Balancing Factor: Resource Storage Limit

[Malorn]

From reading this thread I think it's obvious that not enough resource information has been presented for the general PS2 fans to have a firm understanding of how it works. Having a discussion about a cap or no cap is an exercise in frustration when the people having the discussion don't know how the system works and thus can't understand the true impact of having or not having a cap.

I know Sirisian and myself have been watching every word about resources intently and have a firm understanding of it, but I'm not sure how many others do.

I hope we get a Territory Control week sometime soon that explains the basic mechanics of how territory control works at a micro and macro level and then following that a Resources week where all the resources are described, how they're used, how players interact with resources, and how they are acquired. Territory Control and Resources appear to be the largest source of confusion about the game.

[NewSith]

Originally Posted by Malorn

From reading this thread I think it's obvious that not enough resource information has been presented for the general PS2 fans to have a firm understanding of how it works. Having a discussion about a cap or no cap is an exercise in frustration when the people having the discussion don't know how the system works and thus can't understand the true impact of having or not having a cap.

I know Sirisian and myself have been watching every word about resources intently and have a firm understanding of it, but I'm not sure how many others do.

I hope we get a Territory Control week sometime soon that explains the basic mechanics of how territory control works at a micro and macro level and then following that a Resources week where all the resources are described, how they're used, how players interact with resources, and how they are acquired. Territory Control and Resources appear to be the largest source of confusion about the game.

The question of the cap is rather simple - AFK farmers or not.

Because AFK farmers are not bad at all, especially considering we will most likely not have means to transfer resources between players, if they do not affect anything but their own resource gain.

HOWEVER... it is assumed that without the sancs to be afk in, those AFK farmers, putting something heavy on "move forward" button will not let people who actually wanna play in.

[Malorn]

Originally Posted by NewSith

The question of the cap is rather simple - AFK farmers or not.

Because AFK farmers are not bad at all, especially considering we will most likely not have means to transfer resources between players, if they do not affect anything but their own resource gain.

HOWEVER... it is assumed that without the sancs to be afk in, those AFK farmers, putting something heavy on "move forward" button will not let people who actually wanna play in.

Thank you for illustrating my point that lack of understanding leads to erroneous conclusions.

It's far more than just AFK farmers. You can read my previous posts in this thread and Sirisian's for more details.

[NewSith]

Originally Posted by Malorn

Thank you for illustrating my point that lack of understanding leads to erroneous conclusions.

It's far more than just AFK farmers. You can read my previous posts in this thread and Sirisian's for more details.

We know that you accumulate resources over time (over time as in time passes and you get it, not exactly 2auraxium per second, for that is still rather unclear), independently of your activities. This means you can go afk and still gain resources. That's not lacking knowledge nor understanding. Everything else is, sure.

Also, I assure you that I read every post in a thread I create, so please, refrain from aggressive "goreaditordontpost" comments.

[Soothsayer]

I've been keeping track of resource stuff and I think that there's some misinformation from everybody.

A glaring omission that I'm seeing in this thread is the lack of talk of resources being used to further character development, which was an early feature of the information we received about resources. My understanding was character development could be progressed for a one time, high cost expenditure for unlimited, free use of any specific sidegrade. If you don't go that route, then you spend a very small amount each time you spawn with that sidegrade.

So my comments were in the context of that system being something that would be considered by a person who was determining what to spend their resources on next. That system is also (as I understand) the reason why Higby would say that you will never be in the position as to have so many resources you don't know what to do with them.

As for illegal RMT, give the community tools to self-police themselves or at least make it easy to report any sort of ingame advertising, punish the buyer and the seller. SOE is taking cues from EVE Online with the skill system, they could stand to learn from EVE Online when it come to combatting RMT.

Every single piece of Auraxium that a player buys from a gold farmer is equivalent to a portion of a station buck, they're going to care a whole lot more about illegitimate trading than other (non-F2P) MMO studios.

[Tasorin]

I would actually be in favor of a combination Soft Cap and Hard Cap. Think of it this way. You generate resources at normal rates until you hit the Soft Cap. The total numerical amount of resources acquired when you hit the Soft Cap would support the game mechanic concept of "Never having enough resources to not know what to do with..." Now you are at the Soft Cap level and are still receiving a mod/high diminishing return on your resource pull until you hit the Hard Cap.

At that point you would have enough resources to support some crazy 6 hour mega session of whipping out shit left and right while burning your resources back down to well below the Soft Cap. Think of it like a Resource Alpha Strike and something to try and save up for in order to go on a massive load out burn.

Notice this was all conceptual. We don't know how the resource placement/types will play out, the ratio of resource burn for what ever you are purchasing, the rate at which resources are gained and what resource value is "more then you will ever spend on a very long day of playing..."

Once Higgles recently made the announcement about the "types of categories you can expect in the shop are X,Y and Z and this is what will acquire them..." The discussions and game mechanics about resources is more important then ever.

[Xyntech]

I think some confusion may stem from the fact that some things require purchasing in more than one way.

For example, if I want to use a grenade launcher attachment for my rifle, I may have to spend cert point to unlock that option. Cert points are gained by leveling up through gameplay, and from what I have gathered will probably be more like Tribes Ascends experience system than PS1's cert system.

Now that I have spent those cert points (or payed real money in the cash shop), I never have to unlock that grenade launcher attachment again. It is always unlocked.

However if I actually want to USE it, I may have to pay some resources. Resources don't unlock things, they allow you access to things.

It's been mentioned several times already, but the tech plant/MBT example from the first game is really the closest analogy we have. It's like a much more varied version of that, with more variables in the form of different resources and a lot more equipment that requires them.

Bottom line though, this system will still be significantly different from PS1 and the tech plants. Losing a resource will not instantly deny you access to specific equipment, although depending on how it is balanced you may lose access shortly after.

We know resources will be used to incentivise capturing or defending specific territory. We know that we will never have more than we know what to do with of any given resource. All of this indicates not only that there will be some sort of cap or other limiting factor, but that such a limit is essential to balancing the game model they are developing.

Obviously until we get our hands on beta, the devs will always know better than us. I have enough trust that they will get the system pretty close to where it needs to be, since this is much more of an economic side of the game than a skill based gameplay side which can be harder to get right without real world testing.

The only reason I hope for something like a soft cap is that it can still be easily just as balanced as a hard cap, while being potentially much more dynamic and interesting. In my experience, having a more dynamic system makes things more fun and interesting in most situations. I want Planetside 2 to be easy to get into and mess around with for new players, but as deep as possible for those who want to put the time in.

[Soothsayer]

Uh oh, another understanding of how it works. I agree, we need a territory control themed week

Not to confuse any points I may have made earlier, but given that it was said early on that you could spend a year training up all of the aspects on a single vehicle and also still going on the notion that some type of resource can be put towards increasing skills, I'm hopeful that the reason that you won't have so many resources that you don't know what to do with them is because of the sheer multitude of options available for spending them as opposed to personal resource scarcity.

Wouldn't that be more fun?