Top cause of players leaving PS2 (2014)

[Mordelicius]

SOE need to stop fixing things that aren't even broken.

I just saw Gourney Dam get dismantled just like that on Planetside 2 Twitch channel. Witnessing the base gutted like that is disheartening and disagreeable.

The only thing that base is lacking is proper attacker Sunderer parking to the north, that's it. 'Proper' as in a shed or two.

Now, they got this wide open base that's going be a sniper haven on all sides, with tanks poking in and attackers having easy access to spawn camp both the main spawn and the teleporter spawn. Not only that, it's going to be buzzing with aircrafts now that the tall turrets are gone.

Wow, I swear, and I say this without venom. Do they even play their own game? I doubt it very much. It's mind-boggling, they always find a base to wreck. They did it to the Crown. They did it to Tawrich Tower. They did it to Quartz Ridge.

Tawrich Tower was great last year. It had this amazing crossroad that's a gateway to the east. All they saw in it was their Red Dot Dogma. Basically what that is, when they see a bunch of killing in their graphs, they automatically think it is 'bad'. Hence, it's dogma. They don't ever see it as good within context or flow.

What is Tawrich tower now? There's a huge rock formation blocking all line of sight, with the cap point in the outside building covered by more rocks. It's no wonder nobody wants to fight there. Contrast that with the EPIC fights last year. All they are doing is 'shift' these red dots, since players flee from the bases they destroy.

What's happening:
Good base tampered > Goes bad > Players avoid it > "red dots" go away.

Instead of finding cues from a good base and applying it to other bases, they're rather ruin a base, so players will spread out and not flock to it.

Now, if they are just removing a dozen objects and replacing it with a log, that would have been enough. But, why allow attackers such close access to the spawn room too?. It's mighty perplexing why spawn camping is being encouraged.

They just announced a spawn kill timer that gives zero XP. This is similar to the death XP timer i've been advocating since launch.
http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...ad.php?t=51359
http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...ad.php?t=56506

How will the defenders be able to defend, when it's so easy to lock players in. Do they realize that AA turrets are useless without an AV turret complement because tanks and infantry will destroy it easily? It's the interplay between Aircraft pressuring the AV turret, AA pressuring the aircraft and everything in between, vice versa. Everything in between as in Snipers pressuring engies repairing, AV laying down suppression fire on infantry pathway etc etc.

Once it is down, then aircrafts will descend to seal all defenders in. Obviously they don't know this because, they don't really participate in fights, and they aren't fluent with the chronology, flow and context of the battle at all.

This will be like Waterson's Redemption without the walls. I'm sure they never had an epic attack/defense experience on Gourney Dam. Instead, they consult graphs and dots as their reference.

[Rivenshield]

Originally Posted by Mordelicius

SOE need to stop fixing things that aren't even broken.

I just saw Gourney Dam get dismantled just like that on Planetside 2 Twitch channel. Witnessing the base gutted like that is disheartening and disagreeable.

It would seem that the tug of war between the ESports and Traditionalist factions continues apace....

[Mordelicius]

Originally Posted by Rivenshield

It would seem that the tug of war between the ESports and Traditionalist factions continues apace....

The thing is, PS2 Devs just stubbornly try to force personal/team design protocols that aren't simply fun to fight in.

some examples:
No Deploy Zones - They could have just given a Sunderer an upgrade/sidegrade ability to deploy and jam enemy sunderers from spawning players. That would have been more dynamic and conducive to the fight.

Three-point Caps far away from each other - Are players lining up to fight at J908(?) Crater? The Ascent? The new Crown? Players avoid these bases because it's simply not fun at 3-point bases where you have to WALK a long ways off and not have a good encounter while doing it. Players want to shoot and get shot at while going from point to point.

Compare that to highly popular Tower Bases and Biolabs where the cap points are relatively closer to each other. It's not even close. Watch, they will tamper with the Towers and Biolabs next. I heard they are just about ready to pluck A out of the tower and plant it elsewhere. My best hope here is that they don't put it some ways off (like the Crown).

Do they actually believe it's fun for for players to guard a cap point that's not even contested. it's a foolish thought. If one is to check ALL of the established Tower bases, if you're in one of the cap points, you're always engaged in the fight.

That or sleep at Crown C point, J908 C point. Even on non-tower bases like Howling Pass, the fights are always intense with the points, the gates, the pads and the generators are always contested.

The only close 3-point that isn't really fun is the new Quartz Ridge. And that's only because it doesn't fit the lattice it is on. The old Quartz Ridge was far superior in flowing from Indar Excav or towards Hvar. The base itself is good, but within the context of the lattice and the terrain, it simply makes no sense.

Now, they've just about imbalanced the new Gourney Dam. I mean snipers will simply be dropped on the large rocks and the high walls. If it's Vanu, there would be Lasher/Maxes there shooting energy balls at the spawns from those high points. That's not to mention aircrafts utilizing the trees, terrain and walls to their advantage. As for the tanks on the ground. What's to stop them from shooting from the bridge areas? It's similar to what they did to the Biolab defender spawn. Surround and spawn camp.

The worse part about this is they haven't cited what's exactly justifies this full overhaul. It's a very popular base and is the equivalent of old Crown at Hossin, that promotes a lot of intense and memorable -and often combined arms - battles. Yet, the first thing they can think of is replace it. Really? It's so inexplicable .

The only real thing that is 'off' in this base is the eastern part (sorry not north as I've mentioned before) where parking a sundy is almost prohibitive. There's simply no good parking spots with a large and lengthy natural rock formation. The sunderers always end up being easily destroyed by tanks in plain sight up and down that road. Other than that, there's simply no reason to just tear this great base apart.

[Baneblade]

Well, to be fair to your statement... they did outsource the making of new hats.

[Baneblade]

That was always my problem with him, he claimed to love PlanetSide while at the same time wanting to change the very core of what made it such a great game.


PS2 would have turned out better with SmokeJumper. No, I'm not being ironic.


Higby should have done the LM/EQ thing and just made two different games for the two purposes he wanted them to serve instead of trying to merge them into one mess of incompatible concepts.

[Tatwi]

Chiming in late, I quit essentially for two reasons:

1. I couldn't play the game. It just refused to run properly and was effectively impossible to play. Can't do much when your hits don't register, terminals/vehicles don't work, and everyone teleports all over the screen most of the time. I tried really hard not to let it bother me, but it eventually became literally impossible to do anything other than fly around an empty continent killing... time.

2. The way people choose to play the game is depressing and boring. Massive zergs / spawn room camping with the maximum amount of force multipliers possible, all the time, everywhere. Or... you can play TR or NC, where hundreds of people run once more into the breach, because hey this time it *might* work, right? It really seemed that it didn't matter who's platoon I played with on NC or TR, no one was interested in having any fun. It was either grind XP essentially ghost capping or thoughtlessly throw the entire platoon at over popped zergs without any hope doing more than getting some kills/deaths. I found that I always ended having more fun just looking at the map and figuring out where I personally could be most effective. Though, I did have some fun with a couple outfits here and there.

Now, I dunno. I really like the game itself, the art, the feel, the vehicles, the locations, the combat style... So if it runs properly, I'll play a bit again. I'm actually looking forward to the alpha design Lightning to be released - might just have to buy some Station Cash for the first time in a very long time. But, I just don't have it in me to treat PS2 any more than a fun thing to do, sometimes. My main character has unlocked pretty much everything I care about, so I can log in and blow stuff up whenever without feeling the need to "grind".

[Rivenshield]

Well.... speak of the devil... after two years of it being mysteriously okay in this game and a decade in the other, Sony just took my Striker away from me.

This isn't the Striker. It's a DIFFERENT HIGBY WEAPON. It's akin to the old Rocklet gun. I cannot grit my teeth, put that reticle on an elusive target -- Scythes, buggies, etc. -- show some fire discipline when I get hit, and hassle them with my MIRVed mini-missile launcher any more, and score the occasional joyous kill. I cannot group together with my fellow grunts to form a small bipedal missile complex and rain hate from the heights into the valley. I cannot warn off marauding enemy fighters by pointing my (empty?) launcher at them so that they hear that ominous 'tink, tink' tink.'

I mentally review the countless chokepoints I've defended with that weapon and realize that enemy armor can simply sail right through and up to me, and buggies and quads can zig-zag right up to my AMS, and I can do very little about it besides spray lead. It's a completely different map now.

Higby? When you said yes to this you fucked up badly. This isn't 'balancing'. It isn't even a nerf. It's a demoralizing kick in the nuts. It's a game-changer, and not for the better. I'm out for the forseeable future.

[synkrotron]

Well... I read most of that.

Seems a lot of the PSU hard core have given up on PS2, although they still like to chat about it. I find that interesting in itself and for me says that you've not completely given up on PS2 just yet.

As for me, I'm still playing. I don't look too deeply into this game. I don't care about "balance," "force multipliers," "TTK," "OSK," and all that jazz. I play a very simple version of Planetside 2. I pick fights that suit my limited skill and playstyle. My playstyle is hated by many, but why should I care as long as I am enjoying it?

I also don't get bogged down in all the nerf this, buff that stuff... Things are what they are, bases are fine, to me... I don't mind the Zergs, the spawn camping, air dominating infantry dominating armour etc. I just log on and see what is going at the time. Might be a 4v4 tussle or a 96+v96+ mega battle.

The only thing that would improve this game for me is performance, and that is it.

But that's just me and I appear to be very much in the minority...

[Qwan]

Hi guys long time no see.

I’ve been playing PS2 off and on, these last couple of months, spending most of my time in ESO. But it’s always good to log on during opps nights and have some fun. Currently I see one of the problems with this game is that it’s not expanding, there spending so much time listening to people whine about balance and base design. And the funny part is most of these guys crying about it want that one shot weapon and the "enemy can only attack from one direction". I personally log on and have a good time, whether it’s getting spawn camped or camping the spawn. Whether its getting the nice shot with my sniper rifle, to get that one shot kill. I think that most of these upset players need to understand it’s how gaming combat is, I mean I really want to see more crying over new vehicles, more continents, and getting the lattice system up so I can use the warp gate instead of having to abandon my vehicle every time we switch continents.

Personally the weapons work fine I have fun when I play, right now I’m just waiting for more vehicles, and more continents and a lattice system that connects the continents, and get rid of these warp gates. Currently I’m BR 100, so certs mean nothing and neither does station cash, it’s just sits there and builds up. I did spend a little on the Valkyrie (or flying coffin) but other than that I still log in once a week to join the guys in some opps hoping something new.

[Figment]

Originally Posted by Qwan

And the funny part is most of these guys crying about it want that one shot weapon and the "enemy can only attack from one direction".

Nice respectful hostility to open a debate with?

And actually, your grasp of who's doing the whining and what they want is less than... How shall I put it... Less than basic. Sounds like you've just got prejudices and have absolutely no clue what is being whined about.

So you saying "most of these guys"

I personally log on and have a good time, whether it’s getting spawn camped or camping the spawn.

Good for you. Ever imagined that not everyone is like you and MOST PEOPLE don't actually enjoy camping, nor being camped? Look at ANY game and the one thing that everyone always agrees on is that camping is a negative aspect of the game and should be reduced to a minimum, hardly ever stimulated as it does not contribute to gameplay, rather, it detracts since it's repetitive, doesn't allow anything exciting or interesting to happen where player skill actually matters to influence the outcome of a match and is therefore boring.

So. Good for you enjoying that, but you forget that the game isn't designed specifically for you, but for huge amounts of players, all with completely different personalities.

Most of which, again, don't enjoy camping and look down on it.

Whether its getting the nice shot with my sniper rifle, to get that one shot kill.

Although some sniper rifles one can imagine a one shot kill to be justifiable on, you seem to be unable to comprehend when a one shot kill is justified and when it isn't.

And by that I mean in relation to overall game design. Games are meant to be fun, so when one shot kills turn a game into a meat grinder, it might be "what could realistically be" and fun for those who exploit it under their own terms and goals, but it could be absolutely detrimental to the game experience of another user who is the target in a specific context where the user cannot deal with it, or the volume (amount) of fire that has that one shot kill potential.

PlanetSide, due to its player size scope, has a completely different balancing need from a game of 16-32 Free for All or Team Deathmatch, simply due to "volume of fire". The rate at which bullets and grenades are targeted on a player. If it hinders the player too much to accomplish the other goals set out by a game, this type of unit might have to compromise for the overall fun of players.

For example.

GAME MISSION GOAL:
"Cross open area X to hold semi-open area Y for 5 minutes against 100 respawning enemies"

(objective) (context)

Which is a very common goal in PS2. Now, if you give one shot kills to all those respawning enemies and a camping position with overwatch and no counter possibility and you also provide a swift rate of fire to this one shot kill, you then have a lot of lethal potential per shot, combined with a high rate of fire and a lot of people wielding this weapon. The chances of a player crossing an area that is (easily) camped and holding an area within the zone of influence of the enemy due to reinforcements being easily cut off with the camp, means it's very likely simply impossible to complete the game's mission goal.

Being rigged to fail leads to players being upset with the game when those actually want to succeed in accomplishing the game's goals. Which means that either the game goals have to change or the context in which the game goals have to be accomplished to change... Which basically is why so much emphasis has been put on base design.

And no, players that ask for base design changes don't ask for single direction combat. They ask for defensibility in a 540-1080 degrees direction: up and from all sides. Many of the existing and even more the early base designs wern't designed for defense in any particular combat direction (making it Suiss cheese, execution squads at teleport points and open to airborne rape) or strangely, designed for defense in a single direction, which meant that enemies just circled to the back by default, obsoleting these defenses completely.

The problem is that the level designs had no workable vision for a free roaming map conquest game at all. :/ We're still suffering the consequences of that, in that other content is delayed severely and gameplay is sub-optimal.

I think that most of these upset players need to understand it’s how gaming combat is,

"Gaming combat". I don't think you have ANY and I mean ANY right to provide the definition for what that is considering you show you have absolutely no clue. Sorry, but you're making yourself sound like one of those people who really should just shut up since you enjoy "anything" regardless of quality, unless it's a personal pet peeve. And voila, you present your personal pet peeves immediately:

I mean I really want to see more crying over new vehicles, more continents, and getting the lattice system up so I can use the warp gate instead of having to abandon my vehicle every time we switch continents.

You're whining about "gaming combat" too. I could just say the same ludicrous thing you just said "you just need to understand how (PS2) gaming combat is".

It's insulting, unnecessary, unquantifiable, lacks content and totally misses the point.


Btw. "New vehicles" is only worthwhile if there's a need and if it provides varied gameplay. I have put forth during Alpha that putting so many roles in a few vehicles removes the niches for a lot of these units and therefore severely limits the amount of potential vehicles to be added without creating significant role overlap. At which point it's mostly eye candy, or competition between units that obsolotes the one or the other.

The intercontinental lattice seems under the current circumstances somewhat hard to introduce (they should simply clear two warpgates per continent and link those up). However, I'm wondering if the rest of the game is able to cope.

What you request btw, changing from continent to continent by vehicle, is simply activating the warpgates between the current continents. Which should have been in in Alpha, but apparently has never made it in for whatever reason. I honestly can't imagine why aside them not being able to handle masses of warps per second (which seems easy enough to solve tbh using in game hard spawn points, auto drive, queues, etc).

[Buggsy]

Originally Posted by synkrotron

Well... I read most of that.

Seems a lot of the PSU hard core have given up on PS2, although they still like to chat about it. I find that interesting in itself and for me says that you've not completely given up on PS2 just yet.

As for me, I'm still playing. I don't look too deeply into this game. I don't care about "balance," "force multipliers," "TTK," "OSK," and all that jazz. I play a very simple version of Planetside 2. I pick fights that suit my limited skill and playstyle. My playstyle is hated by many, but why should I care as long as I am enjoying it?

I also don't get bogged down in all the nerf this, buff that stuff... Things are what they are, bases are fine, to me... I don't mind the Zergs, the spawn camping, air dominating infantry dominating armour etc. I just log on and see what is going at the time. Might be a 4v4 tussle or a 96+v96+ mega battle.

The only thing that would improve this game for me is performance, and that is it.

But that's just me and I appear to be very much in the minority...

I'm happy you're happy.

[synkrotron]

Originally Posted by Buggsy

I'm happy you're happy.

Thank you

[Qwan]

Damn figment take it easy you going into nerd rage here.

Your starting to sound like someone who is expecting soooo much from a free to play game.

I approach this game with very low expectation, because what it comes down to is money and PS2 just aint doing it right.

PS everyone enjoys a little spawn camping even you LOL.