Tank-mounted AA and buggies in PS2

[FIREk]

Originally Posted by Malorn

1) Skyguard was fragile but fast AA defense. This seems obsolete with secondary weapons on tanks having the same function. I'm not sure I like this consolidation.

That all depends on how useful the tank-mounted AA will be. If it's only a halfway-decent Reaver repellent, then it's fine. A tank wouldn't be a dedicated anti-air vehicle.

This would be cool, because whereas all tanks would have some rudimentary air defense, AA-centric buggies would be aircraft hunters.

[ThGlump]

Buggies are fun, and should be kept as fast hitting vehicle that can exploits tank weakness (slow turning). But can you imagine driving something that fast as a buggy in circles around tank, trying to avoid obstacles and being hit and simultaneously shooting at that tank? Main advantage of buggy is its speed/mobility, but that turns into disadvantage if you had to do anything else than focus to driving.
Unless they drop that stupid driver=gunner bullshit, there wont be any use for bug. gies as it would be very hard to use and everybody would rather choose to roll much safer tank.

[Malorn]

Per the other discussion, the tank-mounted AA needs to be effective or the secondary weapon is a joke and won't be used and we have 1-man tanks driving around. They've said it isn't a joke and therefore we must assume that it is worthwhile to put an AA gun on a tank and worthwhile to man it.

[Accuser]

Originally Posted by FIREk

That all depends on how useful the tank-mounted AA will be. If it's only a halfway-decent Reaver repellent, then it's fine. A tank wouldn't be a dedicated anti-air vehicle.

It's been confirmed that the secondary gun will rival the capabilities of the main gun. Otherwise, the would-be gunner could just pull something else. Would you sit in a gun turret that's literally designed not to kill anything, just scare things away?

On the other hand, would there be anything better than running columns of diversified AA/AI tanks in that situation?

I don't envy them on the balancing act they have to pull off.

[Malorn]

I would almost think that they have to balance assuming that half the tanks out there won't have secondary gunners.

BFRs were a good example, at least that many ran off without a gunner in spite of some of those weapons being 'no joke'.

[SgtMAD]

each empire should have their own buggy frame design that we can unlock mods for so it can be switched between AA/AV/AI at spawn like the army does with humvees.

and screw all this 12mm talk, lets give them 20mm gatling guns,I love the sound of a gatling gun.

they are stealing everything else from the BF/CoD model, give us a decent mini gun,everyone knows they love the look of those tracers,can you imagine what a big fight would look like during a night cycle

[FIREk]

Originally Posted by ThGlump

Unless they drop that stupid driver=gunner bullshit, there wont be any use for bug. gies as it would be very hard to use and everybody would rather choose to roll much safer tank.

Buggies would have to be 2-person. Even if they copied the one-man tank concept off Battlefield, buggies have always had dedicated drivers in that series. They were also very crappy.

A buggy could easily sport AI/AV weapons that are just barely weaker than their tank counterparts. A buggy trades off all survivability for raw mobility. While it may be tougher to hit, it might as well go boom after one direct AV missile hit. It's therefore reasonable to give them firepower to be reckoned with.

Originally Posted by Accuser

It's been confirmed that the secondary gun will rival the capabilities of the main gun. Otherwise, the would-be gunner could just pull something else. Would you sit in a gun turret that's literally designed not to kill anything, just scare things away?

I still kinda hope that the "rival" part has got some catch to it.. Like, the top-tier AV secondary attachment could rival the main cannon's AV properties. However, the tank's AI and AA attachments would be mediocre at best, because they designed tanks to be mostly anti-vehicle.

I dunno. I just don't want to see every single vehicle in PlanetSide 2 being a tank with an AA attachment, just because every other vehicle will be a Galaxy, Mossie, Reaver and the odd Lib.
With no buggies for diversity, and uber-all-round tanks, what is there left to drive? ATVs and Sunderers? :O

Originally Posted by Malorn

BFRs were a good example, at least that many ran off without a gunner in spite of some of those weapons being 'no joke'.

You got flying in exchange for the turret, which is a big plus. If my Prowler could fly, I could considering removing the dual 15mms. :P

[ThGlump]

Originally Posted by FIREk

Buggies would have to be 2-person. Even if they copied the one-man tank concept off Battlefield, buggies have always had dedicated drivers in that series.

Ok then whats the point of rolling buggy? You need two times more ppl to operate it than a tank, and even then you will be weaker than one man tank. Put two people in the tank and you can scratch buggies from the game which will be sad (they dont have even tech advantage now, as tech benefit from bases is not in game yet - i hope it will be there in the end). Its all that 1 man tank army thats ruining possibilities of buggies.

[Malorn]

Right, tanks having the weaponry normally reserved for buggies (ground pounder, flak cannon, probably a rocket too) along with the armor of a tank and the ability to have it in any infantry armor means buggies have no real role. If you want combat, you pull a tank. If you want fast transportation, you pull an ATV. In PS they served the role of the alternate weaponry support along with Rexo rapid transportation and a low-tech vehicle. It had a niche. That niche has been eroded.

[Talek Krell]

Originally Posted by Graywolves

1 - light armored infantry classes can use vehicles - there isn't a "pilot" class, each vehicle have cert trees that are commensurate to the infantry trees.

First question I asked Higby on reddit

I've read that. "light armored" sounds like agile to me. You're thinking he meant anything below a max?

[FIREk]

Originally Posted by ThGlump

Ok then whats the point of rolling buggy? You need two times more ppl to operate it than a tank, and even then you will be weaker than one man tank. Put two people in the tank and you can scratch buggies from the game which will be sad (they dont have even tech advantage now, as tech benefit from bases is not in game yet - i hope it will be there in the end). Its all that 1 man tank army thats ruining possibilities of buggies.

I still desperately hope they will go the "driver controls secondary turret only" route...

Also, if buggies had serious firepower (though with a different gameplay style), they would have a niche among players who prefer a different playstyle - faster, more risky and more exciting. If buggies had the most powerful AA around (like the Skyguard has now), they would not only find themselves a niche - they would be useful and needed on the battlefield.

[Malorn]

I like the idea of buggies being fast, low-survivability but high-firepower 2-man vehicles. They should also be cheap resource-wise. And by high-firepower I mean a bit more powerful than the equivalent weaponry on a tank.

That gives them the role of being specialized support for tanks and for rapid advancement, either AA, or AV, or AI, or some mix.

[Talek Krell]

You know, given their crazy low survivability I don't think I'd entirely object to buggies having firepower equivalent or superior to tanks.

[NapalmEnima]

I suspect buggies will be Much Better at climbing than tanks, and depending on the terrain, that could be a Huge Advantage. Or simply a requirement to get there on the ground.

I doubt MBTs will fit in the back of a Galaxy.

I suspect they'll be much easier to cert in. Time and/or resource wise. In fact, buggies might be a requirement to get to the heavier vehicles.

We Just Don't Know.

[Malorn]

The glass cannon archetype is quite classic. Like Afghanis in the 80's with grenade launchers mounted on the back of a pickup. It can't take a hit, but its more maneuverable than the soviet tank and can still take it out by hitting it where the armor is weakest. And its dirt cheap by comparison.

It could have a nice parallel in PS2 in the form of buggies.

I hope buggies have more of a role than just specialized glass cannons though. I'd also like to see them take more than a few hits before blowing up. Low survivability is one thing but it shouldn't be a coffin on wheels.