Theory: Bullet drop

[NapalmEnima]

IIRC, the devs have mentioned that bullets will drop a la the PS1 wall turrets. This dash of added realism is great.

(No kids. Real Life Bullets do not travel in a straight line. If it has mass, it it affected by gravity. Period. Fucking. Dot.)

However, I suspect the Vanu-specific weapons will be free of such petty constraints. Gravity? Bah... a minor inconvenience.

The tank weapons already demonstrated this in PS1. The VS came out on the bottom of the DPS list on that one, but VS tanks' main gun makes for decent AA, so I'm certainly not complaining.

Pretty much the opposite of the man-portable AV weapons. I suspect this was not a coincidence. The lancer's DPS is king, but it's pretty much awful at AA. It's amazing what that little charge time at the beginning does to your aim.

[Ridill]

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

IIRC, the devs have mentioned that bullets will drop a la the PS1 wall turrets. This dash of added realism is great.

(No kids. Real Life Bullets do not travel in a straight line. If it has mass, it it affected by gravity. Period. Fucking. Dot.)

However, I suspect the Vanu-specific weapons will be free of such petty constraints. Gravity? Bah... a minor inconvenience.

No kids. Light does not travel in a straight line. It is affected by the curvature of space and time. Ever heard of Einstein??? Period. Fucking. Dot.

[Sirisian]

I too am excited for the bullet drop. Gunning wall turrets felt awesome when you had to compensate for gravity.

However, I hope that the VS energy weapons are affected by it just like every other weapon in the game. Even the magrider cannon should drop a little bit, just not as much as a tank shell.

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

Pretty much the opposite of the man-portable AV weapons. I suspect this was not a coincidence. The lancer's DPS is king, but it's pretty much awful at AA. It's amazing what that little charge time at the beginning does to your aim.

I find it really easy to hit a plane with the lancer. I usually land every shot. It's designed perfectly so it takes like 1 extra round forcing you to reload.

[FriendlyFire]

Make VS bullets drop and put their damage on par with the other Empires... or keep it how it is with no bullet drop. Either way NC and TR would cry if it is similar to the way it is now. /crossingfingers for some type of equally balanced system.

[Quovatis]

I want the Coriolis force implemented too. Of course it would be different depending on each planet you are on, assuming they have different rotation rates. /nerd

[NewSith]

Wind and atmospheric pressure and grass that affects trajectory... How could you forget that.






tl;dr: I'm sceptic.

[Sovereign]

Originally Posted by Quovatis

I want the Coriolis force implemented too. Of course it would be different depending on each planet you are on, assuming they have different rotation rates. /nerd

You do realize that its caused by the rotation of the planet and the inertia of the mass experiencing the effect?

Thus it can only come into play if it were in fact calculating the trajectories of very long-range shots like artillery if such artillery will even exist in the game that would mirror that of real life parallels such as the Paris gun. So in order to even layout a proper trajectory the person using the long range gun that will be effected will have to employ imprinting this into their mind:

Not sure they will have such in depth weaponry that could potentially be fired at bases in other neighboring continents. Would be an interesting point of development in game and could prove to be a neat feature but I doubt it.

[Rbstr]

Bullet drop is fine, as long as they don't over do it. If we've got to aim above heads at 50m, we've got problems.
And VS weapons being immune is fine too, none of them should be at such a long range it matters terribly much, except something like a lancer. And it's not like other AV weapons won't have tracking of some sort.
A deci equivelent should have BC2 rpg/gustav like drop IMO.

The place drop should really matter is sniper at longer ranges and tank shells.
But tank shells should be faster than they were so the arc is a bit less prominent than it was.

[Sirisian]

Originally Posted by NewSith

Wind and atmospheric pressure and grass that affects trajectory... How could you forget that.

That would be interesting if the grass reflected the wind direction and strength for a long range shots. I might actually like that. then for places without grass you could offer an implant that displayed visually the direction and wind speed.

I personally love slow moving rounds where you feel the distance every round travels and are forced to lead targets. This is in stark contrast to people that prefer raycasted bullets with no travel time. Not to mention with slow rounds from a distance people see bullets whizzing around them as shots miss.

[NapalmEnima]

Originally Posted by Ridill

No kids. Light does not travel in a straight line. It is affected by the curvature of space and time. Ever heard of Einstein??? Period. Fucking. Dot.

Who said anything about light, Luddite? The weaponry of the Vanu are far beyond your ken.

PS: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to measure the deflection caused by gravity across the effective range using a micrometer.

Oh hell, lets do some math.
1) The speed of light is 3,000,000 miles per second (give or take). Three Million miles per second.

2) The effective range of weaponry in PS2 is likely to be similar to PS1. Lets assume 200 yards.

So it takes light... 3.8 x 10-8 seconds to travel that far.

At 32ft/sec/sec (also ass-u-me-ing that gravity on Auraxis is similar to Earth's):
Light will drop...
1.22 x 10-6 feet
or
0.014... THOUSANDTHS of an inch. (and that number's way too big, it assumes a constant velocity of 32 feet per second, which would clearly not be the case. It takes a full second to reach 32 ft/sec. Light will have only had 3.8 x 10-8 (0.000000038 seconds) to fall. Sadly, I don't recall that particular equation from physics class All Those Years Ago.)

Nope, can't measure that with a micrometer. Micrometers are capable of measuring 1/1000 of an inch. You'd need a device that was over 60 times more accurate to measure 1/60,000 of an inch.

PPS: I'm pretty sure you were kidding. Sadly your post lacked humor and needed to be curb-stomped.


PPPS: Unless PS2's engagement range is Vastly Expanded, Real World bullet drop won't matter all that much either.

A modern assault rifle could reasonably expect a muzzle velocity in excess of 2000ft/sec. Given that same 200 yard range, it'll take a bullet... 3/10 of a second to cross that distance. Given our 32ft/sec/sec, the bullet will have accelerated to around 10 feet/sec in that time. Cheating the math again, that put the total distance traveled at... 3 feet. Yep, you'd notice that, big time. "Big head" shot turns into "little head" shot. OUCH.

[Peacemaker]

Aiming at center mast with most modern rifle rounds will hit center mast out to 300 yards. Most rounds start to drop off rapidly after 500 but you do have to aim a little high at 400 yards to keep that center mast shot. A .30-06 round needs about a foot and a half of lift to strike a target at 400 yards for example. Depending on what kind of average engagement ranges we will see in this game it should be acceptable.

If however the norm of engagement is > 200 meters perhaps the drop rate SHOULD be increased. Make it a direct correlation to what I have just said, so for example at 200 yards you would have to hold a little high.

[NapalmEnima]

Originally Posted by Rbstr

Bullet drop is fine, as long as they don't over do it. If we've got to aim above heads at 50m, we've got problems.

Err. You and physics don't get along, do you?

When siting in a scope, you site it in for a particular range. 50 yards, 100 yards, 500 yards, whatever. You aim the scope for where the bullet will hit at that distance.

Sites intended for use at Long Range also tend to have distances marked on them. That's where the bullet will hit at those ranges. Aim with the correct cross-hair, and you're golden.

[Sirisian]

Originally Posted by Peacemaker

Aiming at center mast with most modern rifle rounds will hit center mast out to 300 yards. Most rounds start to drop off rapidly after 500 but you do have to aim a little high at 400 yards to keep that center mast shot. A .30-06 round needs about a foot and a half of lift to strike a target at 400 yards for example. Depending on what kind of average engagement ranges we will see in this game it should be acceptable.

If however the norm of engagement is > 200 meters perhaps the drop rate SHOULD be increased. Make it a direct correlation to what I have just said, so for example at 200 yards you would have to hold a little high.

Auraxis has thick air and more gravity than Earth. Use your imagination. Dropping similar to the wall turrets would be fine by me.

[Furret]

Originally Posted by NapalmEnima

Who said anything about light, Luddite? The weaponry of the Vanu are far beyond your ken.

PS: I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to measure the deflection caused by gravity across the effective range using a micrometer.

Oh hell, lets do some math.
1) The speed of light is 3,000,000 miles per second (give or take). Three Million miles per second.

2) The effective range of weaponry in PS2 is likely to be similar to PS1. Lets assume 200 yards.

So it takes light... 3.8 x 10-8 seconds to travel that far.

At 32ft/sec/sec (also ass-u-me-ing that gravity on Auraxis is similar to Earth's):
Light will drop...
1.22 x 10-6 feet
or
0.014... THOUSANDTHS of an inch. (and that number's way too big, it assumes a constant velocity of 32 feet per second, which would clearly not be the case. It takes a full second to reach 32 ft/sec. Light will have only had 3.8 x 10-8 (0.000000038 seconds) to fall. Sadly, I don't recall that particular equation from physics class All Those Years Ago.)

Nope, can't measure that with a micrometer. Micrometers are capable of measuring 1/1000 of an inch. You'd need a device that was over 60 times more accurate to measure 1/60,000 of an inch.

PPS: I'm pretty sure you were kidding. Sadly your post lacked humor and needed to be curb-stomped.


PPPS: Unless PS2's engagement range is Vastly Expanded, Real World bullet drop won't matter all that much either.

A modern assault rifle could reasonably expect a muzzle velocity in excess of 2000ft/sec. Given that same 200 yard range, it'll take a bullet... 3/10 of a second to cross that distance. Given our 32ft/sec/sec, the bullet will have accelerated to around 10 feet/sec in that time. Cheating the math again, that put the total distance traveled at... 3 feet. Yep, you'd notice that, big time. "Big head" shot turns into "little head" shot. OUCH.

Why the hell would you use the American system to calculate all that shit.

Metric would've been a hell of a lot easier.

c = 3x10^8 m/s
g = 9.8 m/s^2
x = 200 m

t = x/c
t = 6.67 x 10^-7 seconds

s = v0t + .5at^2 where s is bullet drop, v0 is initial velocity in the Y axis (0), t is the time allotted, and a is the acceleration. Units are in brackets.

s = 0{m/s}(6.67 x 10^-7){s} + 4.9{m/s^2}(4.44 x 10^-13){s^2}

s = 2.18 x 10^-12 m, or 2.18 picometers

I think it's safe to assume 2.18 picometers will not make the difference between your shot hitting or missing your target.

[NewSith]

Originally Posted by IDukeNukeml

Also, in terms of realism... Bullets do not go "((" Boom -------_______"))"

They go "((" Boom _____-----______
____3600 Meters MAXIMUM"))" m16a2

More like ((" Boom __-----___________

To all who doubt it: What we name a recoil is the exact effect of bullet acceleration.