Fact: I play BF3, but would rather play PS1 - Page 4

Stardouser · 2012-04-14, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by JHendy

Hell yes. I can't tell you how much I'd love to see that level of interactivity and immersion brought in. It wont happen, not at launch, at least. But it would be fantastic.

I've gotta say. You've thrown me off a little bit with that comment. First you're totally against this type of thing, in any guise. Then you do a U-ey and start describing the sorts of things that would make the 'immersion crowd' want to unbuckle their belts at the mere thought of!

I wondered if you would think I'm being inconsistent. But really, I'm not. I consider things like animations to be the...annoying part...of immersion. It's kind of like...you work 40 hours a week, you get paid for it. The animations are like the foundation, the 40 hours of work. The really good immersion like I just described is the payoff. If we get animations, but nothing beyond that, it's like doing all the work for no payoff.

While I AM against animations, and against screen blurring, and head bobbing while running, at least if there was an ultimate payoff that's REALLY nice, like what I described, it would all be worth it. But as I say, it feels like the immersion we're likely to get is only the hard part...no icing on the cake!

And since I know they aren't likely to give us the icing on the cake, I'd rather skip the bread part of the cake...

Stardouser · 2012-04-14, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by Tialian

I would love that, but you have to be realistic. When PlanetSide came out they made it as immersive as possible with the current technology at that time...so they could definitely improve on a game 10 years later but I doubt they would be able to deliver on all your wants.

At least in the case of interactive cockpits, I'm thinking technology is able to give us that, but people are going to say we have to cater to the casuals. But I don't agree. You see, when I say "interactive cockpit", I mean, 4 or 5 buttons on the cockpit. I am not in any way suggesting that we have a realistic flight sim that has 200 buttons with a 30 button sequence just to start the engines.

JPalmer · 2012-04-14, 03:56 PM

Really? Am I seeing a discussion here based around the statement that Planetside not having vehicle animations makes it a bad game and in the end ruin the game?

headcrab13 · 2012-04-14, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by Malorn

I'm not making the connection between gal drop epic awesome and vehicle enter/exit animations.

You make a good point. What they should add in addition to enter/exit animations is a hotdrop animation where the Galaxy door opens and you dive out face-first towards the planet below.

I would need a change of pants.

Eighm · 2012-04-14, 04:07 PM

Originally Posted by JPalmer

Really? Am I seeing a discussion here based around the statement that Planetside not having vehicle animations makes it a bad game and in the end ruin the game?

I'm going to have to agree with this statement. Higby has said that adding in enter/exit animations would add another six months onto development. That extra six months doesn't likely mesh with their development schedule too well.

I love the enter/exit animations from PS1, but they most definitely are not a make-or-break feature.

ArmedZealot · 2012-04-14, 04:09 PM

Originally Posted by Tialian

No map limits(you got this one down!)

Yup.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Enter/exit vehicle animations (this is IMPORTANT), and internal animations if possible

Not that big of a deal IMO. PS1 had these but they didn't draw the crowds nor keep them.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Travel times (the act of moving to a target in force is a huge rush before the battle)

In PS2 already.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Realistic spawn types (the HART drop pod was my favorite from PS1)

This is what you call realistic? Has it anyway.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Voice macros (these gave soldiers personality both on and off the battlefield)

PS2 is said to have it.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Inventory (you can't carry everything, resources are limited, you must choose what you bring into battle)

Class system.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Vehicle ownership (like having a badass mount that is actually persistent in the world)

Not only do you own it, you buy it too.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Creating objects that persist after death (none of this BS with stuff disappearing after death)

I don't quite get what you mean here. You want wreckage and stuff? Likely wont happen. Not a big issue for me anyways.

Originally Posted by Tialian

Music (the music is what you unintentionally hum to yourself and realize you need to play more of the game)

Don Ferrone

Originally Posted by Tialian

Friendly fire (promotes less spam)

Grief system.

Cool you made a thread about non issues.

headcrab13 · 2012-04-14, 04:10 PM

In response to Tialian, that was an excellent original post and I wholeheartedly agree. You hit on many of the things that really made Planetside special.

I think the devs are right there with you on most of this stuff, but I hope they listen closely to that advice and continue to invest the appropriate amount of time on the little things that make all the difference.

Spoof · 2012-04-14, 04:18 PM

I once made a PS1 video that, sadly, is now lost (unless someone in Renegade Legion remembers it from their forums).

There was a scene where a squad of grunts and maxes boarded a Gal in one swift move, the Gal's nose lifted as the last man jumped in and it rose up into the air with enemy tanks crashing through the gate firing after it. A second Gal directly followed it, afterburners on, and vanu AA missiles streaking up behind them...

But what made it memorable was the boarding animations. The aft gunner was still climbing the cockpit ladder as the aircraft lifted, and side doors still closing as it banked and swung around to make its escape.

Vehicle entry animations are important.

ArmedZealot · 2012-04-14, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by Spoof

I once made a PS1 video that, sadly, is now lost (unless someone in Renegade Legion remembers it from their forums).

There was a scene where a squad of grunts and maxes boarded a Gal in one swift move, the Gal's nose lifted as the last man jumped in and it rose up into the air with enemy tanks crashing through the gate firing after it. A second Gal directly followed it, afterburners on, and vanu AA missiles streaking up behind them...

But what made it memorable was the boarding animations. The aft gunner was still climbing the cockpit ladder as the aircraft lifted, and side doors still closing as it banked and swung around to make its escape.

Vehicle entry animations are important.

how many views did you get on that video?

Spoof · 2012-04-14, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

how many views did you get on that video?

No idea, it was never uploaded to YouTube (which was too primitive back then).

kertvon · 2012-04-14, 04:36 PM

I am in 100% favor of vehicle animations. What is the point of realistic graphics, realistic physics, realistic lighting and clouds, but have... instant teleportation into vehicles??? I could understand if this mechanic added to the original implementation, but it is only a step backwards from what it was. As a pilot in the original, there was nothing quite like crewing up and watching your comrades load up in their respective positions in the liberator or galaxy. Vehicle animations, strict load-in spots, and external position switching are much more than polish, they define the feel of the game. The fact that vehicle animations fit so naturally in the original was a testament to how well defined the pace of the game was. If they were to feel weird in PS2 then the framework of the game has been changed quite drastically.

The devs have said time and time again that PS was ahead of it's time. We are now 10 years after release and nobody has come close to touching Planetside. The immersion, the tactics, the scale(gameplay, and concept), the memories; all of these things add up to what was, and will always be one of the greatest titles ever made. Planetside was literally a stroke of genius and it was only so because SOE was willing to step outside of the norm. The original seemed like such a far cry from parallel FPS titles that it was almost as if the devs said lets make something unlike anything the gaming world has ever seen. Thus far in interviews the majority of the time when the devs are asked about what sets Planetside 2 apart, it has been scale and F2P. that is great an all, but if you were to ask what set the original PS apart, scale would be one part of a laundry list of differences. The fact that list is possibly smaller for PS2 than the original is disconcerting. If F2P is shaping this game and trimming off all the planetside, I for one would rather pay a sub and have it be a worthy descendant of the original.

In essence, if I cooked amazing Italian food and I was trying to get a prospect who likes Mexican food to try it, I am not going to go throwing re-fried beans in my lasagna in hopes it makes him like it...

Let's just hope the beta makes us all eat our words.

tl;dr version:
I am not a fan of no vehicle animations.

Edit: It won't ruin the game by any means, but I don't see why they were removed in the first place.

ArmedZealot · 2012-04-14, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by Spoof

No idea, it was never uploaded to YouTube (which was too primitive back then).

right. well, this video......

Has the most hits for a planetside video. Vehicle entry had a 5 second scene in a approx 2 and a half minute video. This video primarily showed flight and vehicle formations, battles, maps/ continents. If vehicle animations were so important, this video would have put more of it somewhere.

They haven't been removed. Just haven't been put in for beta.

Tialian · 2012-04-14, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

And since I know they aren't likely to give us the icing on the cake, I'd rather skip the bread part of the cake...

Funny you mention that, I actually don't care for the icing and prefer to leave it on the plate. The cake is moist and fluffy, the icing is just sugary overly sweet crap.

Seems to hold true for games as well

Figment · 2012-04-14, 04:44 PM

I saw some comments about BF3 not having certain stuff and the players not being bothered about it - supposedly.

Do they have any idea what the difference is? How many games have they played where they DID enter the vehicle through an animation?

Seeing 100 people enter a vehicle at the command of an outfit leader for one of those movies does give you goose bumps. The animation literally connects the infantry experience to the vehicle experience as being part of something bigger. It feels more real, more important, more meaningful.

Having constraints like specific boarding points make for a more realistic experience, where you forget you are in a game. While when I see a loopzook video about a Battlefield game and people jumping into flying vehicles by touching their exhausts or sides, I feel immediately reminded and disappointed that this is just a game.

Look at PS outfit videos, how many videos have you seen that started with an outfit all moving into their vehicles at once, as a unit, as if they were part of some highly disciplined army?

It definitely adds to immersion.

And yes, as mentioned before, it has a positive effect on gameplay itself when switching between infantry and vehicle types (getting a second life bonus type thing) by creating a delay and warm up time.

Some games have this animation delay as well when switching between different vehicle seats within the vehicle.

Tialian · 2012-04-14, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

right. well, this video......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Twyfcncurg

Has the most hits for a planetside video. Vehicle entry had a 5 second scene in a approx 2 and a half minute video. This video primarily showed flight and vehicle formations, battles, maps/ continents. If vehicle animations were so important, this video would have put more of it somewhere.

They haven't been removed. Just haven't been put in for beta.

Animations are a feature of PlanetSide, they aren't the point of PlanetSide. This was a promotional video showing off the large parts of the game, not so much the little things that glue those large parts together.