PS2 Base Design

[Whiteagle]

Originally Posted by SturmovikDrakon

I don't see how, considering it looks like they are less detailed and more flat compared to this

Well look at the scale of them compared to that Vanguard man...

They look to be about two to three times larger then what we have in the game currently.
And I meant it when I said they were buildings in and of themselves, the tops appear to be enclosed structures about the width of most mid-sized buildings in the game.

[SturmovikDrakon]

Originally Posted by Whiteagle

Well look at the scale of them compared to that Vanguard man...

They look to be about two to three times larger then what we have in the game currently.
And I meant it when I said they were buildings in and of themselves, the tops appear to be enclosed structures about the width of most mid-sized buildings in the game.

Hmm

I guess you're right

The walls look like bunkers

Man, what I'd give to just test those assets myself, in a separate server

[Whiteagle]

Originally Posted by SturmovikDrakon

Hmm

I guess you're right

The walls look like bunkers

Man, what I'd give to just test those assets myself, in a separate server

I know right?

One of those wall towers alone would make a better Outpost then most we have now...


...Malorn, are you reading this?
See if you can't get your hands on those old assets.

You can call it "The Stand" (subtitle: Hope Rides Aaaaalloooooonnnneee!).

[Mordelicius]

The quickest fixes they can add to smaller outpost/bases :

1. Give spawn room 3 doors instead of 2. This is to prevent the tanks especially Magriders from camping and shooting perpendicular to the door. Infantry has no chance if a supposed tank go to a side of a steep cliff (something other tanks can't do) and blast players from the side as they exit. There's no way to hit back if they are hidden from the two narrow openings.

2. Double the width of the door. This makes it even harder for tanks to spawn camp because it will provide players much wider angles to hit back.

3. Open the ceiling up, shielded of course, to prevent Aircraft from easily camping the doorway egress areas.

4. Add an AA on the top outer corner on the spawn room that can be repaired from the inside. Again this is to stop aerial spawn campers. If players are stuck inside, there will be no way to destroy that AA turret if there are multitudes of trapped engineers healing it and soon that Aircraft will expire or fly away from attrition.

[capiqu]

Tech, and Amp stations should have spawn rooms in the main buildings just as Bio labs do. Keep 2 spawn facilities outside the main building on each side. These could serve as the towers in Planetside 1. The enemy can capture the outer spawn facilities and we would still have control of the main building. This would give us the great fight styles of Planetside 1 even bigger.

As far as the outpost. If you spawn at a tower in Planetside 1 and stick your head out a door, tanks and air would blow you away. Outside of any building your fair game. you cant take that away from tank drivers and flyers. But as some have pointed out, if the spawn and CC are on the same building you have a better shot at defending the outpost. Then it would be up to a greater number of enemy infantry to go in and take that CC from you and capture the outpost.
Also it would be nice to see additional equipment terminals in all those empty building as well as an additional spawn room which the enemy can capture and from which they can launch there attacks on the outpost CC building

[Figment]

Originally Posted by capiqu

As far as the outpost. If you spawn at a tower in Planetside 1 and stick your head out a door, tanks and air would blow you away. Outside of any building your fair game. you cant take that away from tank drivers and flyers.

On the other hand, one shouldn't make it too easy and infantry too vulnerable either.

There's predominantly need for balance in which skill determines who gains the upper hand. Infantry by definition have the weakest tools to work with, they must be able to use the environment to their advantage in order to compete.


Having no defensive fortifications means infantry cannot compete at all. You'd also never get significant infantry vs infanty outside without continuous dominant meddling by air and vehicles.

Whether you like it or not, competitive infantry in- and outdoor play is a major if not the attraction for FPS players in general, especially if they're not allowed to directly compete with air and vehicles in most situations.

One should not make a class feel incompetent, ignored or otherwise useless. You will lose those players and/or a playstyle variety. Ultimately, that makes the game more uniform, predictable and bland, while variety and unpredictability and competition is what makes a pvp game thrive.

[Whiteagle]

Originally Posted by capiqu

Tech, and Amp stations should have spawn rooms in the main buildings just as Bio labs do. Keep 2 spawn facilities outside the main building on each side. These could serve as the towers in Planetside 1. The enemy can capture the outer spawn facilities and we would still have control of the main building. This would give us the great fight styles of Planetside 1 even bigger.

Well I'd agree with moving the spawns into the main structures of the Tech Plants and Amp Stations, I think the current satellite point spawns are good enough for attackers...

Originally Posted by capiqu

As far as the outpost. If you spawn at a tower in Planetside 1 and stick your head out a door, tanks and air would blow you away. Outside of any building your fair game. you cant take that away from tank drivers and flyers. But as some have pointed out, if the spawn and CC are on the same building you have a better shot at defending the outpost. Then it would be up to a greater number of enemy infantry to go in and take that CC from you and capture the outpost.

Well I don't think we'll ever be completely free of aerial camping, since swarms of A2G will hover when ever they get a chance, but it would be nice if there were areas in the game with a definite need for infantry involvement.

Originally Posted by capiqu

Also it would be nice to see additional equipment terminals in all those empty building as well as an additional spawn room which the enemy can capture and from which they can launch there attacks on the outpost CC building

Don't know about extra terminals, but there isn't a need for Enemy spawns at Outpost...

I mean, any competent attacking force brings an S-AMS along with them, or at least a Squad Beacon in case things aren't as easy as they were expecting.

Do they really need the advantage of a local spawn for a simple Outpost when they already have the initiative?

Originally Posted by Figment

Having no defensive fortifications means infantry cannot compete at all. You'd also never get significant infantry vs infanty outside without continuous dominant meddling by air and vehicles.

Whether you like it or not, competitive infantry in- and outdoor play is a major if not the attraction for FPS players in general, especially if they're not allowed to directly compete with air and vehicles in most situations.

One should not make a class feel incompetent, ignored or otherwise useless. You will lose those players and/or a playstyle variety. Ultimately, that makes the game more uniform, predictable and bland, while variety and unpredictability and competition is what makes a pvp game thrive.

Indeed, which is why I agree that there needs to be an eventual overhaul of the current Outpost with more defensible building assets.

These "Office-huts of the Future-as-designed-by-Alcoa" are little more then just that; futuristic set clutter in the vague shape of buildings.

Just because most Vehicles can't drive right inside of them doesn't make them a proper position for Infantry to fight them from.

[Figment]

Alright so I made a case study of Aurora Materials Lab, which is a base that changes hands constantly right now because every time you walk in, you already won. Currently all you need to do is get an AMS to the central CY, a tank on the south spawn exit and you win.

I've tried to give a brief impression of the situation as is below.




Then I've made some modifications (probably a few more than absolutely necessary). However, I'd say it's still pretty easy to enter, but would provide an organised assault with some challenges when defended.



Defense should be easier then now, but they'll still have to be very flexible and active. Infantry is now very important in securing the base, while vehicles are important in moving up to the base.

I've also tried to ensure there's plenty of infiltrator objectives, from gate securing to SOI destruction to SCU destruction and CC hacking.

Also note the SOI generator (in CY here, could be located on top of a building too).

Could add some elevators at wall walk ends next to buildings so people can get to the roof more easily when walking along the outpost wall.

Thoughts?

[Canaris]

Originally Posted by Figment

Defense should be easier then now, but they'll still have to be very flexible and active. Infantry is now very important in securing the base, while vehicles are important in moving up to the base.

I've also tried to ensure there's plenty of infiltrator objectives, from gate securing to SOI destruction to SCU destruction and CC hacking.

Also note the SOI generator (in CY here, could be located on top of a building too).

Could add some elevators at wall walk ends next to buildings so people can get to the roof more easily when walking along the outpost wall.

Thoughts?

I would really love to try out that gameplay, that's for sure. SOI would be great to have back though I think 3 shield gens for an outpost might be overkill

[Figment]

Originally Posted by Canaris

I would really love to try out that gameplay, that's for sure. SOI would be great to have back though I think 3 shield gens for an outpost might be overkill

Just showcasing the options. Having a good outer perimeter is pretty important though. If vehicles can always get in on their own, that severely reduces the importance of the blockade runner Sunderer upgrade. I'd rather create some reliance on infantry, which truth be told, can get in pretty easily still.

Still, I'd like to see people use a blockade runner Sundy with minefield upgrade now and then to take out a shield gen objective by running the gates, rather than always bring the AMS variant because it is more +10 exp pts.

[Canaris]

Originally Posted by Figment

Just showcasing the options. Having a good outer perimeter is pretty important though. If vehicles can always get in on their own, that severely reduces the importance of the blockade runner Sunderer upgrade. I'd rather create some reliance on infantry, which truth be told, can get in pretty easily still.

Still, I'd like to see people use a blockade runner Sundy with minefield upgrade now and then to take out a shield gen objective by running the gates, rather than always bring the AMS variant because it is more +10 exp pts.

ahh I see now sorry thought it was you need to drop the three gens for access, instead they power they're own indivdual gates. That's clever why I was worried over the 3 was having to do whack a mole to keep them down, instead you can drop one and have that route in. No that's a great idea. Was eating lunch while looking at it, had ham and cheese on the mind lawl

[Hmr85]

Awesome, I love it and would love to give that outpost a try. SOE hire this man.

[Figment]

Btw, I'm pondering on how infiltrators could have a stealth edge opposed to LA's mobility edge in taking these generators out. Perhaps the general overload warning doesn't appear as fast with different grades of hacking. Then people have equal time to respond, but they'll have to pay more attention to the overload and hacking sounds than the facility warnings.

[Crator]

Originally Posted by Figment

Then I've made some modifications (probably a few more than absolutely necessary). However, I'd say it's still pretty easy to enter, but would provide an organised assault with some challenges when defended.



Defense should be easier then now, but they'll still have to be very flexible and active. Infantry is now very important in securing the base, while vehicles are important in moving up to the base.

This is excellent! Can we please try this? Where's Malorn?

[Whiteagle]

Originally Posted by Figment

Alright so I made a case study of Aurora Materials Lab, which is a base that changes hands constantly right now because every time you walk in, you already won. Currently all you need to do is get an AMS to the central CY, a tank on the south spawn exit and you win.

...


Then I've made some modifications (probably a few more than absolutely necessary). However, I'd say it's still pretty easy to enter, but would provide an organised assault with some challenges when defended.



Defense should be easier then now, but they'll still have to be very flexible and active. Infantry is now very important in securing the base, while vehicles are important in moving up to the base.

I've also tried to ensure there's plenty of infiltrator objectives, from gate securing to SOI destruction to SCU destruction and CC hacking.

Also note the SOI generator (in CY here, could be located on top of a building too).

Could add some elevators at wall walk ends next to buildings so people can get to the roof more easily when walking along the outpost wall.

Thoughts?

Love it.

Especially love the SoI jammer, since every outpost seems to have those big ass antenna but only a few use them to mark the position of the Control Console.

The only thing I don't understand is Shield Generator C, since it only covers a small entryway...
...Kind of a waste of a shield generator if you ask me.

Originally Posted by Figment

Btw, I'm pondering on how infiltrators could have a stealth edge opposed to LA's mobility edge in taking these generators out. Perhaps the general overload warning doesn't appear as fast with different grades of hacking. Then people have equal time to respond, but they'll have to pay more attention to the overload and hacking sounds than the facility warnings.

Easy, give them a suit option that allows them to carry more anti-personal explosives!

Smart cloakers should be using their stealth to disrupt the enemies ability to move effectively, and what better bait to send them to the spawn countdown then an overloaded generator?