Command - Page 3

KayOneElRoy · 2011-02-07, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by LesserShade

Here's an idea for starters. Don't give win buttons (OS) away as rewards for raising command rank.

Agreed. I don't think the OS strikes are a necessary tool for commanders (or anyone for that matter). First of all, there are plenty of ways of dealing with a situation where an OS might be used. Secondly it is counterproductive to teamwork.

To me it seems like an after thought gadget they added for command rank. Thinking about it, I feel command rank itself was mostly an after thought in the first game. It could have been implemented in so many different ways. I believe everything command rank could offer in PS:N should be essential tools for teamwork, coordination, communication, and information. Let the battle rank handle the EMP and OS (if they even are included).

Originally Posted by Bags

It's currently a lot more lucrative to just farm than to cap bases. Highly contested base caps need to be at least 5 - 10x more BEP.

This is something that really bothered me in the few months i played Planetside. You could be struggling to cap a base for and hour and a half and get hardly any exp, while most everyone else just farmed for kills. Ughh, I'm just thinking of the interlink facilities (If I remember correctly, these ones took forever to take).

Bags · 2011-02-07, 06:38 PM

Yeah, when faced with the choice of:

1.) Receiving 2250 BEP for a cap after being farmed for an hour
2.) Fighting somewhere else in a tower, or a base farm of your own, getting 200-500xp/kill

It's not hard to figure out what most people choose.

basti · 2011-02-10, 11:52 AM

I agree, BEP for base caps need to be worth it.

And OS, well, they were fine a long long time, before like 50% of the players got CR5. Back in the day, OSes were used as a last option, and mostly were pretty useless if not combined with a push. OSing a enemy AMS in your CY isnt helping if you dont take the CY after that.
It was fine in the past, and to make sure that such a situation never occurs again it would be indeed useful to have your cep degenerate, slowly. But there is a very thin line between a right and wrong here. If they degenerate to slow, the effect is lost. If they degenerate to fast, a few will hold onto the SL positions and everyone else will have a very hard time ever reaching CR5.

Canaris · 2011-02-10, 12:00 PM

quick question, some portion of the game I've lost due to brain abuse

Can you use the OS if your not the squad leader in original PS?
Just wondering if a minimum req of team mates needed in your squad or platoon would be a good idea before the OS can be used?

DviddLeff · 2011-02-10, 12:00 PM

The rewards you get for leading should help you to lead, but they shouldn't be required to lead successfully.

If a leader is shit for whatever reason (be it not choosing good targets, misusing command tools, being a dick, etc), people wont join their squad if someone else can do the job better. That way the best leaders will naturally lead.

It is a problem for new and upcoming leaders, but if they are good enough they should have little problem.

In my PUP I have a new squad sergeant role in a squad, who also gets a slice of the CEP pie when it is awarded.

https://sites.google.com/site/planet...mmand-overhaul

Aractain · 2011-02-10, 12:02 PM

I don't like command stuff personally. But it is a core peice of the game for all players (who is leading us and what are they telling us to do).

I've seen loads of suggested systems and i really like the simple ones. They usually focus on providing direction/info to the common grunt like cont targets/base targets/waypoints etc.

Theres always that problem at the top though, voting people into command means being able to abuse the system. No limitations (like only one vote per outfit) really work well and can easily be bypassed.

Has anyone ever come up with a system where they can get a single commander of a continent reliably?

Firefly · 2011-02-10, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by Canaris

Can you use the OS if your not the squad leader in original PS?

Yes. You don't even have to be in a squad. You just need to be of the appropriate Command Rank, and equipped with a CUD.

Canaris · 2011-02-10, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by Firefly

Yes. You don't even have to be in a squad. You just need to be of the appropriate Command Rank, and equipped with a CUD.

Well then maybe if PSN is going to have OS, by limiting it to SL or PL might be a good way to limit spam?

DviddLeff · 2011-02-10, 04:20 PM

Wouldn't work; you'd just get people switching SL when an OS target presents itself.

Make cr have to be both earned and have cert points spent on it. Make it decay at a slow rate. And do as you said and only allow squad leaders to use whatever tools there are.

Firefly · 2011-02-10, 04:22 PM

Spamming orbital strikes is not a problem. Spamming chat is - command chat, globals, and OSes are not synonymous.

klu · 2011-02-10, 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

I would personally like to see CEP and command ranks ditched entirely. In its place, a more fluid system with a simple mechanic.. Players choosing their commanders. Players would choose their squad leader. Squad leaders would choose their platoon leader. Platoon leaders would choose battalion leader, etc, and the more players you had under your command, the more access to command tools and chats you receive.

this

some other ideas i really like that were already posted, more chat filter options beyond a simple 'ignore in all channels'. also command tools (including /c, cont/global all) requiring cert points could go a long way in separating the leaders from the power-levelers.

CutterJohn · 2011-02-11, 03:12 AM

Originally Posted by Aractain

Has anyone ever come up with a system where they can get a single commander of a continent reliably?

It would work fine if the commander was chosen by popular consent. Whoever has the most people under his command on the continent is the continent commander. If he does a piss poor job, or is making choices the masses don't want, he will lose people and another will take his place.

The thing to remember is this is a game. People don't really want to be ordered around to do things they don't want to be doing. A good commander will as such have to remember this, and balance the players immediate gratification with a nights success. The tactically sound decision is not necessarily the fun one.

Aractain · 2011-02-11, 04:22 AM

Indeed. Your idea does make the most sense, similar to customers 'voting with their dollars'.

Specifically you don't want all the grunts having to pick someone nor do you want people to grind out cep (oh yeah guys I can totally command I sat afk in a base while squad leader for a while!) to command or influence the 'vote'. The continent wide forces allow a large sample which marginalises the 'huge outfit' situation a bit.

What about solo players though? There IS going to be a lot of them - do they count or is it only the more organised who can 'choose'? Which does make sense.

Jonny · 2011-02-11, 09:05 AM

Sounds like a sound idea, CutterJohn. This system sounds best where people can vote to choose their commander, and they could vote when they wanted.

Any bad leader could then just slip out of that position by people not voting for him again. (if only we had this in politics)

If he played well with the team, he may be voted in again etc.

The idea of him laying down attack areas to give a better xp reward sounds good too, or he may have no real control. This would obviously have to be linked to an enemy objective so it couldn't be farmed.

Sorry if I just reiterated your point, but I like it.

Firefly · 2011-02-11, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

It would work fine if the commander was chosen by popular consent. Whoever has the most people under his command on the continent is the continent commander. If he does a piss poor job, or is making choices the masses don't want, he will lose people and another will take his place.

The thing to remember is this is a game. People don't really want to be ordered around to do things they don't want to be doing. A good commander will as such have to remember this, and balance the players immediate gratification with a nights success. The tactically sound decision is not necessarily the fun one.

You forget one thing - most of the people in this game are Americans (except on Werner). Americans like to vote in a fucking idiot, and then complain about the government they get. They can't even get it right when given multiple chances. I believe in democracy, I shed my blood sweat and tears for this democracy. But in the end, I believe in the saying "We only get the government we deserve/vote for". When you allow the public access to control over its own fate, trust in the public to fuck shit up for everyone. It doesn't just apply in real life. Intelligence is not required in this game, nor is common sense. Popular doesn't mean intelligent. Nor does it mean successful. Just because you have CR5 doesn't mean you're a general, nor does it even begin to suggest that you're halfway competent and qualified to be a general. People seem to forget that.

Thing is, this is a video game, it's not the Army. Nobody made you enlist. Nobody made you sign a contract and require you to obey orders. You're paying money to have fun. When some asshole who took a summer vacation at a Boy Scout campsite decides you're going to a place where you're going to get steam-rolled, that's not fun. And then they get all whiny and butt-hurt when people decide they think your plan was utter shit. They do stupid shit like start using global chat to prosecute some vendetta.

CR5s might - MIGHT - agree to call a primary in their command chat. A portion of the time, it just involves one or two outfits and their plethora of CR5s overruling everyone else and calling a target. It's up to the average player to decide what to do. If you agree, go play with the zerg. If you don't, play however you damned well want. My advice for anyone who wants to play a coordinated game: find a squad of like-minded people, or find an outfit that meets your playstyle.

Outfits make this game, not CR5s. CR5 is just a virtual rank in a virtual videogame. The day someone earns a paycheck as a CR5 will be the day it means more than a sum total of 1) squirt of piss, 2) global harassment, and 3) orbital strikes.

The end.