldn't mind the idea of having separate servers that have win conditions, however, my biggest concern would be whether it drags players away from the main game. It'd probably be great when PS2 is at the stage where multiple servers are fully filled, so you wouldn't have to worry about players moving to end-game servers resulting in smaller fights on the persistent servers.

If you had servers like that, that does provide something fresh and a little bit different, which could be cool You could have all kinds of events and stuff that take place over the course of a day. But yeah, you'd probably find the biggest opposition to that from this crowd would be whether it steals players away from the main game.

[Duddy]

Originally Posted by Higby

What do you guys think of the idea of a weekend type event like that? During the week it's your standard persistent PlanetSide experience, during the weekend there are win conditions and you can sort of play "matches" which reset when someone "wins" or at midnight or something?

Maybe there are different servers you can play on that are set up like that?

NOTE: I have no idea if that'd work from our point of view, I'd have to think about it, so please consider this just me contributing to the conversation rather than an actual idea about something being added to the game.

Provided that these win conditions are tied to an event that exists alongside, and not directly tied into, the core gameplay then I'd be ok with that.

Events like the monolith were a fun distraction, however I'd advise against every weekend. What happens to the poor souls who could only play at the weekends? Do they only get to play those events?

[Synapses]

Originally Posted by Higby

What do you guys think of the idea of a weekend type event like that? During the week it's your standard persistent PlanetSide experience, during the weekend there are win conditions and you can sort of play "matches" which reset when someone "wins" or at midnight or something?

Maybe there are different servers you can play on that are set up like that?

NOTE: I have no idea if that'd work from our point of view, I'd have to think about it, so please consider this just me contributing to the conversation rather than an actual idea about something being added to the game.

Higgs one thing you guys could try is a "campaign" server for this idea. Where the map DOES reset but possibly not for months at a time, when someone manages to control all territory or whatever win conditions you set up. WWII Online (the only thing even CLOSE to planetside) uses it. It works good for them, but I prefer my planetside 1 style. But its something you guys could try out.

[Graywolves]

Originally Posted by Higby

What do you guys think of the idea of a weekend type event like that? During the week it's your standard persistent PlanetSide experience, during the weekend there are win conditions and you can sort of play "matches" which reset when someone "wins" or at midnight or something?

Maybe there are different servers you can play on that are set up like that?

NOTE: I have no idea if that'd work from our point of view, I'd have to think about it, so please consider this just me contributing to the conversation rather than an actual idea about something being added to the game.

The only "Victory Condition" I can see working without breaking the persistance is if you accumulate a faction's score and by the end of an allotted time the score is recorded then reset with proper benefits or rewards released.

Anything that that broke the persistence of PS2 would (imho) ruin one of the major selling points of the game. Personally.

-edit- arena/sport matches seperate from the core game maybe?

[Xaine]

Originally Posted by Higby

What do you guys think of the idea of a weekend type event like that? During the week it's your standard persistent PlanetSide experience, during the weekend there are win conditions and you can sort of play "matches" which reset when someone "wins" or at midnight or something?

Maybe there are different servers you can play on that are set up like that?

NOTE: I have no idea if that'd work from our point of view, I'd have to think about it, so please consider this just me contributing to the conversation rather than an actual idea about something being added to the game.

I think i can see your esports nature coming through there Matt. :P


An event lasting a weekend where three empires just go at it on one cont. or something would be awesome, i think.

I think it would have to be separate to the 'main' game world. Have it on a different server or something. I'm sure the outfits would join up to compete for bragging rights.

You could turn it into esport matches with ??? vs ??? vs ??? on maps, with battles that last 3/4 hours. That would be amazing to watch and keep up with.

I really like the idea.

[Synapses]

Originally Posted by Xaine

I think i can see your esports nature coming through there Matt. :P


An event lasting a weekend where three empires just go at it on one cont. or something would be awesome, i think.

I think it would have to be separate to the 'main' game world. Have it on a different server or something. I'm sure the outfits would join up to compete for bragging rights.

You could turn it into esport matches with ??? vs ??? vs ??? on maps, with battles that last 3/4 hours. That would be amazing to watch and keep up with.

I really like the idea.

Yeah they could really probably have another server thats like "The Event Server" that only comes up during event times for stuff like this, or just have a different "instance" on the current server that basically hides everything that would be normally going on so its only the event?

Who knows. Lots of possible ways to do it.

WWII Online also does this once there map resets, there is like a 3 day break before it resets and they do events in that time frame on the current map, but have it set up so it basically loads a different set of rules or locks to a certain location IE, they did an "Intermission" between resets were it was a re-do of pearl harbor where the devs spent a few hours in destroyers and different navy ships, while the players piloted bombers to try and sink there ships. Made for some pretty cool stuff, especially because the developers were the ones shooting us down and then talking smack in whispers lol.

[Higby]

Originally Posted by Xaine

An event lasting a weekend where three empires just go at it on one cont. or something would be awesome, i think.

I think it would have to be separate to the 'main' game world. Have it on a different server or something. I'm sure the outfits would join up to compete for bragging rights.

Yeah, it's something I've thought about from time-to-time. We have talked about "tournament mode", which would be something like an instanced battlegrounds where you could have 20v20, 50v50, 100v100 matches with a clear victory condition so you could have an outfit battle, or fight against rivals on your same empire from different servers, whatever. The worry has always been pulling people out of the primary game mode which many think should be sacrosanct. The very nature of a fiercely competitive game without a victory condition is a conundrum I've been wrestling with since starting on this project, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

[Bags]

Originally Posted by Higby

Yeah, it's something I've thought about from time-to-time. We have talked about "tournament mode", which would be something like an instanced battlegrounds where you could have 20v20, 50v50, 100v100 matches with a clear victory condition so you could have an outfit battle, or fight against rivals on your same empire from different servers, whatever. The worry has always been pulling people out of the primary game mode which many think should be sacrosanct. The very nature of a fiercely competitive game without a victory condition is a conundrum I've been wrestling with since starting on this project, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

\
Anything that pulls people away from the main fights on a regular basis should be thrown out immediately.

But I wouldn't be completely opposed to bi/tri/monthly outfit olympics or something. Just don't do weekly population killing events imo.

We also don;'t want the game to turn into WoW where PVPers and PVErs hate each other (here it would be normal PVPers vs OVOers)

[Death2All]

Originally Posted by Bags

Anything that pulls people away from the main fights on a regular basis should be thrown out immediately.

But I wouldn't be completely opposed to bi/tri/monthly outfit olympics or something. Just don't do weekly population killing events imo.

I'm down for that.


An event takes place every few months, similar to outfit wars where people compete for...whatever.


There's no need to have such an event take place every weekend though, that pulls too many people away from the game, and it'd probably be a headache to organize every weekend.

[Xaine]

Originally Posted by Higby

Yeah, it's something I've thought about from time-to-time. We have talked about "tournament mode", which would be something like an instanced battlegrounds where you could have 20v20, 50v50, 100v100 matches with a clear victory condition so you could have an outfit battle, or fight against rivals on your same empire from different servers, whatever. The worry has always been pulling people out of the primary game mode which many think should be sacrosanct. The very nature of a fiercely competitive game without a victory condition is a conundrum I've been wrestling with since starting on this project, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

I think it sounds good. Again, nothing in the competitive scene of e-sports really has anything larger than 30v30. Planetside could go way beyond that number. It would be very cool seeing a team assaulting a base, 5 squads all working together.

Pulling people out of the main game is a valid concern. So perhaps make it so this Tournament server is only available one or two weekends a month. Maybe only in the evenings for a few hours.

If an outfit wins they could gain some aesthetic changes to their guns/armour/tanks/planes.

I could see it being something people talk in game all the time. Inter-outfit rivalries could finally be let out to decide who was the best.

I think it really has merit.

As for the winning condition. I think there should maybe be something you get after gaining control of a continent. Something small, like an exp boost for everyone for the next hour. Or access to the other empires stuff (obviously the reward can be adjusted for how often you actually take an entire continent)

[Shogun]

Originally Posted by Higby

, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

maybe if those small victorys give some benefit for a set amount of time it would help? maybe the ps2 website gets 3 layouts and the site will wear the skin of the faction that got the most victorys in the last 24 hours. would certainly be cool and make the winners proud

or some visible benefits ingame that the winner can wield for a day. that would give more of a rewarding feeling than ressources alone. like some extravagant flashy colorpattern or special taunt-emotes.

[Graywolves]

Originally Posted by Higby

Yeah, it's something I've thought about from time-to-time. We have talked about "tournament mode", which would be something like an instanced battlegrounds where you could have 20v20, 50v50, 100v100 matches with a clear victory condition so you could have an outfit battle, or fight against rivals on your same empire from different servers, whatever. The worry has always been pulling people out of the primary game mode which many think should be sacrosanct. The very nature of a fiercely competitive game without a victory condition is a conundrum I've been wrestling with since starting on this project, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

When I first thought of the possibility of eSports within PS2 I got this idea of there basically being the core game and the "Sports" games that occur maybe once a week or a month and was completley optional. It would be like an arena or tournament within the game. Promote the eSport, anounce the winners in-game, maybe have TV's in some foothold lobbies that showed highlights. When a tournament was won something like "Graywolves' team of the Terran Republic has won the Auraxis Sports!" would appear in message box's globally.

Then when in the core game people would see recognized faces from the eSport games and be like "Oh I've seen this guy play on twitch.tv/ ran into him in the arena games, he's really good." Or "I Keep seeing this guy in tourny and constantly stomping him!"

[SUBARU]

Originally Posted by Higby

Yeah, it's something I've thought about from time-to-time. We have talked about "tournament mode", which would be something like an instanced battlegrounds where you could have 20v20, 50v50, 100v100 matches with a clear victory condition so you could have an outfit battle, or fight against rivals on your same empire from different servers, whatever. The worry has always been pulling people out of the primary game mode which many think should be sacrosanct. The very nature of a fiercely competitive game without a victory condition is a conundrum I've been wrestling with since starting on this project, it usually comes down to having to rely on "smaller" victory moments.

Then why did you take out the sanctuary? If we have the sancturay back and no permanent foot hold on continents we could have continent conquered and there is you wins.Stop changing PS1 before you look at what you had

[basti]

Given the new layout of the continents, Victory conditions are quite simple actually.

Leave everything as it is, but make those Footholds capturable. Means, in theory, you could capture a continent, just like back in the days. But it would be quite hard i assume, and you cant even begin to attack those footholds unless you got all surrounding territory, as well as the owner of the foothold has just this one base.


PRos: Continents could shift. Instead of allways coming from the same side of a continent, you could now end up attacking from a different direction, making those battles a whole lot mroe interresting

Cons: Dunno. Would need to think fully about the idea, but im to damn lazy atm.

[TheBiscuit]

Originally Posted by basti

Given the new layout of the continents, Victory conditions are quite simple actually.

Leave everything as it is, but make those Footholds capturable. Means, in theory, you could capture a continent, just like back in the days. But it would be quite hard i assume, and you cant even begin to attack those footholds unless you got all surrounding territory, as well as the owner of the foothold has just this one base.


PRos: Continents could shift. Instead of allways coming from the same side of a continent, you could now end up attacking from a different direction, making those battles a whole lot mroe interresting

Cons: Dunno. Would need to think fully about the idea, but im to damn lazy atm.

This, all this game needs for end game as far as I'm concerned is the ability to win a continent and zero base an empire/both empires.

Unfortunately at the launch state with no sanctuaries, this is effectively impossible. Also the one big con of the idea is that with only 3 continents, it makes it far too easy for an empire to actually be zero based, it should be more challenging. In PS1 with 10 conts it was rare that an empire could be zeroed at prime time (overnight ghosting doesn't count too much!)

I'm racking my brains to think of a way that empires could lose all their territory, but it still be possible for them to get back in and not lock players out for more than a few mins to organise a raid and get some territory back, without a sanctuary I just can't think of one. If sanctuaries did come back but at all times the main bases on each continent could always be spawned at, I think it would have huge advantages in terms of allowing outfits to organise and allowing a "victory" of zero basing, without the negatives of really slowing down time to enter combat

As a side note having monthly empire winners that would get some kind of resource boost/station cash, and giving the losers an xp boost sounds like a good idea, but I don't think its strong enough to stand alone.