Copy/Paste - Page 4

Trolltaxi · 2012-03-12, 06:02 PM

Comparing a PS video of a tight HA squad with MCG-s and a video of a sniper BF3 player, than stating that ironsight slows the game is both unfair and silly.

I welcome ironsights in Planetside2 as this will bring a touch of realism into the game. I'm by far not an ARMA fanboy, but playing an FPS feels more visceral when I need to aim down a sight and it blocks my view, I need to stop (even crouch) to get some solid fire stance and have some accuracy, when I feel the recoil, when it is not painfully obvious that my enemy is dead (I mean the XP-spam in my face)...

And if firefights get more organized by that I'm happier. Not sure if it will happen but it would be so nice to see that people don't just clusterfuck swarming ADADADA and circular strafing infront of my sight, but tactically move to cover, those in position cover their mates with fire and so on.

Aurmanite · 2012-03-12, 06:10 PM

I completely agree that no one should be berated or ostracized for their opinions. Part of the reason there was such a negative burst at the start of this thread was due to Marth Koopa/VanuMAXGuy being a scummy fuck in the other thread on this exact topic. I think some people jumped the gun and figured this Arrow fellow is him.

Battlefield was a juggernaut when it first came out. It revolutionized FPS's and set the standard for modern multiplayer FPS games. CoD copied the hell out of Battlefield, and due to the explosion of console shooter popularity (something that didn't exist when 1942 came out), it has taken over.

When it comes down to it, all shooters are generally the same, and saying that they copy each other is basically moot. The goal in all of them is to point and click your mouse at the right spot.

I don't believe that playing a game for 9 years means that you should be unable to look at it objectively. I played Planetside for about 3 years straight, World of Warcraft for 7, and I've dabbled in Ultima Online on and off since 1996. Although I certainly do have my fond memorize of these games, I can still rationally assess them.

Things change. Reskinning Planetside would be a disaster because Planetside wasn't a particularly good shooter. In fact, it was a pretty bad one when all things are said and done. But I loved the hell out of it, played the hell out of it, and can't wait for the next installment.

Death2All · 2012-03-12, 06:13 PM

Originally Posted by Trolltaxi

Comparing a PS video of a tight HA squad with MCG-s and a video of a sniper BF3 player, than stating that ironsight slows the game is both unfair and silly.

I welcome ironsights in Planetside2 as this will bring a touch of realism into the game. I'm by far not an ARMA fanboy, but playing an FPS feels more visceral when I need to aim down a sight and it blocks my view, I need to stop (even crouch) to get some solid fire stance and have some accuracy, when I feel the recoil, when it is not painfully obvious that my enemy is dead (I mean the XP-spam in my face)...

And if firefights get more organized by that I'm happier. Not sure if it will happen but it would be so nice to see that people don't just clusterfuck swarming ADADADA and circular strafing infront of my sight, but tactically move to cover, those in position cover their mates with fire and so on.

I guess this would coincide with the classic realism ≠ fun argument that we see so much on these forums.

Not everyone finds realism as entertaining as others. Personally, I find it to be detrimental to experience. I don't want to play a super realistic game, I want to play something that takes me away from reality for a few hours.

I don't play games so I can go "HOLY SHIT THIS SO FUCKING REALISTIC OH MY GOD SO REAAALLL". I just play them to have a bit of fun and own some nerds a long the way. Realism doesn't enhance the fun aspect for me. I think too many people get confused that if a concept or feature in a game isn't realistic then it's need to be changed ASAP. That's not the case. This is a Sci-Fi shooter afterall where all the soldiers are unable to die. I'd say realism is the least of the games worries.

This wasn't necessarily directed at you, by the way, Trolltaxi. Just people in general who argue that a game has to be realistic to be fun.

NEWSKIS · 2012-03-12, 06:19 PM

Really this comes down to the OP wanting an exact copy of PS1 with better graphics.

Just because it isnt exactly that, doesnt mean it won't be a good or great game. If they did an exact copy you wouldnt get much more than the original PS1 players to play it.

I'm waiting until I try the game to determine whether its good or not.

roguy · 2012-03-12, 06:20 PM

People on these forums act like it's so wrong that we want a game that we've come to know and love for several years to stay relatively the same, and not be bastardized as some kind of CoD/BF rip off in an attempt aid SOE's resurgence into the game market. Some people truly want the game to simply be retextured and then re-released. And there's nothing wrong with that.

No but it's right to tell people to shut up when they don't have a clue. If Planetside 2 is a BF/COD rip off, Planetside 1 riped off ten times as much from Tribes 2.

ArmedZealot · 2012-03-12, 06:21 PM

Originally Posted by DeeTwoEh

I don't play games so I can go "HOLY SHIT THIS SO FUCKING REALISTIC OH MY GOD SO REAAALLL". I just play them to have a bit of fun and own some nerds a long the way. Realism doesn't enhance the fun aspect for me. I think too many people get confused that if a concept or feature in a game isn't realistic then it's need to be changed ASAP. That's not the case. This is a Sci-Fi shooter afterall where all the soldiers are unable to die. I'd say realism is the least of the games worries.

This wasn't necessarily directed at you, by the way, Trolltaxi. Just people in general who argue that a game has to be realistic to be fun.

You can be right in some cases where realism doesn't equal fun. But in this case I think the realism that iron sights may provide do actually add to the fun of things.

I'm still on the fence as far as iron sights go I think. I want the games to be action packed and fun. Games like Counter Strike, Halo, and Tribes:Ascend all didn't have iron sights but have really good gunplay.

In games like BF3 and COD I think the ironsights may remove some of the fun elements as well as add some. They rely on their environment to add all the action but remove the player from it when they scope in and block it all off.

However if I were to take a long shot IRL I'd use iron sights. I think that should be the use of them in PS2. Hip fire in close quarters and iron sights for pot shotting.

Trolltaxi · 2012-03-12, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by DeeTwoEh

I guess this would coincide with the classic realism ≠ fun argument that we see so much on these forums...

I'm not after realism above everything, especially not above fun! It really is a sci-fi shooter after all!

But the mess that usually happened in a contested base or even a tower was less than enjoyable. You couldn't score a hit without getting grief for shooting the back of your fellow players who hopped into your line of fire. I could live with that, really!

And those hating ironsight, come to the TR, rumour (devs) say that we will have a slightly better hip accuracy!

No need to aim down the sight, just spray'n'pray, the TR way!

Death2All · 2012-03-12, 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by roguy

No but it's right to tell people to shut up when they don't have a clue. If Planetside 2 is a BF/COD rip off, Planetside 1 riped off ten times as much from Tribes 2.

"It's not right to berate someone's opinion but let's tell them to shut up when they're wrong!!"

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

You can be right in some cases where realism doesn't equal fun. But in this case I think the realism that iron sights may provide do actually add to the fun of things.

How so? What do ironsights provide entertainment-wise to the player, other than realism? Not trying to sound snappy or anything, I'm just curious from a player that likes ironsights, what fun do they bring for you? (Okay reading further you're still neutral on ironsights but I guess it can still be directed towards anyone who likes ironsights, what do you like about them?)

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

I'm still on the fence as far as iron sights go I think. I want the games to be action packed and fun. Games like Counter Strike, Halo, and Tribes:Ascend all didn't have iron sights but have really good gunplay.

In games like BF3 and COD I think the ironsights may remove some of the fun elements as well as add some. They rely on their environment to add all the action but remove the player from it when they scope in and block it all off.

However if I were to take a long shot IRL I'd use iron sights. I think that should be the use of them in PS2. Hip fire in close quarters and iron sights for pot shotting.

That's one negative aspect of it, one of the reasons I'm not really in favor of iron sights. They obstruct my vision. I also don't like how the entire game boils down to running around...seeing an enemy...bring up your iron sight and killing them.

Of course you don't always have to do this, as we saw in the demo, an enemy got close enough to Higby and he was able to hipfire him down, but it's still the jist of the game. Apart from very close quarters, you're going to be spending the majority of your time firing from your iron sights and I simply don't like that.

Skitrel · 2012-03-12, 06:35 PM

FPS games right now all have similar mechanics because that's what the current quality of FPS games is right now. Look through the history of FPS games, you'll notice them all having similar feels to them for their period.

Why are people ever surprised that shooting a gun in one game has the same look and feel to it as shooting a gun in another game, in their respective generation of games?

As Higby said, AAA games have set the bar there right now, without being on the bar or similar shooting doesn't feel "right". Screen shake, movement wobble, all the various bits and bobs that make you feel immersed and part of the action. This has changed a lot, in small increments, for years and years. No FPS game will drastically rewrite what the current generation of FPS games is doing, they might change it in very small ways, but barely noticable. Over many years however you start to notice those differences. An FPS now feeling considerably different to an FPS 5-15 years prior.

Not meeting the standard, or at least being close to it with it's own idiosyncrasies, would be a huge mistake.

Aurmanite · 2012-03-12, 06:35 PM

Zooming in was Planetside's iron sight equivalent. Was that really less view obstructing?

Ironsights are great for 2 reasons. 1) Because they give you a greater control over where you're firing, and 2) it's harder, but not impossible to hit a target with a tiny dot as things get further away.

The CoF in Planetside actually made aiming easier because it was larger and covered a greater portion of the models.

Death2All · 2012-03-12, 06:36 PM

Originally Posted by Trolltaxi

I'm not after realism above everything, especially not above fun! It really is a sci-fi shooter after all!

I'm glad I heard someone hear that, I was beginning to think everyone is a mindless Realism Zombie.

Originally Posted by Trolltaxi

But the mess that usually happened in a contested base or even a tower was less than enjoyable. You couldn't score a hit without getting grief for shooting the back of your fellow players who hopped into your line of fire. I could live with that, really!

I'd say that was more the fault of poor base/tower/interior designs rather than the aiming system. Everything was way too claustrophobic and chaotic. You didn't have any elbow room to manuver. People would pile up and get in your way, also a fault of the poor hit detection system implemented into the game.

Originally Posted by Trolltaxi

And those hating ironsight, come to the TR, rumour (devs) say that we will have a slightly better hip accuracy!

No need to aim down the sight, just spray'n'pray, the TR way!

I'm really hoping there's some way we can spec our weapons so that we'll never really need to aim down sights unless it's a target from very very long range, in which case that makes sense and you should have to trade your maneuverability for accuracy in that case. Hopefully for all empires anyways, I don't want to wind up in a filthy red uniform because all the other empires have some forced mechanic on them

.

roguy · 2012-03-12, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by DeeTwoEh

"It's not right to berate someone's opinion but let's tell them to shut up when they're wrong!!"

Let me put it this way, how can you consider your opinion to be valid when your reasoning is wrong in the first place?

Wasn't Planetside 1 a bastardised rip off of another popular FPS (Tribes 2)? Yes or no?

On another subject, what's funny (and ironic) is that as much as you "berate" COD or BF3, Planetside 1 innovated on a far dumber, more broken and more controversial mechanic that was later included in both games. Health regen.

XPquant · 2012-03-12, 06:54 PM

I am so tired of seeing ps1 vets and old school pros hide behind this argument solely because they are not good at 'modern' (fun) shooters.

You want to remove firing options and reduce possibilities of death to make it less boring? what? How can you even claim to represent this for any other reason then you want a game made for you that you can win at. SOE isn't copying any game, they are simply making a game for this decade.

There is a reason why planetside is not currently successful and why no one else tried to copy the game, it's archaic and not a fun shooter.

If you want planetside go play it, we all want to play planetside 2.

Arrow · 2012-03-12, 06:58 PM

I dont want a simple reskinning of PS1 at all, sure you can make some logisitical changes spice up the gameplay add things but all in all your looking at 2 different games when it comes to ps1 and ps2.

Aurmanite · 2012-03-12, 07:03 PM

Originally Posted by Arrow

I dont want a simple reskinning of PS1 at all, sure you can make some logisitical changes spice up the gameplay add things but all in all your looking at 2 different games when it comes to ps1 and ps2.

Of course they are.

One was made in 2003.
One is currently being developed in 2012.