My one 'dislike' of PS2 (Main Battle Tanks)

[ArmedZealot]

Originally Posted by Stardouser

I assume you mean it will only be harder to kill and more lethal when fully crewed because of the extra gunner's ability to pay full attention to shooting.

Again this is still true as far as PS2 is concerned. Except the gunner isn't shooting vehicles but swatting at aircraft and picking of infantry, while the driver is positioning to kill other tanks.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by Reapter

It shouldn't be required to have a teammate or else you lose out on using some things all together.

In that case then Liberators should be single seat aircraft were the pilot has controle of both the bombing/ground attack gun, tail gun, and forward gun. Isnt requireing that to have a 'full crew' also makeing you lose out on useing some things?

The more powerfull vehicals require teamwork, as it should.

[ArmedZealot]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

Its true, to a point.

Only now, you have:

Lighting = single crew, lethal on his own, easier to kill.

MBT = single crew, more lethal than Lithing, Harder to kill.

Whats the point in ever useing/having the lighting if you can solo-drive something thats more lethal, and harder to kill? By youself, just like you could/can the Lighting?

Because the lightning will be able to dedicate itself completely to shooting down aircraft, while a tank is handicapped without a gunner. Not only this but the lightning will be more faster and quicker, better able to get behind enemy lines and run away when the big guns show up.

If you want to kill a lot of things and have more survivability get into a MBT.

If you want to be the cloaker of vehicles, or shoot down aircraft, choose the lightning.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

Not only this but the lightning will be more faster and quicker, better able to get behind enemy lines and run away when the big guns show up.

That pretty much describes a 'scout' dosnt it? Thats a 'single-player' playstyle. Just like the quad (and arguably also the single-seat aircraft).

If you want to kill a lot of things and have more survivability get into a MBT.

Which, with more power, should also include teamwork.

[Reapter]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

In that case then Liberators should be single seat aircraft were the pilot has controle of both the bombing/ground attack gun, tail gun, and forward gun. Isnt requireing that to have a 'full crew' also makeing you lose out on useing some things?

The more powerfull vehicals require teamwork, as it should.

It has a main gun on it in ps2 which you can equip with different functions, you can fly solo if you wanted. It isn't required to have a full crew at all and you still get quite a bit of use. The other slots just give it an extra edge/purpose. Most others I am sure want the extra AA capabilities though.

[ArmedZealot]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

That pretty much describes a 'scout' dosnt it? Thats a 'single-player' playstyle. Just like the quad (and arguably also the single-seat aircraft).

The quad can't kill, and aircraft are easily spotted and shot down with lock on weapons. The lightnings new role will be that of the skyguard and harasser of PS1.

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

Which, with more power, should also include teamwork.

Which it will. I don't see your point. If you don't have a gunner you are food for infantry and aircraft.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by Reapter

It has a main gun on it in ps2 which you can equip with different functions, you can fly solo if you wanted. It isn't required to have a full crew at all and you still get a great benefit out of it.

But it severly limits it as that nose-gun dosnt do anywere near the damage the belly gun does. Just as it limited it in PS1 when people solo-flew it.

Giving the driver of the MBT control of the gun without need of a second player dosnt limit anything except its self-defence against aircraft.

[ArmedZealot]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

Giving the driver of the MBT control of the gun without need of a second player dosnt limit anything except its self-defence against aircraft.

And against infantry. The turret of a tank can be easily kited and avoided if you are close enough, and if the driver sucks at driving. Without the gunner you are boned.

[Reapter]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

But it severly limits it as that nose-gun dosnt do anywere near the damage the belly gun does. Just as it limited it in PS1 when people solo-flew it.

Giving the driver of the MBT control of the gun without need of a second player dosnt limit anything except its self-defence against aircraft.

You forgot also against infantry. We don't have damage values for the main gun yet but since its a gunship now I am sure it does quite a bit more now. For the most part all they did with MBT was shift weapon focus a bit and gave the driver the main benefit for what he invests in it and aren't a driving simulator in the least.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

The quad can't kill, and aircraft are easily spotted and shot down with lock on weapons. The lightnings new role will be that of the skyguard and harasser of PS1.

Its ironic that you mentioned 2 vehicles which both required 2 people to use effectively right there.

Which it will. I don't see your point. If you don't have a gunner you are food for infantry and aircraft.

True, no 2nd gunner = aircraft will have a easier time with you, but no 2nd gunner in no way diminishes the impact you'll have with the primary gun against other vehicles and infantry.

Makeing both the MBT and the Lighting single-seaters means there's realy only 1 reason to chose one over the other, if you want to shoot down planes, or shoot at tanks.

Were befor, if you wanted to be a 'danger' on the field, you needed to grab a buddy and work together. With PS2's current system (were the tanks are concerned) its turned away from the 'cooperative' playstyle, to the 'everyone for themselves' playstyle.

[DDSHADE]

I think you're right, I loved just being a dedicated tank driver in PS! The off chance a friend would want to drive instead, I would get tons of kills as the gunner, but half the time the driver wouldn't go where I wanted him to, and I couldn't hit the targets because he would block my LoS at the wrong times. The skill required to drive so that your gunner can line up his shot right is something I'd like to see return in PS2.

Zekeen started up a thread in the PS2 Idea Vault about having a chassis mod for the MBT's allowing them to have dedicated drivers.

Check it out here:
http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...ad.php?t=41477

I think it merits consideration!

[Immigrant]

Originally Posted by Reapter

In order for that to work that requires a reliable teammate who is fine with doing that. You have to remember there are a lot of solo players out there. Also a gunner will always have a benefit as long as it can literally do anything at all. Team focused players will stick around in vehicles and rack up kills at what there specialized in. It shouldn't be required to have a teammate or else you lose out on using some things all together.

If you want to play a MBT you shouldn't have a problem finding a partner (at least a temporary one, there'll alway be enough people there to fill in the various roles) among possibly 332 other players in your faction. Only true reason would be that you don't want to play with someone else and if you choose to play solo that's your problem. Every undermanned MBT is simply a waste of resources and such playstyle shouldn't be encouraged. Yes you should be required to have a partner to have fully functional MBT.

[Rhapsody]

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

And against infantry. The turret of a tank can be easily kited and avoided if you are close enough, and if the driver sucks at driving. Without the gunner you are boned.

And a PS1 Vanguard without a driver was boned against Infantry as the tank couldnt 'move'. Thats sorta the same situation there. Only now, since the gunner is ALSO the driver, he 'can' move and avoid getting shot at. Youve given a single player more power with 0 penalties. (baring the no AA thing as im speaking about the tank itself, not what is designed to counter it)

[Reapter]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

True, no 2nd gunner = aircraft will have a easier time with you, but no 2nd gunner in no way diminishes the impact you'll have with the primary gun against other vehicles and infantry.

Makeing both the MBT and the Lighting single-seaters means there's realy only 1 reason to chose one over the other, if you want to shoot down planes, or shoot at tanks.

Were befor, if you wanted to be a 'danger' on the field, you needed to grab a buddy and work together. With PS2's current system (were the tanks are concerned) its turned away from the 'cooperative' playstyle, to the 'everyone for themselves' playstyle.

Even from what you said yourself in this, you can focus on one particular role alone but with multiple you are still adding benefits while its not a requirement in the least. Just now everyone can enjoy being in there particular role. People who feel like manning the secondary gun will to get to and enjoy the benefits without it being forced in the least. There is still tons of teamwork without any forced requirements.

[Pyreal]

Originally Posted by Rhapsody

Its ironic that you mentioned 2 vehicles which both required 2 people to use effectively right there.


True, no 2nd gunner = aircraft will have a easier time with you, but no 2nd gunner in no way diminishes the impact you'll have with the primary gun against other vehicles and infantry.

Makeing both the MBT and the Lighting single-seaters means there's realy only 1 reason to chose one over the other, if you want to shoot down planes, or shoot at tanks.

Were befor, if you wanted to be a 'danger' on the field, you needed to grab a buddy and work together. With PS2's current system (were the tanks are concerned) its turned away from the 'cooperative' playstyle, to the 'everyone for themselves' playstyle.

The MBT is not a single seat vehicle.
Why do people keep saying this?

To objectively possess more efficiency, lethality, and longevity a MBT will need two players!