"Premium Features" Speculation! - Page 4

SKYeXile · 2012-01-02, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by DeadlyButters

What you guys have got to remember about the f2p side of this game is that, if the f2p side is shit and limits your abilities in the game. Dont expect the servers to be full for more than a month or two because people will just leave. The thing about todays games market is that there is a MOTHERLOAD of other games that people could be playing other than PS2. If PS2 cant get people hooked (with the exception of veterans) through f2p methods then this game will just die i reckon and i dont want that to happen!!

ps I plan to play this game free until I can (hopefully) afford a subscription and this is the same situation i experienced with DCUO. I played for 2 weeks before I just gave up because of how much that game limited the experience (the money limit was a fucking joke).

but you played DCUO, would you have played it if you had to buy it?

CutterJohn · 2012-01-02, 11:26 PM

I'm more curious about what will happen to your character(s) when you drop the subscription. One of the key features I love about f2p models is you get to play on your terms. I would still hop into PS occasionally if it were f2p, but it definitely isn't worth $15 a month to me, so I don't.

So what happens, 6 months or a year after release, when I'm starting to get bored with the game and play it less? Can I no longer access my premium characters? Will I be able to access, but have some artificial level cap?

Sirisian · 2012-01-03, 01:03 AM

Originally Posted by Zulthus

Then log into another account if you wish... at least it slows down empire hoppers.

How does it slow them down? Your argument is kind of weak. I said they can put a timer if they wanted. This is for what you want which is a delay. If I have 3 accounts (or how many I choose) I could just logout then login which would take all of 10 seconds. Remember in Planetside how you could be driving a vehicle crash, restart your computer, then log back in and still be in your vehicle. You're looking at a 10 second switch for the average gamer. If you're seriously going to start to whine about empire hopping you're going to be crying when the game is launched.

Zulthus · 2012-01-03, 01:31 AM

How is my argument weak? They're making it one empire per server per account. Not everyone is going to want multiple accounts to keep track of. There will be less empire hoppers with this system in place. I'm not whining about it either, I said I was glad that they're making the game this way.

Sirisian · 2012-01-03, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by Zulthus

How is my argument weak? They're making it one empire per server per account. Not everyone is going to want multiple accounts to keep track of. There will be less empire hoppers with this system in place. I'm not whining about it either, I said I was glad that they're making the game this way.

It's weak because I disagree that it'll deter empire hopping. I was just saying they'd have a better chance putting it as a subscription only feature of "Can have multiple faction accounts on a server" which allows them to profit. The complexity is how to handle things when a subscription ends, but a huge timer would solve that along with limiting training 1 character per server.

Then again if we have multiple (3) decent servers in the US East with good population counts I personally don't care. I just want to experience all 3 factions. My faction loyalty isn't that strong when it comes to experiencing all the gameplay types and to test which one is the best.

SKYeXile · 2012-01-03, 02:18 AM

Originally Posted by Sirisian

It's weak because I disagree that it'll deter empire hopping. I was just saying they'd have a better chance putting it as a subscription only feature of "Can have multiple faction accounts on a server" which allows them to profit. The complexity is how to handle things when a subscription ends, but a huge timer would solve that along with limiting training 1 character per server.

Then again if we have multiple (3) decent servers in the US East with good population counts I personally don't care. I just want to experience all 3 factions. My faction loyalty isn't that strong when it comes to experiencing all the gameplay types and to test which one is the best.

I thought thats what beta was for?

Well not for me personally though, because i see no other option than vanu.

pscheaters · 2012-01-03, 02:27 AM

Was beta and GM for a game bought that was eventually bought by SOE. They made the commercial decision then to turn a free game into a subscription game. That's ok I guess.

But what is not ok and will get a massive negative reaction from the player community is to start off as a subscription game and then change their mind later and go F2P with microtransactions.

F2P means they are pushing for a cult following in the game with a massive playerbase and revenue income from advertising and microtransactions.

I am somewhat hesitant on whether F2P would work but will hold my tongue till I see what comes out...

CutterJohn · 2012-01-03, 03:14 AM

Originally Posted by Zulthus

How is my argument weak? They're making it one empire per server per account. Not everyone is going to want multiple accounts to keep track of. There will be less empire hoppers with this system in place. I'm not whining about it either, I said I was glad that they're making the game this way.

I specifically asked about this months ago. They said they have no plans to allow more than one empire per account, but also nothing against the idea.

That was, of course, before F2P made the idea of locking accounts moot.

Empire hoppers can be combated by simply encouraging people to hop to the weak empire with benefits. Team balance is in no way a new concept to FPS games.

Originally Posted by LZachariah

Yes, Ailos, I would be very comfortable with that feature being restricted to paying players only. And you know, that would ensure more fidelity-over-time of Outfits, because I think that paying players would be more likely to be in the game long-term, rather than someone who tries the game on a lark and leaves a month later.

Then put the ability to start or join an outfit in the store and charge $5 for it. Now they are paying customers.

People who wish to have a subscription are in no way superior to those who prefer purchasing stuff from an item store.

Figment · 2012-01-03, 06:34 AM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

I'm more curious about what will happen to your character(s) when you drop the subscription. One of the key features I love about f2p models is you get to play on your terms. I would still hop into PS occasionally if it were f2p, but it definitely isn't worth $15 a month to me, so I don't.

So what happens, 6 months or a year after release, when I'm starting to get bored with the game and play it less? Can I no longer access my premium characters? Will I be able to access, but have some artificial level cap?

It could be that, like in World of Tanks where you buy a garage slot to get another tank, you have to buy a character slot for a low amount of money and that from there on it is permanent.

This reverting to other sub-structure is also why I do not expect skill tree limitations, just progression speed differences.

Ailos · 2012-01-03, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

I'm more curious about what will happen to your character(s) when you drop the subscription. One of the key features I love about f2p models is you get to play on your terms. I would still hop into PS occasionally if it were f2p, but it definitely isn't worth $15 a month to me, so I don't.

So what happens, 6 months or a year after release, when I'm starting to get bored with the game and play it less? Can I no longer access my premium characters? Will I be able to access, but have some artificial level cap?

The DCUO website says basically you get downgraded to the second level, as if you've been a previous cash shop customer, and you're only able to access expansion pack content that you've previously purchased through micro transactions.

A most direct translation of this into PS2 terms would mean that unless you've previously purchased chunks of your skill trees, they will no longer be accessible. E.g. let's say that the free accounts are limited to tier 3 skills for all classes. As a subscriber, you've trained your HA to the top of tier 4, and your cavalry driver to tier 2. Upon expiration of your subscription, this model means that your tier 4 HA skills (weapons/sidegrades, etc.) are no longer accessible, but you can still train your cavalry driver stuff to tier 3.

Personally, I hope that wouldn't be the case - that doesn't seem fair to subscribers, and I could see a large number of people in the situation you described. Stuff happens in life sometimes and a game's cash shop should be flexible enough to accommodate. I would prefer that they instead simply let you keep those tier 4 HA skills, although if you wanted to train up to tier 5, you'd still have to buy those from the shop.

Originally Posted by CutterJohn

Then put the ability to start or join an outfit in the store and charge $5 for it. Now they are paying customers.

People who wish to have a subscription are in no way superior to those who prefer purchasing stuff from an item store.

Also a perfectly valid idea.

Having a subscription is a matter of convenience to me, so I wouldn't see 12 transactions for $1.15 on my credit card over the month period. Furthermore, I suspect that the $15/mo spent by subscribers is more than the amount your average cash shop customer would spend on a monthly basis, not necessarily because they don't have the money, but because you only need so many silly hats, voice macros, and locker space (and most of won't be forming outfits once a month either).

So for that reason, those of us that have already committed our minds to go with a subscription option if there is one, want to feel like we're getting our money's worth. We want to give our money to SOE for a job well done, but part of a job well done is us being happy about what we're paying for. It's a little circular logic, but to me at least, it's easier to come to terms with a subscription than a bunch of cash shop items.

I think in the end, this would basically have to come down to the right pricing for cash shop items, especially if the stuff you can buy is skill tiers. Someone who buys their skill tiers from the cash shop should have every right to train them just as fast as a subscriber, and at the end of the month, the amount they spend on buying those blocks of the tree should be slightly above the subscription fee. Somewhere around that point is where it'll be cheaper for a casual player to be a cash shop customer without losing any in-game balance, and with SOE still in a profitable position.

Knightwyvern · 2012-01-03, 01:02 PM

Honestly I find the idea of limiting skills or certs by subscription model to be an abhorrent idea. It may not exactly be pay to win, but in my book it does mean pay to enjoy. The funny thing is, I definitely plan on paying for a subscription, if only to support PS2. IMO a subscription should only be a small monthly stipend of "Station Cash," a few extra character slots, and maybe something like access to Apps pulling API for up to date PS2 info on the go. I don't even want any in game way to identify between subbers and freebies. I think it would cause too much division and grief (figuratively and literally) between players.

As many others have said, give me convenience, but not anything that actually affects me or others in the game itself. And that includes limiting skills.

Hobitt · 2012-01-03, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by Knightwyvern

Honestly I find the idea of limiting skills or certs by subscription model to be an abhorrent idea. It may not exactly be pay to win, but in my book it does mean pay to enjoy. The funny thing is, I definitely plan on paying for a subscription, if only to support PS2. IMO a subscription should only be a small monthly stipend of "Station Cash," a few extra character slots, and maybe something like access to Apps pulling API for up to date PS2 info on the go. I don't even want any in game way to identify between subbers and freebies. I think it would cause too much division and grief (figuratively and literally) between players.

As many others have said, give me convenience, but not anything that actually affects me or others in the game itself. And that includes limiting skills.

Agree on this there shouldn't be any game changing difference between freebies and subbers

Sifer2 · 2012-01-03, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by Hobitt

Agree on this there shouldn't be any game changing difference between freebies and subbers

It's a nice idea but wont happen. It's a business not a charity. Part of being a F2P game is that you create a payer class with extra benefits and a freebie lower class that has to grind more or is gimped in some way. If its not like this at launch its likely to become that way over time if they are not meeting the profit expectations they wanted.

I mean this is SOE were talking about after all. How many games did they out right ruin in an attempt to raise profits? That's why I wish the game was buy to play with everyone on a more even playing field. Something more like Guild Wars did.

SKYeXile · 2012-01-03, 11:42 PM

Originally Posted by Knightwyvern

Honestly I find the idea of limiting skills or certs by subscription model to be an abhorrent idea. It may not exactly be pay to win, but in my book it does mean pay to enjoy. The funny thing is, I definitely plan on paying for a subscription, if only to support PS2. IMO a subscription should only be a small monthly stipend of "Station Cash," a few extra character slots, and maybe something like access to Apps pulling API for up to date PS2 info on the go. I don't even want any in game way to identify between subbers and freebies. I think it would cause too much division and grief (figuratively and literally) between players.

As many others have said, give me convenience, but not anything that actually affects me or others in the game itself. And that includes limiting skills.

Its a sad day when you have to pay to enjoy thing, a sad day indeed...oh wait, no its not...its been like that for centuries....

Figment · 2012-01-04, 06:43 AM

Originally Posted by Ailos

The DCUO website says basically you get downgraded to the second level, as if you've been a previous cash shop customer, and you're only able to access expansion pack content that you've previously purchased through micro transactions.

A most direct translation of this into PS2 terms would mean that unless you've previously purchased chunks of your skill trees, they will no longer be accessible. E.g. let's say that the free accounts are limited to tier 3 skills for all classes. As a subscriber, you've trained your HA to the top of tier 4, and your cavalry driver to tier 2. Upon expiration of your subscription, this model means that your tier 4 HA skills (weapons/sidegrades, etc.) are no longer accessible, but you can still train your cavalry driver stuff to tier 3.

Personally, I hope that wouldn't be the case - that doesn't seem fair to subscribers, and I could see a large number of people in the situation you described. Stuff happens in life sometimes and a game's cash shop should be flexible enough to accommodate. I would prefer that they instead simply let you keep those tier 4 HA skills, although if you wanted to train up to tier 5, you'd still have to buy those from the shop.

I'd like to point out that skills being purchasable would per definition be "pay to win" as they'd get specific combat advantages over others. That is supposed to be a no-no (pay for cosmetics only!). I'd also like to point out that Higby stated that over loooong periods of time you would be able to train all skills (not sure if that also means having access to all certs... hope not). I cannot imagine that on top of getting there slower, your access would be further restricted or in fact reduced. That would definitely feel like a set back, in fact it would probably feel as if SOE is punishing you for stopping to give them money.

Punishing players for stopping to sub in that sense would not make them eager to return to a subscription as they'd feel cheated and forced back into purchasing a subscription.

As for what else you could get for a premium account? How about access to PlanetSide 1?