What are your thoughts on PlanetSide 2 now that you have played? - Page 5

Tialian · 2012-08-31, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by Valcron

The game is very simple- If you Love Call of Duty and Battlefield series you will love this game. If you LOVE planetside, you won't love this game- because it's NOT Planetside at all. It's fun to log on for a few minutes but gets terribly boring after a while. PS1 where are you?

This is exactly how I feel.

PlanetSide 2 is not much fun because it is so shallow.

The inventory system is vastly superior to classes because it provides a sense of immersion and the ability to create a soldier all your own. The certification system is also a must have, the Eve Online way of doing things takes away from a soldier needing to be specialized in only certain weapons/vehicles/tools at any one time.

Vehicle animations also add immersion into the game, the new vehicles themselves are pretty cool but there is no real sense of scale when a player just instantly gets in or out.

The world scale is also off. The world is huge but so are the bases, not to mention the buildings are so numerous and too close together. There isn't much incentive to pull a vehicle even for transportation purposes since getting into the fight is way too easy.

Contrary to popular belief, the sanctuary was nice to have as a default staging point with plenty of space to spread out the troops for a massive raid. This PS2 sanctuary warpgate system is cramped and crowded.

If you have a huge world but everyone keeps bumping elbows everywhere they go you lose the massive feel of the original PlanetSide.

Exmortius · 2012-08-31, 03:32 PM

more like badcompany.auraxis to be honest which is much better than battlefield.auraxis. but ya the grunt aspect does feel more like bc2 to me which imo was a great game. the game will stand more on it's own though once the crapton of certs and other various components get added in game. 3/4 of this game is not turned on yet in beta. lot of stuff is still in dev testing not pushed to the general population.

Stardouser · 2012-08-31, 03:38 PM

For people who want inventory, I'm sorry but that's not really appropriate. Grenades, for example, actually hurt people in this game, running around with 9 plus assault rifle wouldn't be right. That's just one example.

Vehicle animations are also not essential except in nostalgia. I personally want the game to immerse me in the war, not the minutiae of entering a vehicle.

thegreekboy · 2012-08-31, 04:09 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

Tell the world this. I think were doing something pretty unprescedented (and frankly a little of scary to a lot of people) with how open we've been and how closely we've worked with and integrated our community into this games development. Tell everyone it's what you want out of developers in the future and we (all of us gamers) may get it.

So much this

Tialian · 2012-08-31, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

For people who want inventory, I'm sorry but that's not really appropriate. Grenades, for example, actually hurt people in this game, running around with 9 plus assault rifle wouldn't be right. That's just one example.

Vehicle animations are also not essential except in nostalgia. I personally want the game to immerse me in the war, not the minutiae of entering a vehicle.

Well gee, it is a beta and grenades can be modified. Just look at PS1, even after release the plasma thumper was really popular until they nerfed it into being worthless. In PS1 it takes two direct plasma hand grenade hits to kill an infantry, and that's if they don't do anything to heal themselves or avoid being hit (not to mention there is a delay between throwing each grenade). It is clear grenades in PS2 are powerful, but that doesn't mean they should be and/or can't be changed. You simply can't compare damage from PS1 to PS2 because thats part of the problem, the TTK is too fast in PS2.

Vehicle animations are part of the immersive element of PS1. Immersion doesn't just boil down to one thing, it is a combination of things that makes a player feel like they are actually there in the world:

Inventory
Vehicle animations
Transit time to fights
Massive world with no boundries
Stamina (not being able to have infinite sprint or infinite jumping)

They are things that bring realism to the game. At the end of the day it is still a game, but a game that is just a game with no elements that suck players into the world is not a memorable game that people will stick with for years.

Why do you think people jump ship every 6-12 months when a new BF/CoD is released? They don't feel any real connection to any of the previous games.

There are plenty of games out there that keep players around by just adding new carrots for players to chase without actually making their games fun (WoW and Diablo 3 comes to mind). For games that persist, expansion are the carrot, for shooting games it is also an expansion or a new version of the game.

PlanetSide never needed Core Combat, and certainly not BFRs. Its a game people play because of the tactical elements that make the player feel like they are the soldier, that as a soldier they are free to go anywhere and do anything in the world.

Guild Wars 2 has done a really good job of capturing this idea, PlanetSide is still king but I think GW2 has taken runner up.

FortySe7en · 2012-08-31, 04:34 PM

They have a LOT to do to improve this game.

While they have come a long way since July, there is still a lot that needs to be done. For one, snipers should be able to head shot. As much as I hate to say that because I hate when it happens to me, its stupid to have a perfectly lined up head shot only to realize that you can only take them down to 1 bar of health.

Right now if you play anything other than heavy or medic, you are silly. Personal shield is by far the best thing in the game right now, and the most overpowered. Having that extra shield allows you to basically clear an entire point by yourself, not to mention having a 100 round clip.

Their adjacency system is a bit whack too. But I assume they will fix that soon.

SFJake · 2012-08-31, 04:34 PM

Gotta be blunt.

Planetside 2 is not giving me fun. I never know where to be, never know where something truly is going on, feel like I'm missing out on actions, and feel like I'm not part of a group at all.

There are systems in the plan, I know, but right now, its not fun. I never played PS1, but I can say I wish leaders were actually leaders (mostly squad leaders, random people with no leading certs or whatever should not be leaders). And the game should have generals or whatever high-rank people that can vaguely direct the faction as a whole.

I recall PS1 had some form of ranks like that though I have no idea of the effect they had on gameplay.

The game needs focus. And people need to be part of something without joining some hardcore outfit with forced microphones (I'll never use a mic, damn it) or some such.

It just needs organization. Everytime I play these days I run around for 15 minutes, find nothing to do, no one seemingly working together, the map tells me nothing of whatever is going on, or what my faction is doing, and I leave before anything happens.

Thats PS2 now for me.

Stardouser · 2012-08-31, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by Tialian

Well gee, it is a beta and grenades can be modified. Just look at PS1, even after release the plasma thumper was really popular until they nerfed it into being worthless. In PS1 it takes two direct plasma hand grenade hits to kill an infantry, and that's if they don't do anything to heal themselves or avoid being hit (not to mention there is a delay between throwing each grenade). It is clear grenades in PS2 are powerful, but that doesn't mean they should be and/or can't be changed. You simply can't compare damage from PS1 to PS2 because thats part of the problem, the TTK is too fast in PS2.

Vehicle animations are part of the immersive element of PS1. Immersion doesn't just boil down to one thing, it is a combination of things that makes a player feel like they are actually there in the world:

Inventory
Vehicle animations
Transit time to fights
Massive world with no boundries
Stamina (not being able to have infinite sprint or infinite jumping)

They are things that bring realism to the game. At the end of the day it is still a game, but a game that is just a game with no elements that suck players into the world is not a memorable game that people will stick with for years.

Why do you think people jump ship every 6-12 months when a new BF/CoD is released? They don't feel any real connection to any of the previous games.

There are plenty of games out there that keep players around by just adding new carrots for players to chase without actually making their games fun (WoW and Diablo 3 comes to mind). For games that persist, expansion are the carrot, for shooting games it is also an expansion or a new version of the game.

PlanetSide never needed Core Combat, and certainly not BFRs. Its a game people play because of the tactical elements that make the player feel like they are the soldier, that as a soldier they are free to go anywhere and do anything in the world.

Guild Wars 2 has done a really good job of capturing this idea, PlanetSide is still king but I think GW2 has taken runner up.

No, grenades should be powerful. Grenades shouldn't explode under your feet and magically not even penetrate your shield, AV weapons should not magically not hurt infantry as you would expect, etc. PS1's TTK was too high, that has never been in doubt for me. BF3 and CoD TTKs are way too low, PS2 seems to have it just right.

As for immersion I agree that it's a combination of things but I absolutely disagree on what you think are necessary inclusions. Stamina is most certainly something that has no place; especially since every game that does use stamina makes it way too restrictive, BF2 is a case in point.(though I will grant that this doesn't mean stamina cannot be done correctly, just like people oppose prone over dolphin diving which has been fixed in BF3, I suppose stamina could be done right too). And realism should always come only after fun is satisfied, and for many people, some realism aspects hurt fun.

As for PS2 not sucking people into it, that's only going to be true for PS1 vets who have self-trained over time to be unwilling to accept anything but inventory and animations. Someday a hardcore realism MMOFPS that would make even ArmA 2 look arcade might get made, (which is basically what we would have if every realism request was granted), but it will not be something that anything more than a small audience will play. And make no mistake, if you're asking for stamina, which is something even PS1 did not have (because it doesn't have sprinting. I'm not talking about jump stamina), then you're essentially asking that the game be even more realistic than PS1(realistic to the extent it CAN be realistic with future tech, of course).

The question you should be asking is not why people jump from the previous year's BF/CoD, but instead, why they jump from the previous CoD/BF and still go to the next CoD/BF. Though as always it's necessary to remember that CoD and BF are only superficially the same, that is, they both have aim down sight gameplay, for example. Neither of them uses extraneous realism like inventory and vehicle animations, that's definitely true, but again CoD and BF aren't the same thing.

Hooah · 2012-08-31, 04:59 PM

Ok this is what I would like to see in the game:
- Doors which the infiltrators can hack, making them important.
- Driver/gunner seat for the MBT
- Prone
- Beeing able to use more then one utility on your gun
- a defined front line / sabotaging behind enemy lines instead of being allowed to capture.
- assault rifle on the light assault class
- some sort of parachutes
- walls around a military installation
- a more aggressive jetpack (jango fett anyone?)

But I do enjoy the game!

I would just love it alittle bit more if SOE added some of what I listed here.

TheDAWinz · 2012-08-31, 05:00 PM

Love the game

Stardouser · 2012-08-31, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by Hooah

Ok this is what I would like to see in the game:
- Doors which the infiltrators can hack, making them important.
- Driver/gunner seat for the MBT
- Prone
- Beeing able to use more then one utility on your gun
- a defined front line / sabotaging behind enemy lines instead of being allowed to capture.
- assault rifle on the light assault class
- some sort of parachutes
- walls around a military installation
- a more aggressive jetpack (jango fett anyone?)

But I do enjoy the game!

I would just love it alittle bit more if SOE added some of what I listed here.

Some of those things are incoming. You can use 2 utility slots on guns, there is no capping except when you have an adjacent hex(though sabotaging behind the lines,. I don't know what there will be for that), and there will be jetpack certs to change its performance. They're also playing with base design changes that I like, Zurvan is closer to walled than it ever has been.

Blackwolf · 2012-08-31, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

Tell the world this. I think were doing something pretty unprescedented (and frankly a little of scary to a lot of people) with how open we've been and how closely we've worked with and integrated our community into this games development. Tell everyone it's what you want out of developers in the future and we (all of us gamers) may get it.

I wish the people in the Beta Forums understood this.

So many long winded arguments about what is/isn't broken balance wise. Gonna vomit.

Glad NDA is lifted, means I can escape back to the world of the relatively sane!

Evilpig is right though. From the view point of the lone wolf, game is terrible. Getting into an organized squad does wonders for your general enjoyment of the game though.

Biggest problem at the moment is air superiority. GTA is broken and does little damage but the DEVs are taking small strides towards correcting it slowly and I agree with that approach. Most people who played PS1 can agree that the air vs ground was one of those major buttons that incited riots and no one ever agreed with anyone else over them. I hope it's possible to balance that aspect out as thoroughly as Snipers vs infantry were in PS1.

Other then that, VS weapons reportedly have place holder stats but work just fine as far as I'm concerned. The fears about MAX suits being ultimate death machines are totally unfounded, anyone can easily kill a MAX suit with LA with a well placed C4 charge. MAX suits are very vulnerable to HA LMGs and particularly their AV weapons. I suspect the most effective anti-MAX tactic would be firing a single rocket into their face, then switching to the LMG and unloading into them. That tactic provides the best chances of success 1 on 1 in a toe to toe confrontation. Otherwise hit the MAX from flanks whenever possible, and sprint away, force it to sprint to keep up.

Tanks are also fairly weak but certs have been unlocked to beef up their armor values. Haven't seen how these certs affect their survivability yet but I hope to soonish. Dedicated vehicle drivers and pilots will have plenty of certs to improve survivability and decrease the cost of repeatedly pulling their chosen equipment. Also don't get me wrong, as they are now tanks are pretty well balanced against infantry and are the supreme ground warfare vehicles. It takes a lot of effort to take one out single handedly, but multiple infantry engaging the same tank will probably win in the end which works out perfectly. Still superior numbers is not a liscense to do stupid stuff like stand out in the open, it still requires effort.

A recent patch has introduced the adjacency requirement for hacking hexes. Most bases/outposts will require adjacent friendly hexes before you can hack them, with a few facilities behind enemy lines being hackable with or without connection to friendly hexes. This has drastically improved the ground war from chaos to orderly expansion efforts similar to PS1, without the potential repetition.

LA is also incredibly fun. You'll die a lot given the weaker defense but when you get into your grove you feel awesome. You can scale mountains, vault yourself over walls and up to second story windows. Combining your maneuverability with the use of grenades and C4 allows for engagements against MAX suits, vehicles, and base turrets. Scaling cliffs and hitting the enemy from un defended directions gives the LA great ambush capability and skilled players will do far more damage using LA then they would using HA.

Which is not to say that HA will be crap. Heavy hitters will love the class for it's long range AV weaponry, and ability to clear rooms effectively. A 100 round clip ensures you have enough bullets to do your job. You have access to C4 but it's not needed since your RL does the same damage at range and you have 4 shots as opposed to 1 C4 charge.

Stardouser · 2012-08-31, 05:20 PM

Originally Posted by Higby

Tell the world this. I think were doing something pretty unprescedented (and frankly a little of scary to a lot of people) with how open we've been and how closely we've worked with and integrated our community into this games development. Tell everyone it's what you want out of developers in the future and we (all of us gamers) may get it.

Your openness is indeed unprecedented. It puts DICE to a low down dirty crying shame with their top secrecy.

Though I have to ask, a lot of people would like to see two way dialogs before you implement changes. That is, instead of you passively reading feedback and then internally only deciding on a change, that you actually propose changes and receive reaction before you implement them.

Helwyr · 2012-08-31, 05:52 PM

Been in Beta since the Planetside Vets wave was let in. Overall, I'm still very excited about this after playing it, but there's still so much to add and possibilities of changes I can't yet say with certainty whether it will be awesome or not, but my expectation is that it will be.

The biggest issue for me and many others in Beta has been performance. I'm running the game on an older PC around the minimum requirements, and initially the game was essentially unplayable 0-9 FPS in big fights on low settings. However, they have made big improvements recently and now in those same fights I'm around 15-35 FPS... Not good, but I can at least participate. Smaller fights aren't a problem. I'm hoping the improvements keep coming and players like me can have a competitive FPS in big fights on the lowest settings.

Like others I'm also not a fan of the Class system, but I believe there's room within that system to create something good despite a bad foundation. Adding more flexibility and specialization at the same time like PS1 did before cert cap got raised too high.

Lots of stuff still just not available to testers, I played mostly as an Infiltrator in PS1, and the certs in PS2 to make an equivalent to a PS1 Infiltrator aren't available yet. (although they are visible in the cert tree).

Oh and yes the Developers on the whole have been good with listening and communicating. We got walls added to the AMP station base the other day.. ala more PS1 like

Blackwolf · 2012-08-31, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by Stardouser

Your openness is indeed unprecedented. It puts DICE to a low down dirty crying shame with their top secrecy.

Though I have to ask, a lot of people would like to see two way dialogs before you implement changes. That is, instead of you passively reading feedback and then internally only deciding on a change, that you actually propose changes and receive reaction before you implement them.

I don't think that is such a good idea honestly. It would breed encouragement for a flame war. It's happened often in PS1.

Their passive viewing is good enough, and will get them the results they want without encouraging screaming fits from people.