7/21/2012 Tech Test Stream in progress - Page 4

BlueSkies · 2012-07-21, 08:01 PM

long TTK just rewards stupidity. walk into an ambush, you deserve to die, period

Bags · 2012-07-21, 08:04 PM

Originally Posted by BlueSkies

long TTK just rewards stupidity. walk into an ambush, you deserve to die, period

How does it reward stupidity? If you die to someone you get the jump on you're obviously worse.

BlueSkies · 2012-07-21, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by Bags

How does it reward stupidity? If you die to someone you get the jump on you're obviously worse.

That is true regardless of TTK, just less so with long TTK.

How does it reward stupidity? Let me rephrase and see if you understand. A short TTK is less forgiving of dumb choices, like casually running into a hallway you should know will be camped.

Short TTK in above scenario = you're probably dead
Long TTK in above scenario = you're probably safe

Littleman · 2012-07-21, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by Bags

How does it reward stupidity? If you die to someone you get the jump on you're obviously worse.

When we're talking longer TTK's, we're talking massive imbalances in weaponry. HA were clearly superior to MA in just about every way. You very much could live long enough running from cover to cover, recovering when needed, until you were in range for your HA. It was too freaking easy.

My gun WILL NOT hit harder simply because I want it to. The MA were weak for all intents and purposes. If your sorry ass has your back to me and you're unaware of my presence, it shouldn't be up for debate: you die.

Ever wonder why newbs had such a hard time getting into PS1? Part of it very much was the bull-$#!% of dying in situations where logic dictates one should have won. HA was king in PS1 for a reason: it had the fastest TTK. I pretty much quit PS1 when I shoved my cycler up someone's ass, pinning them into a corner, and unloading and STILL dying to their jackhammer. Yeah, nothing involving skill there, just bull-$#!%.

When every weapon has a low TTK, this disparity isn't so jarringly obvious. I'd like my newbs to enjoy their experience without being forced into HA to kill anything. In a timely manner even. I remember actually getting into MA fights, and more often than not I could count out the seconds while pelting away at someone. That's rather absurd.

HA in this iteration will likely be more about the quantity of people one can kill before reloading, as opposed to simply killing them faster.

ADADADADAD while maintaining your cross-hairs on your opponent might be called skill, but it isn't the type of "skill" most people enjoy in today's gaming market. In my opinion, it looked stupid in PS1, and will look even dumber in PS2.

Masterr · 2012-07-21, 08:26 PM

VOD of stream please.

sylphaen · 2012-07-21, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by Littleman

When we're talking longer TTK's, we're talking massive imbalances in weaponry.

When TTK is instant on all weapons, you use whichever weapon has the highest ROF and best accuracy. No balance works need to be done.

How balanced is that when the whole concept of balancing disappears ? Imbalanced ?

What kind of weapon diversity can you hope for ?

Badjuju · 2012-07-21, 08:33 PM

If TTK is too low, bullet spam and random luck rewards people to easily. If TTK is too high, then numbers tend to be more important than skill. I think it looks pretty good where it is, possibly a tad higher. Wont be able to judge till we actually play.

The Degenatron · 2012-07-21, 08:53 PM

In every single gameplay video I've seen (and I'm pretty sure I've seen them all), Planetside 2 looks insanely fun.

If you can't have fun playing this game regardless of TTK, then they should just go ahead and pull the plug because you're in a persistent vegetative state.

If you can't live without rediculously high TTKs, then I've got GREAT news for you: They are keeping Planetside 1 running, so you can get all of the long, drawn-out, ADADAD gun fights your little heart desires.

Also, I'd just like to say that "High TTK" isn't exactly "The Oldschool Way". Ever have a guy run you down with an Egon, hit you with a crossbow from across the map, or had a Tau cannon zap you THROUGH THE WALL in Half-Life Deathmatch? Talk about low TTK - HLDM cornered the market on it and is still, to this very day, the absolute best deathmatch game ever, bar NONE. So don't go acting like high TTKs make FPSs better, because they don't.

Chrispin · 2012-07-21, 08:56 PM

I think we need a middle ground between the TTK in PS2 right now and the PS1 TTK. Extra headshot damage might be to blame here, but I think during beta that will have to be adjusted to balance for the high fire rate of TR weapons. Also, I would love for shields to absorb less damage than your health to make medics important. Right now it looks like the other way around.

BTW, someone please upload the stream recording and link us!

JawsOfLife · 2012-07-21, 08:59 PM

I uploaded the part I saw, and edited some of the early stuttering. Enjoy! I got about 40 minutes of it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEmtn...ature=youtu.be

rTekku · 2012-07-21, 09:03 PM

My footage is currently uploading/processing. Got about 50 mins.

Flaropri · 2012-07-21, 09:09 PM

Thanks rTekku.

Littleman · 2012-07-21, 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by sylphaen

When TTK is instant on all weapons, you use whichever weapon has the highest ROF and best accuracy. No balance works need to be done.

How balanced is that when the whole concept of balancing disappears ? Imbalanced ?

What kind of weapon diversity can you hope for ?

Oh, I'm not asking for instant TTK's. In CoD, the difference between assault rifles, SMG's, and handguns was essentially ADS zoom and movement speed.

But the TTK's in PS1 were simply too long, and actually, a good part of that wasn't the weapons themselves, but the rexo buff when surgile was the bread and butter of the NC war machine. Going from 8 damage mitigation to 10 damage mitigation threw balance way out of whack when it was perfect before. EVERY infantry weapon was balanced around 8 mitigation. 8 mitigation also made rexo a toss up to agile then. Now, everyone just goes rexo if they're ever planning on fighting outside of a closed cockpit vehicle.

I like where PS2's TTK's seem to be at. Maybe a little more hp overall, I would like to see the bar actually move instead of going from full to empty the second the shield drops, but otherwise, I'm pretty happy with current life expectancy, yet this is based on videos. Also note that life spans increase due to inherently iffy but not incredibly CoDtastic weapon accuracy - another way of artificially lengthening TTK, with out actually making anyone more durable.

As I said, HA in this game will likely be built on the volume of people they can kill before reloading, if they need to reload at all, making their real strength sustained fire. The MCG for example may very well pack 300-500 rounds in a single drum and that's all the wielder gets.